大象传媒

Sound judgment has prevailed, let those who wish to be separate continue to build their little bit of fantasy world in their own minds, and those who are against any kind of segregation live in harmony with those who feel the same way.

The nationalists will be so pleased. It'll give them a chance to moan and groan how hard done people in West Penwith, Wales, and Spain, (which are the nationalist "strongholds") are by the change, another example of their oppression.

Meanwhile people in Saltash and Playmouth, a most natural constituency to anyone with a sense of proportion and/or geography, will carry on regardless.

It makes you think though, if the hunger strike was taken to its ultimate conclusion, would that have made a difference to the vote?

No.

And with that a thousand years of political history down the pan, and all because the government decided that the UK needs a specific number of MPs. The ramifications for democracy that the loss in MPs will have is lost on Westminster, as is the fact that centrally deciding the number of MPs is top down and goes against the bottom up rhetoric of the coaliton. In other words London has spoken, we will have less representation, they will decide on what terms and the Tamar means less than the Amazon to these public school boys.

"..And with that a thousand years of political history down the pan.."

Rather a shame it is so limited and not something more akin to what is happening in Egypt, up the revolution, power to the people.

Like this matters in the grand scheme of things they are still the least amongst us, fiddling whilst Britain goes to the dogs

Rob wrote:
鈥淎nd with that a thousand years of political history down the pan鈥�

And for the majority of the people of Cornwall, they didn鈥檛 know or even care.

That leaves the few with something more to moan about and something to bolster their hobby.

All adds to the elusion and intrigue to encourage people to holiday in sunny Cornwall.

Your headline to your post is incorrect, Mr Smith.
Cornwall and Scilly have NOT 'finally lost their political border'.
None of what you appear to be unprofessionally and non-impartially wishing for is on the statute books nor yet determined by the Boundary Commission.
There's many a slip twixt cup and lip.
You know THAT to be true.
The mention of dogs by 'Saltashgaz' prompts this additional question - are all the UK rabies bio-defences in order? It seems that they may not be fully functional. You might like to check...

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I think you will find that the change is inevitable becuse of the constituency sizes proposed for the boundry changes. It is this which will decide the final boundries, with the boundry commission simple ratifying what we already know to be true. Either you are bloody naive or YOUR political bias is showing

Historically, Cornwall was accorded the same status as Wales and Scotland. It is this fact that has allowed it to develop and maintain is unique cultural and social distinctiveness, which is now being stripped from us for 'political' reasons. Where were our MP's when this was happening?

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The only pertinent fact to this debate is a political border is going to cross an English county boundary, if you do not believe in the English county system and opt for magical kingdoms then I am unclear as to what you think has changed

How about Cornwall having five instead of six MPs? The constituencies could all then be entirely within Cornwall. Surely no one believes that having six does us any good?

Nothing has changed. The Tamar still flows.

BofanE - the proposal of 5 MPs for Cornwall & Scilly was made by Cornish MPs and Cornish Lords in both the House of Commons and the House of Lords.
Deaf ears + blinkered vision + lack of comprehension up there in power differential abusing London.

This inward way of looking is no good at all, 5 within the county and 1 bridging two counties will just be fine for now. MPs speak up for us yes, but they also have a say in the running of the whole of the country, thinking that MPs elected in Cornwall are here just to look after Cornish issues is so far from the truth.

Why do you have such severe difficulty with accepting the right to cohesive, integrated and focused parliamentary representation for Cornwall & Scilly, youngcornwall? Surely respecting that fair entitlement is within your heart?
In any case there are legal differences and impediments to an MP simultaneously representing the Duchy of Cornwall and a part of England.
Few people would have difficulty recognising the wider functions and responsibilities of MPs that you have put - but it is perhaps more logical and rational to consider and argue that that can be better done by MPs who are thoroughly familiar with the identity, culture and aspirations of the unique and special places they represent - wherever those might be.
Cornwall is not in England - England is not in Cornwall.

I'd still be interested in knowing where Rob gets this idea of "a thousand years of political history down the pan," from.

Why does a slight change of a constituency boundary, mean that history goes down the pan?

I wonder why some people have a problem understanding that only a miniscule amount of Cornish people have any "problem" with a Parliamentary constituency that straddles the Tamar? Or that the "support" for the "Cornwall is not England" mob is so small as to be near to the molecular level?

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One has to wonder at the concerted effort some people devote to attempting to discredit something that has such small, "molecular level", support?

A maximum of 500 turned out for the Devon-wall protest, and I would imagine a lot of those just turned up to the see who it was and what makes someone tick, to go on hunger strike.

It is understandable that they will fall back on their old argument that "Cornwall is not England" we all know we do not have a Queen of England, so any County in the Country can say the same if they wish to do so.

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I would only wish those who wish to personalise, would stay to the topic that has been put before us please, this baiting to encourage others to lower their standards is off putting, and does nothing to move this topic forward, thank you in anticipation.

Use of the words "minescule" and "molecular" seems to struck a chord. They are the closest words I can think of to describe the "support" the "Cornwall is not England" "groups" receive. The "Cornwall has alway been in England" majority take it for granted that our written history is correct and not polluted with myth and fable.

Use of the words "minescule" and "electron' seems to have struck a chord. They are the closest words one can think of to describe the "support" the "Cornwall is in England" "youngcornwall/Slimslad/Dave the rave/Saltashgaz' 4in1 consortium receive. The "Cornwall has alway been in England" minority take it for granted that our anglo-centris history books are correct when, in fact, they are polluted with myth and fable.

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Looking back it must have been a bit of a bitter pill to take, the acceptance that 鈥淐ornwall finally loses its political boundary鈥� Not one for rubbing salt into the matter, I feel this topic is heading into a direction of decay, guided by those form the other forum.

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I wonder how long it will be before this matter is forgotten, and it is assumed to be natural right and proper that those of us living in Saltash, who work and shop and use services in Plymouth have an MP who represents the area we consider our natural community?

Yes this is the real world Dave, for those who live in the fantasy world it can be a bitter pill to take, never the less they will get over it, what other alternative is there for them, only to do what they are best at, and that is moaning.

I think it will all be soon for got Young Cornwall.

After all the "protest", even using the grossly inflated "500 attendance" figure (in reality more like 300 attended,)then it only managed to activate and attract 3% of the population of Saltash, or 0.1% of the population of Cornwall, or 0.06% of the population of Cornwall and Plymouth combined.

So from that low level of interest it cannot be long before the memory fades to nothing.

Meanwhile here in Saltash most I speak to are either not concerned in the slightest about the change, or are very keen for it to go ahead.

Dave the rave wrote:-
"I wonder how long it will be before this matter is forgotten, and it is assumed to be natural right and proper that those of us living in Saltash, who work and shop and use services in Plymouth have an MP who represents the area we consider our natural community?"

The same argument could be used to back a United Ireland, with the amount of cross border commerce that goes on.
And that is a fabricated border, unlike the Cornish/English one.

"And that is a fabricated border, unlike the Cornish/English one."

928- King Athelstan subdues the Cornish, and sets the border of Cornwall at the River Tamar.

Slimslad wrote:-
"928- King Athelstan subdues the Cornish, and sets the border of Cornwall at the River Tamar."

Yes, between the Cornish in Cornwall, and the English in England/Wessex, unlike the fabricated border between the Irish and the Irish.

鈥�928- King Athelstan subdues the Cornish, and sets the border of Cornwall at the River Tamar鈥�

And plenty of water has flowed along the Tamar since then. But over the years there have been numerous changes to county boundaries, who say the boundary that separates the county of Devon from the county of Cornwall will never change.

The big difference between 鈥�928- King Athelstan鈥� and today, we are all one people, if the border was first set to keep the Cornish in, it hasn鈥檛 been very successful
has it LOL.

County borders are a man made construct, in reality they exist only in the minds of men. They are useful only for demographic, bureaucratic and statistical purposes. There is no difference between a baby born in Plymouth and one born in Saltash that can be measured in terms of "Englshness" and "Cornishness".

The difference is, Dave the rave, that the border between England and The Celtic Nation and Duchy of Cornwall is NOT a border between counties of England.

Your logic (such as it is), of course, extrapolates and is applicable to borders between nation states - try telling the Israelis and Palestinians and even all the countries of Europe that borders 'exist only in the minds of men' (and women) and are 'useful only for demographic, bureaucratic and statistical purposes'. Such borders certainly arise in 'the minds of men' (and women) but they also manifest in and impact upon daily reality in a multitude of ways and form the territorial, cultural and orientational building blocks on which we build our notion of what it is to be human beings in all our diversity and commonality.

The fact that you cannot distinguish the difference between the constintituency borders of electoral buroughs of the counties of Deven and Cornwall, and equate them with actual country borders of places with war going on, is really not my problem, but yours.

Never mind, as I say above, for the vast majority of the citizens of both counties this storm in a tea cup wil soon pass and be forgotten.

Those of us actually affected by the change (or rather not really affected by the change as we see it as a good thing, ) will carry on regardless. Our MP will have some say in the needs and issues of Plymouth. We welcome that as we are very natuarally aligned with the city as we use it's facilities and services as much as any who live there.

The obsessions of a samll clique who have nothing to gain or lose by these changes will fade, or more likely be redirected to other issues.

That the issues of Israel and Palestine come even close to Cornwall and Devon?
Who are these people?

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