大象传媒

It's a practical issue which demands a practical answer. Good for Ken, sometimes nuts but prepared to speak out, and speak out for the city he represents.

Concentrate on future illegal immigration, accept that some in the past got away (and are not going to get caught), legitimise them, draw them into the legal economy, and accept that on the whole most of us have done very well out of their visit.

We will do even better once they pay taxes, their employers pay NI and subscribe to basic employee rights (including the minimum wage), and a level playing field with lower-paid British-born workers is established.

Those who don't choose to join the legal economy within the allotted period will lose the chance.

Let's do it !

surely at time when you read articles on this site . i wonder what sense of brains that people have . well for those who think the illegal immigrants are bad they should think of what we have done for you . imagine if there was a away all these people woke up and decided to go home all the old people will die , hospitals will be empty , there fore it is important to think of the economic basis than taking things personal we all know that immigrants are needed thanks

I believe that british hospility will not be mixed with anger or hate.
If they come here work pay the taxes ,bills what's wrong with it?
Can you imagine yourself five -six or more yrs away from your family and friends,abused by anyone just because you haven't got the right to work?All this big difference for a piece of paper!!!on the 21st century!
We have seen Italy, Spain, Greece and recently France and USA granting amnesty so why is it such a big issue for Uk which actually is more protected than these countries.

Ken has always lived in cloud cuckoo land ,how many illegals are wanted at home for crime[not political] he always was a fool as he proved with his support for the I.R.A. when they were in the process of bombing Britain.

Ken has always lived in cloud cuckoo land ,how many illegals are wanted at home for crime[not political] he always was a fool as he proved with his support for the I.R.A. when they were in the process of bombing Britain.

hi dear sir/madam,
i m an immigrant as well i agree with Ken and i think there is too much binefit to country from amnesty because if they work illegal first they dont pay tax 2nd they think allways wrong thing for example thay think how they can come ligal and meet with dangers peole who make these things and one day they are same as that dangers person because they know that way one day thay lose 2nd day they catch some one alss same as him or her and when they come in deficulty they do wath ever it is for doctor , bank, work,driving, and more what ever comes in life one day they forget they are ligal or illegal every one knows 100`s of people in normal life in london or uk who are honest, working, and business man but they are illegal they dont pay tax they like to pay tax but if they pay tax or show his or her name immegration will catch them and tobe honesst they are not happy for this they some time laghp and say we don`t know we are stoped or home office menister and some they cray for it i dont want to talk too much i tell you every thing is poseble in this country if you have money even you are illegal i say don`t live them to do wrong thing befor that bring the amnesty and let them work and pay tax thay know about the country life now they can work and this is the best way for them and country thanks for your time to read it sorry for poor english.

your friend Saljuqi

i totally agree with tayo,without the imagrints this countrys nothing, take education for example, these people get top grades and do a lot better than most british students..the reason for that is because they want to do become somthing in life, they all have dreams and goals, just think about it, they're doing this to help YOUR country. majority of these people havent seen their relatives for years and are fighting to become legal because they want to! they all want to live a normal life and pay taxes and work like a british citizin fot this country. Half the crime caused in this country is by your own BRITISH CITIZINS!I have a read a few comments and all i have to say is think about these people, about the ones who have given birth to children in this country, and whose children should be called BRITISH!but they are being forced to leave the country and be moved to a place where their future is at stake! most of the children go to school and are doing really good! so all i can say is just think about these people before you talk,bcause you wundnt want anything hapening to your family!I respect Ken for the decision he's made and i hope its granted!

Tayo wrote: "...its your people that takes lil girls and rape them, is that not a big issue to your country, don't see anyone moan about that, without them immigrants doing all the dirty jobs that all you so called british wouldnt do, this country wouldn't be where it is today..."

Many pro-immigration people seem to have very distorted, and derogatory beliefs about British people - as in the above comment, which the author presumably feels fair, and an argument for immigration, and their personally acquiring British citizenship. And they don't seem able to understand that this is a major reason why British people are worried about some immigrants.

I think most of us feel that continuous waves of new arrivals have enriched this country in every way, and would wish that to continue (although people who believe themselves pure Celts may feel dfferently). I have friends in many other countries I would love to be able bring here, especially if things go pear-shaped there, and whose presence would have a positive effect - kind, hard-working, English-speaking - but the barriers we would face to do that legally are immense - no human should have to go through the hellhole that is the immigration department in Croydon, for example. But now there seem strong motivations that have potential for very different effect: ambitious religious and economic ones, anarchic, "smash borders and cultures" ones, and purely greedy desires that involve the doing down of those who have achieved protections for British working and underclasses. And they mostly see the majority of us as undeserving of our hard-won birthright, of tolerance, law, social provision, and common elements of culture.

So, Ken Livingstone thinks current immigration problems are solely due to the Tory party, and a nine-year old New Labour government is incompetent enough to still be feebly helpless to manage immigration (yet still fit to govern the country?), and all British people should be grateful to all the illegal immigrants who sneak in?

This is simply a party political broadcast, despicable in its distortions, and focusing on an issue of such importance to the UK that it should be above such party politics.

Plus, it is duplicitous in the extreme; the only British citizens who benefit from illegal immigration are the business exploiters who depend upon ever-cheaper labour to make larger profits. This distorts the British labour market with terrible consequences for VOTERs. Remember that, all you politicians, if the BNP gathers votes. Still, it will allow these exploiters to make large enough donations to New Labour to receive an 'ennobling' decoration or peerage.

After nine years the New Labour government should have been able to get a grip on immigration, even if the Tories had left it in its current state, never mind how it was nine years ago. New Labour have pointedly ignored information from diplomats and frontline civil servants; and the govt have only acknowledged this information when the truth of the situation has been confirmed by investigative news reports.

The current immigration problems are fully the responsibility of the New Labour government. That is what being in government for nine years means, Red Ken, you twit! What the Tories have been guilty of is being an ineffective Opposition party; and as Tories are incapable in Opposition they are seen as incapable of government, so the voters had little alternative but to vote for New Labour (which explains the extremely low voter turnout).

I say NO to an amnesty for illegal immigrants for the following reasons:

a) Managed immigration is supposed to benefit the UK; which means bringing in essential skills (short term, long term = training UK citizens) and keeping out criminals.

b) An amnesty simply encourages more illegal immigrants; it sends the message round the world 'stay in the UK long enough and you can be a citizen, whatever you do there'.

c) There is absolutely no way of telling who would be granted an amnesty, because if the govt knew who they were they should be repatriating them. Future illegal immigrants would simply say they had been in the UK when the amnesty was granted.

And so on..., for anyone who has a brain rather than some defective conscience which wants other people to bear the brunt of absolving their imaginary (and possibly racist?) social guilt.

I believe that Mr Ken Livingstone and Liam Byrne MP are reasonable individuals and on the right track into contemplating an amnesty. There are numerous reasons why it is a great idea. However, the main ones are to clear the backlog and have a fresh start in the Home Office. This would save a lot of time, money and energy on resources. The other is to give those who have been in the UK for such a period of time, in this instance, four years, to have a second chance in life for a better future. Moreover, I can fully understand the frustrations those applicants must be having while this backlog and long delay has been going on at the Home Office. There is no value in this delay, non beneficial at all to anyone or to the UK.

It is and can be extremely difficult and hard for someone to be living as an illegal immigrant. I am pretty sure no one likes to be an illegal immigrant but sometimes it is to do with one鈥檚 own circumstantial reason into becoming one. Consequently, they could miss out in seeing their families and friends in their home countries for years on end and suffer in silence. In addition to that, the remunerations they receive are meagre sums compared to at least having a dignified decent salary if they were legal. Some of these people are intelligent and well-qualified professionals and fair is fair. We only have one world and life is very short. Time is not on our side and yet they still can鈥檛 get on with their life and career after all these years of sacrifices.

In this world, what goes around comes around, that is a fact. Thus, be a little more generous and show some Christian charity and compassion by allowing such people the stability and freedom which eventually would be beneficial to the UK economy as a whole. The UK government and those in power have the ability to make this happen. So, why not do it, sooner rather than later.

I wish Liam Byrne MP and Mr Ken Livingstone all the very best and a great life ahead of them.

Jeremy

No amnesty should possibly be considered unless the govt takes a responsible attitude to the rights of its own citizens, to which it is ultimately accountable; it is not accountable to illegal immigrants, nor should it work for their interests against the interests of its own citizens (and voters). Conditions which must be met for any possible consideration of amnesty must include the following:

a) Those receiving the amnesty cannot vote until they 'come of age' ,ie, they have spent 18 years as non-voting UK citizens, and the same applies to their children. (Then we will see how enthusuastic some politicians are about granting an amnesty, which I suspect is motivated by the wish to get rid of an embarassing evidence of their incompetence, and to increase their voting support by offering the bribe of citizenship.)

b) That those who receive amnesty but commit, or are found to have committed, other criminal offences have their amnesty removed, and are re-patriated, to serve out gaol time in their homeland.

c) That no amnesty be granted until all those who are to receive it are identified, fingerprinted, and have their DNA taken to be held on police records. (They have committed a crime, after all; and many UK citizens who have committed no crimes have had their fingerprints and DNA taken by the police.)

d) Once the amnesty list is drawn up for consideration of amnesty no further names should be added to the list for any reason. Illegal immigrants who want amnesty have to come foreward immediately or remain illegal.

e) That employers who use cheap labour without valid proof of citizenship should be subject to criminal prosecution for aiding illegal immigrants. (This would reduce the encouragement for further illegal immigrants to enter the UK.)

f) Illegal immigrants should be checked against their country of origin to see if they have been guilty (or suspect) of violent criminal offences.

g) No amnesty to be granted until a provably working Immigration system and border control is in place.

These really are the minimum conditions that the govt should require to safeguard their own citizens. If they cannot do that then the politicians responsible for acting against the safety and interests of their own citizens should be named. We won't forget them.

I support an amnesty for the following simple reasons:
>It brings to surface the black economy which should enhance tax contribution and reduce exploitation
>In this day and age of terrorism it makes common sense to ensure the government is aware of every individual in the country. This is in the interest of our security as citizens. Some illegal immigrant with no prospects is more likely to be endeared by this ideology that perpetrates wanton destruction
>If we adopt the half million figure as a guide to the number of illegal immigrants in the country, how much resources would have to be committed to track down all these people and deport them? Staff, Airline costs, etc. Can we better use these resources?
>It allows the Home Office to start on a clean slate and avoid mistakes of yester year

i do not see it as a bad idea, we need to balance the fact that the economy is gaining from those illegal immigrant who enjoy working as responsible people while paying tax often in huge amout because the are charged wwith a BR rate,it is only fair to support these poeple to leave away from fear and become committed. who knows they may even do better the legal citizens

its a use of time now taling about an amnesty really coz all people see about this is that its not possible the system is not workable etc.

all the concerned organisations should one day decide to do a public appeal somehow with all the illegal immigrant population in the streets i bet there and then itself the home office lads would not be able to arrest even 50% of them.

and just to prove how tiny reid'd brain is who thinks it is inappropriate to secure borders 1st then give amnesty as this is the only way you can actually know how many people are here illegally. and if he can't get that into his head imagine what he would do if he were to become PM of this country.

immigratioin is such a big issue in the uk and unless and until they secure the borders and give those who are already present here others will keep on coming and nothing would stop them. and why are they arising the question that an amnesty will only attact more immigrants is it because you dont even trust your fellow immigration people?????????????

i am an immigrant myself... proud to say my people are not peodophiles nor frauds... and we certainly are not racist.....

I totally give my support to an amnesty for the following reasons.

Agreed that this people entered the country illegally, they have suffered for many years for doing the wrong thing, yet they have form part of the society in the sense that, though they work illegally, but they make positive contribution to the economy as a whole.

some people have been here for up to 10 years and yet they are still illegal, can you imagine what they would have been through, for someone to leave his family for the past 10 years and not able to see them just simply because they are illegal?

On the other hand, the government would be the loser, and those that are responsible for bringing in the illegal immigrant will be the winner and the profit maker. This is simply because, they would be paid to trade in black market, bringing people in, they have got nothing to lose, whereas the government will be responsible for tracking this people down, and if successful in tracking them down, would also be responsible for removing them from the country, which will cost a lot to do. As at the moment, the cost of removing one illegal immigrant stood at 11 thousand pounds per head, if you multiply that figure by five hundred thousands people, you know how much it will cost the government. Such money could be used to improve standard of Education, the fading NHS and to tackle crime. But until the government is brave enough and tackle this problem, the problem will remain the same.

The measures I would love to be introduced is, that the amnesty are called to drive those working in the black economy out of job, to grant individual between two to four years leave to stay in the UK without any entitlement to the public funds, and to monitor individual within this period that they do not commit any crime and after the initial period of two/four years they could then be granted indefinite stay to remain in the UK. Those years will be for them to contribute to the economy for entering the country illegally.

Finally I do hope the government would do the right thinking and do the right thing at the right time. By allowing them to stay. The country has nothing to lose but by not doing anything will contribute negatively not only to the economy of the country but will only give birth to more criminals. My reason is so simple, desperation can make people do anything.

Let the government admits that there is problem removing these people, do something about regularising them, and introduce tight border control that will make it difficult for other people to enter the country illegally.

The introduction of electronic border patrol is a good thing but this could only work if the problem within are resolved. This system will only work with new arrival to the country not with people that are already here who are not willing to leave the country.

Many thanks.

can anyone please say if they have heard anything about a new amnesty being put in place

i disagree with what some people are saying about not granting amnesty. its a good idea to grant amnesty because other countries like spain and america have done it before so why would UK be different.In Italy its done every 2years.when you check records, its the illegal immigrants that pay tax more because they dont want to get into trouble. most of these people are graduates from different fields especially in the IT sector and they cant do a proper job to take care of their families. the so-called people who are citizen dont bother about council tax and they engage themselves mostly in bank frauds because they know when they are caught, they either pay fine or be sent to jail and the benefits given to citizens here makes them lazy.In most cases men abuse girls that are illegal in the Uk and take advantage of their illegality.I dont need to talk too much about this but i feel the idea of granting illegal immigrants amnesty is good.

Amnesty!!! A very delicate issue but not as delicate as the lives of those ordinarilly innocent people who now are regarded as criminals or illegals for trying to make a living by using falsified documents as their only legitimate way.The psychological torture of a father who has only heard the voice of his wife and children over the phone for the past years without any hope of seeing them in the near future and the gratitude of the poor souls back in africa who were able to go to school because of the few 拢s sent from an uncle/aunty/brother/sister/father/mother/friend in the uk who do not really know their own fate but still do what is beleived to be the right thing ie work hard and contribute positively to the society.The argument that an Amnesty would fuel further illegal immigration is not really founded.I suggest border immigration control be tightened and those already here be identified and assimilated properly into the society.Biometric information as operates at US borders also be introduced.
Lastly,of the speculated 1/2 million illegals here only a tiny fraction are involved in dubious criminal activity and for all i care this ones are the bad eggs that need to be sent back home not to jail as that is already bursting.Please lets allow the Amnesty this once.

Not one of the above postings has explained to me the great mystery about legal or illegal asylum seekers. They have had to pass through several safe countries while fleeing from persecution but they have still made the UK their target destination. Dont say it's because of them wanting to learn English because many of them dont bother to do so and dont need to bother as all official forms are in dozens and dozens of native languages.Could some of the above posters answer my simple question. Roger,Twickenham

i do agree that there should be an amnesty which i believe will be a way forward towards lots of thins not just immigration

i totally 100% support the amnesty programme and will benefit the country

to be quite honest that is what Uk need at this time

Oh, that will be a very good one if tha will ever happen in the UK

What about legal migrants who struggle everytime renewing visas dont we deserve a permanent stay as well. I need an answer because I am a student nurse and I have been told I wont get a work permit anymore. I am a good nurse and have always worked hard since coming into this country. Where do i fit into all this?

Without Immigrants, UK would not have been far off rom Zimbabwe

i think amnesty for immigrants is not a bad idea at all. some people came in this country to supposingly find peace and live a better life, but not recognising them calling them all sorts of names is not the right things to do either. for some people the reasons for running away from their home country is due to war, atrocities and continuous insecurity. Running away from your home and trying to find another place on Earth to be able to live peacefully, well these people should be given a chance. Most of these immigrants legal or illegal are decent people, but they just fear that they won't be understood and sent back to their countries.From the experience they've had from their countries they find it difficult to believe that there are actually some laws and some honest people to protect them and allow them to live with peace of mind. but there are definitely some who doesn't deserve the help of the british government, especially those who doesn't work at all when they actually can and live off benefits and commit crimes. but the government is clever enough to divide the bad and the good.

Of course an amnesty is the right decision for the uk. There are illegal immigrants who have been key witnesses to crimes, but have not come forward due to the fear of being asked too many questions about their immigration status.
There are so many reasons that would benefit Britain, but however the government keeps scrapping the amnesty because of one main reason, benefits.
Well my argument is restrict the benefits for a certain period and allow them to work, except for some serious cases that may need benefits. There is always a way round anything, just give them the amnesty already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

surely half a million people cannot be responsible for crimes in the UK that has a population of 91 million. Are people just fishing for reasons to stop an amnesty? Many of the reasons I have seen are so inconclusive. Amnesty is the right way to go, the UK would never be like this if it wasn't for immigrants and it will keep getting better. Grant the amnesty, the Uk has nothing to lose but alot more to gain.

I am in full support of Amnesty. I think those who are against should stop with their stereotypical views and open up their eyes to the reality that this country is in a jam at the moment. It is indeed very costly and fraustrating to be renewing visas for work permit every few months and not to mention the anxiety of not knowing whether or not you will be granted more time in the country. Can you imagine why some people then hide away and remain in this country. Not for pleasure, i am sure,but for the hope of a brighter future. If something could be done under this present government to help the people who have come here seeking for a better way of life, not an easy way out, then by all means i say,'yes to amnesty'!

amnesty should please be granted as alot us have left home for long and have nothing to go back to even when we were back home we had nothing that was why we came here for a better life and we contrbute a lot to the growth of this econony we do all the and pay all the tax though we are illegal but we do all the jobs and the citzens just sit and use it up as benefit so please grant us stay and let us build the econony together in a free mind please.

I am compelled to speak on this issue as I daily think about the world as being available to all to wander and wonder!
Human beings are migrant by nature and it is only fair to accept that artificial barriers have been placed on humanity that frustrate genuine intentions to explore and return back to base.

We talk of migrant birds and I am stunned by the freedom birds have to move from hostile environments until conditions improve. Human being also have an inbuilt desire to flee hostility and frustrations in search of greener pastures. Without a doubt, because immigration laws are artificial, they are 'bursting at the seams'!

Where is the global village? Is it going to remain on the internet for ever? We must admit that the existing laws and means of border patrol and control are no longer efficient, effective or economical for anyone (within and without). We need a more robust system that is meaningful and conducive to all.

The longer we delay and debate, the more 'cancerous' the problem becomes. This does not have to be a monster let us sit down to talk and work through this. I am willing to offer time at looking into the issues and fostering solutions about where we are and where we want to be. I am sure there are people out there that can cast off any bias and explore opportunities for developing a more relevant and humane approach to cross border mobility starting from where we are.

I think that an amnesty is a good idea for those that are living here in the UK for a long time. If they have not done any harm to the community and have contributed to the community in any way it is about time they are recognised. please grant the amnesty as the Uk will benefit from it.

hiii, i thing amnsety not for all, its should be who deserve for example those living here for many years, and have no crime recored. they should be alowed...

Amnesty is a good word and a look in the right direction. I personally believe that the only way to eradicate poverty in the world most especially in Africa is by granting amnesty to immigrants legal or illegal. They no the problem at their places and could better solve it than all the NGO's calling for funds for different projects in Africa. If they can be this good with to our economy think of how better they would be when they start paying taxes, NI and other dues . Indeed they will make Greater Britain and bring Healing to African Poverty.

as australia is looking for immigrant and student are allowed to work full time in australia why begging the uk govt for visa or amnesty , we should think of leaving the uk for better quality of live and less struggle . sooner or later the uk will not have foreing student because they are to strict.we are willing to pay tax and contribute for the country and society but we are not welcome so we have other options like canada , australia , usa , malaysia so think.........

This would be a very good idea and it will do Uk a very big favour.
i am currently a student Occupational therapy and if this anmesty is approve it will a story to live to remember.

God bless you as you grant the amnesty.

the Uk will really benefit alot from this

i think this amnesty would be a very good idea and the country would really benefit from ot.

right now i am curently a student occupational therapy and this decision would really be a good thing for me and many other people.

I think the Amnesty if granted should also be considered for legal immigrants such as international students. They are law abiding people who have contributed to the economy by the tuition fees they pay to educate themselves and by paying taxes. They are also people with the potential to add to the knowledge economy.

I totally agree. We need to have an amnesty. Ken is a realistic man.

It will be very wise for the goverment to give both illegal and legal immigrant permanent visas, because if they can only give the illegal immigrants they will find themselves having the same problem next year, i totaly agree with the amnesty i thing is one of the best ideas to resolve this problem and start afresh, go on Britain you have nothing to lose but a lot to gain, after all this poeple are our friennds, collegues at work and they are most hard working poeple that i have ever seen

we need amnesty for every boby legal , illigal , student , dependant so we all together we can work and contribute for the uk economy and also this is the only way to discourage people from leaving the uk with their money to invest in other country .the only way to boost the uk economy is amnesty for everbody . ken is very clever .

I think its a great idea coz wen one is ilegal they will do wat ever it takes to make money including robery and even murder, we all know well enough the cost off leaving here and anywhere else...
amnesty means less crime...more money from taxes.
people seem to get the impression that every one wants benifits...illegals really want to better their future, thus they want to work/build the business emfastructure and all the great money and safety ajenders we constantly hear of.
no more night crauling..
no more drug dealing(that kills this generation and genarations to come...
there are many more benifits because some of these indivinduals are highly educated and intelectuals that just need a second chance to rectify the one wring choice which led to them being caught in that terrible lifeless, futureless,lonely loop...
Good on you Ken...for a change....

It is true that population is increasing, but it is also obvious that most immigrants have been helpful and relevant to the workforce of UK, though most of the immigrants could not officially work in highly paid job, but they still do not mind, they do as many maniac jobs as they can do which make them not to be a liabilty, instead they are economically valuable and worth a consideration for legal stay in UK. We can not claim that Ken decision is wrong, as we all know beyond reasonable doubt, immigrants have been helpful in contributing to recent increase in life expectancy in UK as healthcare sector and other workforce sectors have directly or indirectly benefitted from service provided by most of the immigrants. It will be great, if amnesty is granted, I will therefore conclude by saying British have done well for accepting immigrants, it has been helpful to many nations, therefore doing the final stage of the good act, is to grant amnesty to concern immigrants. Thanks to all.

Amnesty is all about helping people,, so why wouldn't it be a good idea to let the people in uk live and work honestly. Giving migrants the right to work ad live like human beings would solve so many problems.
The uk government is known to help other countries in economic difficulties to support human well being,,So why the Government can't HELP those who are already in its' country and been begging for help for years and years.The UK government wants to help others, then why not helping lots of migrants people in your own country who really needs it. They just want to be able to work and live a better life.

i dont think the government thinks in the right direction, i dont mean to be rude but take a look at the people without jobs and are british signing on while they have got the ability to work, on the other hand, the governemt give asylum seekers allowances for what? i dont know , when they can work and pay taxes, there are a lot of illegal immigrants in the uk wanting to work, working, and paying taxes, so why cant the governent for once turn their strong thick head backwards for once, and give these people permit to work, and make more money rather than waste millions of pounds every week paying wages for abled men and women illegal, asylum, etc for just sitting and looking or waiting for decisions on their cases, it all boils down to scientific way of racism.

I know a poet who speaks 6 exotic languages,living here in the UK for the last 10 years illegaly..
I want to see a smile on his face..
an amnesty is the right thing do ..
go for it..I'm positive about it ..
thanks.
Zoe

To be honest it would have been a wonderful idea if this is put into consideration or done in time becos people flee away from their country becos of sufferness right, and they are unable to claim assylum right from points of entry for one reason or the other. Believing that once they get into UK all will be well but it was on the other way round, even things was so much difficult for them to do. that will even give people way of bringing out their qualities and will contribute to this country positively than when chance was not given to them to let show their qualities. even the hard job in this country their own people are not ready to do it, 2002 - 2005 amnesty was put to order in SPAIN and today they are reaping it for good, success and improvement in their country and their economics. with all the resources they have in this country, even country that is not up to their level they are supporting the illegal immigrants in their mists not to talk of uk. the citizen of this country who call themselves british are eating the resources of this country the way they like and the people's contribution they used in paying them off they wouldnt want them to help them which is bad. the they have anything good to contribute to this country but all they do is using bad weapon, arassing people and molessing up and down. but the illegal immigrants before their coming to this country they have their missions for good and they will not rest until their mission is put to process. but they are not even ready to work since they know that they will definitely have some money given to them by the governments for job seeker allowance, incapacity allowance which makes them not to be even useful to theirself. but this illegal immigrants are just working and working to meets their needs so that cant even think of evil. like I had a baby, am a single mother but alot of things i cant do to my daughter or afford for her becos i dont have the right document. even to go looking for our daily need i do leave her alone for 2 hours to do a pety job so that we can eat and if none they will say they want to take the baby away from me but where they at all in support of those who they think are illegal immigrant who have baby to look after. even if the illegal immigrants is been considered today i as a person i dont even want any claims of sort from governments to support myself since i have my complete body to work with. i will never emphasis on wat benefits i need to claim. so far if i can work in a better company. how much benefits is been offered that if someone is working in a better company that you wont forget taking from government. like someone comments which says the government should think of the interest of the citizen first. but of which good are this citizen offering (NOTHING)anyway thanks to Mr Ken Livingstone and Liam Byrne MP for bringing and trying to so something good regarding this issue may God bless them.

" Hug an illegal immigrant today..
give her/him a sense of peace ..
show her/him that you care..
for she/or he is willing to contribute twice: 1- to this society by doing jobs you might not be willing to do and paying taxes ..
2-for she/he is going to be supporting a familly somewhere..maybe a child in africa
by sending some money to her/his relatives..
By giving an Amnesty to illegal immigrants we're in some form or shape supporting a good cause..people
have been stuck in here for 10 years without being able to see their parents and relatives..a portion of the money is going to get a child somewhere..that's a good reason on it's own ..if we believe in social justice we should consider an Amnesty for illegal immigrants ..get them out of the shade of illegality and give them a place in the sun of dignity as human beings...
Hug an illegal immigrant today..
give her/him a sense of peace..
show her/him that you care..
we're here and let's live in harmony and peace...
Zoe

Please remember that these illegal immigrants are human beings trying to earn their bread, fled their home and families. Has anyone tried to imagine for just few seconds how would they feel in that situation? I doubt it simply because we take so many things for granted. these people suffer a great deal being "sans papiers" psychologicaly they live in fear and suffer being away from their families. Amnesty yes, there are professionals amongst these people who could contribute to the country. Let be human and give a chance to those who needs it.

Amnesty for so called illegal immigrants is a long over due requirement in UK - if it were not for the incompetency of the new Labour administration. Even if Labour eniherited a nun-fuctional Home Office from Tory, they have had 10 years to sort that out but because of the continued personal interference of Blair and his psycophants the situation is worse now than ever before.

Giving amnesty would help free resources to concentrate on enforcing entry and crime controls. It would also create prison room for danderous convicts and reap taxes for the nation

"If not NOW, when? "
an amnesty is long overdue..
Now.
thanks

I live in Eastbourne . I only hear eastern european voices around me.
this would be fine if their culture was mine. I do not feel this is so but would love to be proved wrong

I live in Eastbourne . I only hear eastern european voices around me.
this would be fine if their culture was mine. I do not feel this is so but would love to be proved wrong

this message is for roger in twickenham...........

you just proved how ignorant you are of the facts here on this forum...

who in God's name told you that immigrants come travelling from country to country only....

you have missed out on a lot my friend.........

and again this proves that only people who choose to be ignorant on an issue such as amnesty are often the ones who go against it...... please change your minds because in our eyes your value is not great... immigrants who come to this country are mostly bilingual... if the english system had consired their values and employed them believe me it would be much more than you can handle.

and one last thing i want to know- are these post really read by anyone concerned because if they do i think it really is a campaign here as we are thousands who wwould vote for an amnesty and we want our ideas our hopes to be taken into consideration.

Illegal is the thing. My estranged husband told me he was a student and we married on that basis. The truth of it was that he was an illegal immigrant i still dont know how he got in the country. He ran up bills under false ID. Get into trouble with the police again under a false ID. Nothing can be linked to him officially. Stop and think WHY ARE THESE PEOPLE ILLEGAL!!. There is a reason why people dont enter the country legally. They are con artists after a bit of free treatment on the NHS who are untraceable and live above the law. Beware my ex-husband could be using your ID details as we speak.....

tony blair has got one last chance to consider an amnesty for illegal immigrants before being kicked out
from number 10 ...all what he's good at is waging illeagal war at other sovreign nations ..it's a shame that 10 years in office wasn't long enough for him to sort out the backlog of illegak immigrants..and there's only one way to do it: an Amnesty right Now for all the good reasons..
hey Tony: You're fired, they're hired !
Amnesty Now !
Thanks.

now is the right time for an amnesty.it's long overdue.i am an illegal immigrant and have lived here for 12yrs.i want to live right and am tired of being restricted.i would really benefit from an amnesty.

What do illegal immigrants do for England?
1. Immigrants work on the farms, factories restaurants and supermarkets to put food on the English mans table.
2. Immigrants build the cars roads railways for English man to travel freely up and down the country.
3. Immigrants clean up public toilets, streets, houses, football stadiums after the English man.
4. They look after the young, sickly and elderly in nursing homes, hospitals.

What immigrants do not do?.
1. Immigrants do not take benefits they work , pay national insurance and tax so that the English can collect those benefits and go down the pub get drunk throw up on the floor moan about the illegal immigrants that are cleaning up his puke and serving him.

2. Immigrants do not use the NHS the NHS uses them as nurses cleaners and as they are illegal means they can not go to the hospital for they have no documents.

i just want to know if it is true that the parliament is going to make a decesion on tuesday the six of febuary that is next tuesday ???

The last time I read a debate like this many people were against illegal Amnesty. It's very clear the situation has changed. One thing those against amnesty keep mentioning is that Britain is overcrowded. Now, these people are already in the country. Lets be frank, migrants are not here because of the British weather or to holiday, they're here to work, support their communities and better themselves. It's unfortunate many people support make poverty history but hate Amnesty for illegals. I think its time for Britain to follow the example of Spain, Germany and Italy. The time to act is Nowww.

The last time I read a debate like this many people were against illegal Amnesty. It's very clear the situation has changed. One thing those against amnesty keep mentioning is that Britain is overcrowded. Now, these people are already in the country. Lets be frank, migrants are not here because of the British weather or to holiday, they're here to work, support their communities and better themselves. It's unfortunate many people support make poverty history but hate Amnesty for illegals. I think its time for Britain to follow the example of Spain, Germany and Italy. The time to act is Nowww.

Kenny, if you look at the figures for repeated amnesties in Italy and Spain you will see that they have been granted to ever increasing numbers of illegal immigrants; the logical conclusion is that once those countries were seen to be granting amnesties they attracted even higher numbers of illegal immigrants. Check the link below, under the heading Experience in the EU.

It looks like that:
1-this parliament is not fit for purpose !
2-the labour party hasn't been fit for purpose for a decade now..!
3- John Reed is not fit for purpose,
as all what he's doing is taking problems to infinity by thinking he could clear the backlog of illegal immigrants by catching them up,locking them up and deporting them..!
I want to tell him: wake up and smell the coffe mate..
only taking problems to INFINITY doesn't make us -the british society- any good.. we need an amnesty for illegal immigrants to allow them to pay taxes like all of us,NOT TO SPEND OUR TAXES ON THE IMPOSSIBLE MISSION OF CATCHING THEM UP, LOCKING THEM UP (WHERE THERE IS NO ROOM)AND DEPORTING THEM ! WAKE UP MATE, THAT'S A GOAL YOU'LL NEVER REACH !
The voice of reason says that you could be using those resourses in combating crime..
the voice of reason says that you've failed to come up with a solution ..
the voice of reason says that there is only room for an AMNESTY to start anew..
WE NEED AN AMNESTY NOW..NOT TOMORROW..WE NEED IT NOW...
BY NOT DOING SO..YOU'RE GOING TO BE FIRED..AND THEY WILL BE HERE LIKE IT OR NOT ! ...
NEW LABOUR HAS COME TO A TRAGIC END..
HERE YOU GO, TEN YEARS IN OFFICE WITH NO REAL SOLUTIONS..
give us a solution ..I know the problem..if you're telling me you're going to clear this mess in an other ten years you're giving us a problem...
give us a solution now..say : AMNESTY NOW..THAT IS A SOLUTION and not next week ..coz it is DUE NOW...
THE ONLY WAY OUT IS IN ...
ONCE YOU GET THESE NICE HARDWORKING PEOPLE IN THE SYSTEM, PUT A SYSTEM IN PLACE TO CONTROL OUR BORDERS...GET YOUR NUMBERS RIGHT, COZ YOU KNOW YOU HAVEN'T GOT A CLUE AS TO HOW MANY HARDWORKING PEOPLE ARE BEING RESTRICTED THEIR RIGHT TO GET ON WITH THE JOB...AND GETTING ON WITH THE JOB IS WHAT LABOUR HAS FAILED TO DO FOR A DECADE !
YOU'VE MANAGED TO KILL THOUSANDS IN IRAQ WHITCH IS NOT YOUR BUSINESS AND NEVER BEEN ...
ARROGANCE WON'T PREVAIL FOR LONG..
ARROGANTS ARE OUT BY THE COURSE OF NATURE..!
AMNESTY NOW. ACT NOT.

To Paula, Sorry to hear about your unfortunate circumstances but it us very unfair to group all immigrants as bad people just because you were hurt by one. There are thousands of people out there who would hurt you legal or illegal. If the gvt granted amnesty then these people wouldn't be illegal and not driven into crime or faking documents. Many illegal immigrants working in this country are barely surviving and still looking after relatives in their country of origins most of whom they will never see again. They still pay heavy taxes which they can never claim. They do not have the good fortune of tax credits etc as we do and work endless hours and still have to think of care arrangements for their children. Those who receive Nass benefits of a mere 30 odd quid a week prefer to work and choose their own accomodation rather than be treated like prisoners.Most are professionals from their countries of origins. Amnesty on those who have been here without criminal records should be granted rather than letting in more EU people who still have to learn the language creating more havoc than good.

I would say to derek phibes:
The IPPR whitch stand for :institute
for public policy research has come to the conclusion that an amnesty is the right thing to do right now...
and I would say to migrationwatch that they better watch how birds migrate in harmony ...nature organises itself..
an Amnesty is a must..you can't come up up with a better solution ...
come on !

Well Kelly, you neglected to mention that the IPPR has close links to New Labour, and has certainly been influential on the policies of the New Labour government - is that supposed to be a recommendation?

An amnesty for illegal immigrants is one way of hiding some of the results of the long-term incompetence of New Labour government - that has already been mentioned.

If the IPPR has come to the conclusion and announced that an amnesty is the right thing please provide a link to such an announcement, and let's see if there are any conditions or omissions.

The link below provides a brief balance of informed views, but even the pro-amnesty view has conditions which could not currently be met.

The amnesty is an economical strategic and Ken knows that, he is a very clever politician. Keep up! It is important to know how many professionals and high skilled people this country has but keeping them under of the shade of illegally is damaging this economic since they are being under-contracted and their contribution is going to wrong hands! So it is time to give them a place in the sun of dignity as they are: Human Beings! AMNISTY NOW...DO NOT PUT IT OFF!!!

i do agree with the above comments.. i am mum to a 5 mnth old whose father is an illegal... iv cried my heart out for months nw seeing the pain in my partner's life..

the british laws have deprived me of my right as a wife and to enjoy my life fully. i look into my baby's eyes n tears come flooding what would i do if anything happened to my partner......

im nat asking for money im asking for his freedom for the freedom of all people suffering just like us..

comments that are being made against amnesty is RACIST. REID IS RACIST AND WE ALL KNOW THAT AND IF SOMEONE CAN PASS THE MESSAGE TO HIM THAT WOULD BE GOOD. WHY MAKE POVERTY HISTORY WHEN ALL WE CAME TO DO WAS WORK AND PROVIDE A BETTER LIFE FOR OUR FAMILIES.. WE DONT NEED NO ALLOWANCE N MANY OF US ARE EVEN MORE QUALIFIED THAN YOU MAY BE...

the lives of many people have alredy been destroyed and it is not too late to repair others.. the parliament should consider an amnesty and small message for mr blair-- that wud mean 1/2 million votes more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have heard that there is a debate in parliament on tuesday february the 6th 2007 to get a decision over the amnesty..I think newsnight asked the british to have their say by calling a certain phone number ..
has anyone come across such news?
let us know..
thanks.

I have heard that there is a debate in parliament on tuesday february the 6th 2007 to get a decision over the amnesty..I think newsnight asked the british to have their say by calling a certain phone number ..
has anyone come across such news?
let us know..
thanks.

NO MATTER WHAT THEY DO, THERE IS ONLY ONE SOLUTION TO THIS OUTSATANDING PROBLEM..AN AMNESTY NOW..
IF NEW LABOUR DOESN'T DO IT NOW, THE'RE GARRANTEED TO BE OUT BY THE NEXT ELECTIONS..100%
I GUESS TONY IS DO IT PURPOSELY COZ HE DOEN'T WANT TO SEE GORDON IN OFFICE...
SO IF YOU'RE "WAITING FOR GODO !" YOU'RE MORE LIKELY TO BE DISAPOINTED UNLESS YOU GO FOR AN AMNESTY TO BRING THIS MESS TO AN END..I SEE YOU BRINGING YOURSELF TO AN END TONY ..GOOD FOR YOU..
WELL, ILLEGAL PEOPLE ARE HERE..THE'RE NOT GIVING IN..
YOUR CHOICE ..
JULIA

NO MATTER WHAT THEY DO, THERE IS ONLY ONE SOLUTION TO THIS OUTSATANDING PROBLEM..AN AMNESTY NOW..
IF NEW LABOUR DOESN'T DO IT NOW, THE'RE GARRANTEED TO BE OUT BY THE NEXT ELECTIONS..100%
I GUESS TONY IS DO IT PURPOSELY COZ HE DOEN'T WANT TO SEE GORDON IN OFFICE...
SO IF YOU'RE "WAITING FOR GODO !" YOU'RE MORE LIKELY TO BE DISAPOINTED UNLESS YOU GO FOR AN AMNESTY TO BRING THIS MESS TO AN END..I SEE YOU BRINGING YOURSELF TO AN END TONY ..GOOD FOR YOU..
WELL, ILLEGAL PEOPLE ARE HERE..THE'RE NOT GIVING IN..
YOUR CHOICE ..
JULIA

New labour's policy is that of "status quo !" ...
meaning :we're fine with three quaters of a million people being exploited..! " de facto !"
But who's loss is that?
new labours off course !
they're out and for a long time!
they shake it with an amnesty..now!
julia

I was actually against Amnesty before now,but now i can i see that the only way we can our country is by grating them illegal the amnesty and do a proper boder control after then,atleastanybody has has a prove ,that he/she has been in the coutry for six/a year should be granted.then we will have a cleaner britain.

A chunk of that half million illegal immigrants would choose to go to the continent once
they're allowed to do so as one of my mates told me..they're not going to stay here all of them...
..it ain't a civilisation at all mate..it's a heck of a hell to be honest..no social justice..no equality..this governement is moving towards ANARCHY ..vote them in and be sure that they won't listen to you once they're in..they're a bunch of arrogants, feodals! wow this is a good word: feodals !
it's a presidential system with a prime minister!
we're in europe they say,they've got no problem to enjoy the sun in spain..but they moan to see the spanish in here under the british wether mercy!
one of the paradoxes I have discover is this : the british talk too much about intgration of other communities
in here, but you can hardly see us-the british- integrating in europe..we speek only two languages at the best : good english and bad english!
we're in europe but we behave otherwise!
off course we enjoy full english breakfast..
I want the illegalimmigrant to enjoy life here to the full..they're taking a bad story to tell about us ..we need to change it..
AMNESTY NOW !
JOE

I would say good luck to the chinese..they're going to be in charge in a decade..they're taking over..one of their assets is the numbers...!
my argument is that the numbers have a last word in world economy today..
some argue that we're overcrowded here in britain..that's talking rubbish..I have done my maths and
I can reveal now that a half million of illegal immigrants would boost the economy an extra 1% a year..that's to say that people create their jobs..
some argue that our jobs are being taken..funny to hear that..I say no..those taken are the ones vacant..the ones we're rejecting...
we're fine mate..
we really need to boost the economy..
that half million is an asset we can't afford to reject..the chinese would take them I'm telling ya !
my maths say that the curves are sexy..an amnesty is a good start..
HEY TONY..ARE YA LISTENING?
THE BRITISH ARE FOR AN AMNESTY..NOW..

it should be a big celebration..
I wish I could kiss them all in the lip when they get an Amnesty..why not..there are nice good looking guys among them..I have known one..
oh dear..he was stuning...
I want to get that record on the books...half million kiss...wow...that would do me fine!
sarah.

I have read all the posted comments, noticed more positives than negatives and that is a good sign and I have to say Amnesty is a must, especially at this present moment. First and foremost illegal immigrants are human and should be treated just as equal.Some of the negative comments are appalling, where are your hearts people? put yourselves in their shoes and think what they have to go through every single day, worrying what's going to happen to them, if there is a knock on the door they must get so worried wondering if immigration has come for them, I can imagine what living in fear is like,it just ain't right nor fair.They work really hard and deserve respect while being addressed,underneath the skin we are all the same, we have blood and not not water so why not treat them the same way we'd want to be treated. Don't we have British immigrants in other countries? so what makes them any better than the ones here, whether legal or illegal. People are just looking for better lives, what is so wrong about that? when these illegal immigrants help their people in the third world countries, it goes for good cause and it is a way of combating poverty. The main thing is amnesty should be granted to all that have been good citizens, not been in crimes and have proven they respect the British culture and can adopt into it other than changing it. All the cost that is put into deportation, detention centres could be used for better things like prevention of crimes, cells for crime commiting people and fighting against terrorism.
Please consider AMNESTY now for these poor misfortunes. Thanks so much to Ken Livinston and Liam Byrne for being human and antidiscriminatory, these are the values we are looking for in our leaders. Both of you are stars, and hopefully Blair will be considering the same thing. AMNESTY. Think Blair, don't you want Labout to be in power again and to make history, because people will be so grateful to be allowed to live a normal life again like you and I. Please change Britain for the best!

Hello, Joe/Sarah/Julia/&-other-false-IDs

Strange how so many apparently different posters use such similar, non-grammatical structures in their posts:

- no sentences
- first portion of post in lower case
- repeated use of ..
- switch to upper case for last portion of post
- finish with the same phrases.

All a coincidence of course! If you had any real argument for an amnesty you would have made it. Instead you simply try the tactic of repetition, thinking we are too stupid to notice. How funny you are.

I have read all the posted comments, noticed more positives than negatives and that is a good sign and I have to say Amnesty is a must, especially at this present moment. First and foremost illegal immigrants are human and should be treated just as equal.Some of the negative comments are appalling, where are your hearts people? put yourselves in their shoes and think what they have to go through every single day, worrying what's going to happen to them, if there is a knock on the door they must get so worried wondering if immigration has come for them, I can imagine what living in fear is like,it just ain't right nor fair.They work really hard and deserve respect while being addressed,underneath the skin we are all the same, we have blood and not not water so why not treat them the same way we'd want to be treated. Don't we have British immigrants in other countries? so what makes them any better than the ones here, whether legal or illegal. People are just looking for better lives, what is so wrong about that? when these illegal immigrants help their people in the third world countries, it goes for good cause and it is a way of combating poverty. The main thing is amnesty should be granted to all that have been good citizens, not been in crimes and have proven they respect the British culture and can adopt into it other than changing it. All the cost that is put into deportation, detention centres could be used for better things like prevention of crimes, cells for crime commiting people and fighting against terrorism.
Please consider AMNESTY now for these poor misfortunes. Thanks so much to Ken Livinston and Liam Byrne for being human and antidiscriminatory, these are the values we are looking for in our leaders. Both of you are stars, and hopefully Blair will be considering the same thing. AMNESTY. Think Blair, don't you want Labout to be in power again and to make history, because people will be so grateful to be allowed to live a normal life again like you and I. Please change Britain for the best!

Charlene

to Derec Phibes:
Your sentences' structures are far more worse that those you're refering to.Those you're refering to are fine by all means. There is nothing wrong in there.You're talking about "non-grammatical sentences !" where you can't produce one either ! How funny you are yourself !
1-You've started with: "Strange how many !" I would tell you that's no sentence at all.
2-"All a coincidence of course!" that's no sentence too mate.
3- "Instead you simply try..."
there should be a comma after "instead,...."
etc etc
You're trying to show off where you have no argument.
You're stupid to go down that line of picking on the language you don't master yourself!
Don't fear perfection mate,you'll never reach it !
If you happen to have an argument about a possible amnesty,bring it on!
At some stage of life you'll have to put up or shut up!
How funny you are !
julia.

false ID?
who's one? mine or yours Derek?
julia.

To julia white (or whichever ID you are using),
[Irony = ON]
I've read your posts, and I've decided I won't take any lessons from you in the use of English. Thanks anyway.
[Irony = OFF]

You stated in your post "If you happen to have an argument about a possible amnesty,bring it on!"

It seems you haven't read previous posts. In this thread I've made five posts before this one. I'll list them in reverse order so you can scroll up the page and read them.

5 - My post 83 - Feb 2 2007
Pointing out the use of false IDs to post; my suspicion was initially roused by posts from 'joe kent' but signed 'JULIA', then comparison of patterns in posts show identical faulty grammar. Once spotted, it was easy to see that the same person kept posting to say the same thing from different IDs. Other readers can check and reach their own conclusions.

4 - My post 70 - Feb 1 2007
Replying to make clear a connection between the IPPR and New Labour, and to ask for a link to the IPPR research and conclusion (still waiting on that); and to provide a link to a balanced view on amnesty for illegals.

3 - My post 66 - Feb 1 2007
Following up a post regarding other countries amnesties in order to state my different conclusion, and to provide a link to information about those amnesties.

2 - My post 12 - Jan 15 2007
Asserting that the UK government should put the rights of UK citizens above the desires of illegal immigrants if it were to consider an amnesty.

1 - My post 10 - Jan 14 2007
Stating my personal view about Ken's amnesty ideas.

Immigration into the UK is supposed to benefit the UK, not work against the UK; so managed immigration would check on the truth of an application, check for criminal record, check skills etc. Legal immigrants go through this process. Illegal immigrants break the law and do not go through this process. Of course illegal immigrants want an amnesty, but all criminals want to benefit from their crimes. If you want to grant an amnesty because it seems like the easy or nice thing to do, then why not give every criminal what they want and thereby eliminate crime? The answer is that it works against our society.

Amnesty we're talking about here is meant to benifit those illegal immigrants with no criminal records.
Our society has always benifited from immigration and still does so.
put one argument against the other and see for yourself cons and pros.
Right now,we're in a situation where we've got to bring this issue to an end.
Say,for instance, you're against an amnesty, what would be the practical solution..to carry on doing what we're doing:wasting resourses to no benifit to our society.
It's not good enough to say that an amnesty works against our society. You've got to suggest an alternative.
One that would be 1-practical. 2-that starts from A and end at B. 3-that states timewise when we're going to close this matter as sorted.4- give us an estimate as to how much it would cost you to put that alternative solution into place- cost includes money and human resourses-
this shortly what I would love to hear from those against an amnesty.
don't worry too much about your faulty english, just sketch a plan for me and for those in here.
julia.

To Derek Phibes att.
Amnesty we're talking about here is meant to benifit those illegal immigrants with no criminal records.
Our society has always benifited from immigration and still does so.
put one argument against the other and see for yourself cons and pros.
Right now,we're in a situation where we've got to bring this issue to an end.
Say,for instance, you're against an amnesty, what would be the practical solution..to carry on doing what we're doing:wasting resourses to no benifit to our society.
It's not good enough to say that an amnesty works against our society. You've got to suggest an alternative.
One that would be 1-practical. 2-that starts from A and end at B. 3-that states timewise when we're going to close this matter as sorted.4- give us an estimate as to how much it would cost you to put that alternative solution into place- cost includes money and human resourses-
this shortly what I would love to hear from those against an amnesty.
don't worry too much about your faulty english, just sketch a plan for me and for those in here.
julia.

To Derek Phibes att.
Amnesty we're talking about here is meant to benifit those illegal immigrants with no criminal records.
Our society has always benifited from immigration and still does so.
put one argument against the other and see for yourself cons and pros.
Right now,we're in a situation where we've got to bring this issue to an end.
Say,for instance, you're against an amnesty, what would be the practical solution..to carry on doing what we're doing:wasting resourses to no benifit to our society.
It's not good enough to say that an amnesty works against our society. You've got to suggest an alternative.
One that would be 1-practical. 2-that starts from A and end at B. 3-that states timewise when we're going to close this matter as sorted.4- give us an estimate as to how much it would cost you to put that alternative solution into place- cost includes money and human resourses-
this shortly what I would love to hear from those against an amnesty.
don't worry too much about your faulty english, just sketch a plan for me and for those in here.
julia.

To Derek Phibes.
Give me an exit plan that would benifit our society right NOW, keeping in mind that we've lost ten years under new labour to bring this issue to an end.
Julia.

A lot of people being saying that amnesty its wrong that it shouldn't happen. How can someone think that if they have no idea how it is being illegal, when they have no idea of everything we have to go through, people treating us like we are nothing. We work hard, pay our tax and our NI like everybody else. We are not doing anything wrong. Has anybody stopped to think even if is just for one min how we feel or if they would be able to do what we do, like being away from the ones we most love, cry every time when we think about them, and be strong to stay to try to get what we wanted what brought us here "Try for a better life". Do you honestly think we would be here if we had a good life in our own country? Only someone really selfish would think that. I am Brazilian and most of the brazilians that is here, just want to work to save some money to be able to buy our own house in our own contry, give to our family a better life. How do you think a mother and father feel when there children ask for something even if it is somthing very small like a chocolate bar for example and they have to say "no" because they dont have enough money. Is it a crime to go to another country, to be able to go to better schools and be someone in our lifes? It's just a peace of paper and i really can not see why the amnesty shouldn't happen...

Thank you very much for your time and sorry for the poor english!

A lot of people being saying that amnesty its wrong that it shouldn't happen. How can someone think that if they have no idea how it is being illegal, when they have no idea of everything we have to go through, people treating us like we are nothing. We work hard, pay our tax and our NI like everybody else. We are not doing anything wrong. Has anybody stopped to think even if is just for one min how we feel or if they would be able to do what we do, like being away from the ones we most love, cry every time when we think about them, and be strong to stay to try to get what we wanted what brought us here "Try for a better life". Do you honestly think we would be here if we had a good life in our own country? Only someone really selfish would think that. I am Brazilian and most of the brazilians that is here, just want to work to save some money to be able to buy our own house in our own contry, give to our family a better life. How do you think a mother and father feel when there children ask for something even if it is somthing very small like a chocolate bar for example and they have to say "no" because they dont have enough money. Is it a crime to go to another country, to be able to go to better schools and be someone in our lifes? It's just a peace of paper and i really can not see why the amnesty shouldn't happen...

Thank you very much for your time and sorry for the poor english!

To Derek Phibes.
You haven't done your homework mate!
An exit plan that works Now,with immediate benifits to the british society. I'm saying now coz we can't afford an other ten years to any governement to sort it out and I'm sure they wouldn't sort it.
Bear in mind that the home office is still not fit for purpose.
John Reed is under a huge amount of pressure. He's being told now: You're no fit for purpose!
So, where do you stand mate?
julia

To julia.
Thanks for your posts.
Your doing a great job.
I think Derek is losing the point.
I would love to know his exit plan.
If he has one I don't why he doesn't take over tony. And I would give in and go back home.
rod

Addressing post 88 from the (now rather shrill) 'julia white' ID

[julia white wrote: "Amnesty we're talking about here is meant to benifit those illegal immigrants with no criminal records.
Our society has always benifited from immigration and still does so.
put one argument against the other and see for yourself cons and pros."]

And what I have already said is that managed immigration is meant to benefit the UK. The key phrase is 'managed immigration'. The pros and cons are quite simple; immigrants approved by the immigration service are likely to have the skills that the UK needs, and are likely to fit in with UK society; illegal immigrants deliberately (and criminally) avoid the immigration approval system, from which one can infer they would not be approved, so would be unlikely to have the skills and attitudes we want to bring into the UK.

[julia white wrote: "Right now,we're in a situation where we've got to bring this issue to an end."]

Wrong! Well, wrong from this citizens viewpoint, which is that we have to bring the illegal immigration issue under control. Certainly New Labour politicians want this issue to end, probably with an amnesty, because this issue reveals their incompetence and mismanagement. They think an amnesty will get them off the hook just as Brown becomes PM. In fact, an amnesty would be remembered as the start of things going wrong under Brown.

[julia white wrote: "Say,for instance, you're against an amnesty, what would be the practical solution..to carry on doing what we're doing:wasting resourses to no benifit to our society."]

I AM against an amnesty. Clearly you haven't read my previous posts, despite the effort I made to make clear my viewpoint. The practical solution is obvious - it's just one that you won't like. The UK government has to regain control of UK borders and the immigration system in order to minimise future illegal immigration. Granting an amnesty without proper border and immigration controls will simply result in greater numbers of illegal immigrants, just as happened in Italy and Spain.

[julia white wrote: "It's not good enough to say that an amnesty works against our society. You've got to suggest an alternative."

Actually I don't - you have an incorrect understanding of the different roles in society. I am a citizen, not a member of the government or the Civil Service. They are paid to come up with the alternatives, but in this case an honest appraisal of the situation will simply reveal how awful they are at fulfilling their responsibilities. I have described the necessary first steps (above); those steps are actually the duty of the government, and are supposed to be paid for out of the taxes collected.

[julia white wrote: "this shortly what I would love to hear from those against an amnesty."]

I don't believe you. You have already tried to fiddle this discussion thread, to make it look as if there were many more people posting in favour of an amnesty than is actually the case - I think you make very clear some of the attitudes of illegal immigrants to lawful, democratic society. Also, you have demonstrated that, so far, you haven't bothered to read and understand the posts of anyone who has argued against an amnesty, so why should I think you would bother to do so in the future?

[julia white wrote: "don't worry too much about your faulty english"]

I am perfectly happy with my grasp of English. Though I do have doubts about your abilities, my previous references to grammar were to do with the idiosyncratic grammar patterns you used; these showed you were using multiple IDs to post comments supporting an amnesty. I suppose if you realise your call for an amnesty has no logical basis you can hope to make it appear more impressive if it looks like many posters are calling for the same thing.

Addressing post 88 from the (now rather shrill) 'julia white' ID

[julia white wrote: "Amnesty we're talking about here is meant to benifit those illegal immigrants with no criminal records.
Our society has always benifited from immigration and still does so.
put one argument against the other and see for yourself cons and pros."]

And what I have already said is that managed immigration is meant to benefit the UK. The key phrase is 'managed immigration'. The pros and cons are quite simple; immigrants approved by the immigration service are likely to have the skills that the UK needs, and are likely to fit in with UK society; illegal immigrants deliberately (and criminally) avoid the immigration approval system, from which one can infer they would not be approved, so would be unlikely to have the skills and attitudes we want to bring into the UK.

[julia white wrote: "Right now,we're in a situation where we've got to bring this issue to an end."]

Wrong! Well, wrong from this citizens viewpoint, which is that we have to bring the illegal immigration issue under control. Certainly New Labour politicians want this issue to end, probably with an amnesty, because this issue reveals their incompetence and mismanagement. They think an amnesty will get them off the hook just as Brown becomes PM. In fact, an amnesty would be remembered as the start of things going wrong under Brown.

[julia white wrote: "Say,for instance, you're against an amnesty, what would be the practical solution..to carry on doing what we're doing:wasting resourses to no benifit to our society."]

I AM against an amnesty. Clearly you haven't read my previous posts, despite the effort I made to make clear my viewpoint. The practical solution is obvious - it's just one that you won't like. The UK government has to regain control of UK borders and the immigration system in order to minimise future illegal immigration. Granting an amnesty without proper border and immigration controls will simply result in greater numbers of illegal immigrants, just as happened in Italy and Spain.

[julia white wrote: "It's not good enough to say that an amnesty works against our society. You've got to suggest an alternative."

Actually I don't - you have an incorrect understanding of the different roles in society. I am a citizen, not a member of the government or the Civil Service. They are paid to come up with the alternatives, but in this case an honest appraisal of the situation will simply reveal how awful they are at fulfilling their responsibilities. I have described the necessary first steps (above); those steps are actually the duty of the government, and are supposed to be paid for out of the taxes collected.

[julia white wrote: "this shortly what I would love to hear from those against an amnesty."]

I don't believe you. You have already tried to fiddle this discussion thread, to make it look as if there were many more people posting in favour of an amnesty than is actually the case - I think you make very clear some of the attitudes of illegal immigrants to lawful, democratic society. Also, you have demonstrated that, so far, you haven't bothered to read and understand the posts of anyone who has argued against an amnesty, so why should I think you would bother to do so in the future?

[julia white wrote: "don't worry too much about your faulty english"]

I am perfectly happy with my grasp of English. Though I do have doubts about your abilities, my previous references to grammar were to do with the idiosyncratic grammar patterns you used; these showed you were using multiple IDs to post comments supporting an amnesty. I suppose if you realise your call for an amnesty has no logical basis you can hope to make it appear more impressive if it looks like many posters are calling for the same thing.

It'll be quite reassuring if it could be conclusively verified that the percentage for as at to that opposing the amnesty is greater.That in it self would be an image of a nation that l want to believe still majorly embraces the fundamentals of humane doctrines.In this utopia,all humans exhibit extreme compassion towards one another.
But,hey!if horses were wishes everyone would jump onboard.As regards this delicate issue,one needs to balance and understand the need for the illegal migrant by the state as a corporate entity and the view from its indigenous populace.As it has been well documented this class of humans inhabiting this isles came mainly for a better life which by far has eluded them because an existence like this could definitely be classified as dire and pls only to genuine migrants.As stipulated previously the state knows these people exist within it boarders but would rather allow these phantom sector to integrate because what order better way is there than to allow them work and then collect taxes in the form of national insurance,income and vat but owe no social obligation towards them.As it is well documented,their number range from 300,000-900,000 for argument sake could we say 1million?If so,at what point in time has the indigenous
population that can work but DECIDED not to being in this amount obviously
not in recent times.What government wouldn't love that kind of arrangement where about a third of people you owe no obligation provide for the rest of the dreggs of society.Then there is the plight of the indigene who feels over run in his little patch of the universe.So it is my considered opinion that this matter be handled with the utmost caution so that this event can benefit the whole and not just a select minority.

To Derek Phibes att:
If you've got doubts, that means that you're not sure! that in itself reassures me ! that's what my mathematics is about:use your brain!
julia.

To Derek Phibes att:
If you've got doubts, that means that you're not sure! that in itself reassures me ! that's what my mathematics is about:use your brain!
julia.

To julia.
You've managed to take me on board.
thanks.

WE WOULD LOVE TO HEAR FROM PM BROWN.
HAVE YOUR SAY MATE. YOU'RE ENTITELED TO ONE AND AT LEAST ONE.
JULIA.

WE WOULD LOVE TO HEAR FROM PM BROWN.
HAVE YOUR SAY MATE. YOU'RE ENTITELED TO ONE AND AT LEAST ONE.
JULIA.

WE WOULD LOVE TO HEAR FROM PM BROWN.
HAVE YOUR SAY MATE. YOU'RE ENTITELED TO ONE AND AT LEAST ONE.
JULIA.

AMNESTY FOR ALL ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS WITH NO CRIMINAL RECORDS.
IT'S THEIR HUMAN RIGHT.
AMNESTY NOW.
JULIA

oi derek man..... do you ever understand wat u were saying before... seems to me you read a lot but still uv got nothing in that tiny brain of urs... do you really think it is possible to deport all these people.... who is the home office trying to con????? people like you!!!!

any1 with the slightest logic would understand that with the introduction of id cards and for eborders to be in place there should be an amnesty in uk.... and one thing people like you are not understanding (blame ur tiny brain again!) is that once borders are secured there would be no more immigrants coming in....... UNLESS the home office on their part are not doing their job again... is it so difficult to understand that coz for me its not... really!

i asked before whether we are actually just sharing our views or is this forum which has now turned into a petition being taken into consideration........?????? newsnight should send these comments to the parliament before their decision on tuesday.....!!!!

ahhhhhh n lastly derek i thought men had two heads and one of them can become useless.... in ur case its both man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well I am fully in support for granting ammnesty for illegals in the sense that the UK border cant never be controlled/secured if the internal bits are not sorted first. sorting that could either be by offering amnesty or trying to trace them out and depoting them.

but the politicians could be more economical abit. i as a british would prefer amnesty to deportation as the cost of deportation (拢11000 x 500000)could go a long way to sorting out meshy and crumbling nhs and education sectors.

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IMMIGRATION AND ASYLUM
UK immigration amnesty texts a hoax

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By Staff Reporter
Last updated: 01/30/2007 12:08:15
ZIMBABWEANS in the United Kingdom cranked up huge phone bills this week after a hoax text message swept across the immigrant community urging them to vote for a nationwide amnesty for illegal immigrants.

In a country where the constant fear of deportation reigns among immigrants, the message sparked a texting frenzy from foreign nationals who believed it was a UK government survey.

The text message proclaimed: "Please ring 08453004433 to vote amnesty 4 immigrants in the UK before Tuesday next wk and pass on the message to as many as u can.

"The UK gvt is considering granting permanent visa/indefinite stay to immigrants that are already here both legal and illegal, this will be presented to the parliament next tuesday. You may not need it but remember ur bros & sis who r in need." (sic)

There were slight variations to the text messages seen by New Zimbabwe.com with one urging at the end: "Let's pray for God to make this happen."

New Zimbabwe.com received several enquiries from Zimbabweans concerned that they were possibly being ripped off.

One reader said: "If this is a lot of hot air, then let your readers know so that they don't waste precious time and money calling that number and getting their hopes up for nothing...we have enough on our minds as it is without having to worry about getting false hopes."

It is not known where the text originated from, but the premium rate number belongs to the British Broadcasting Corporation (大象传媒). A recorded voice announces that it is a "大象传媒 London vote line", and advises that the "line is not active at present and all recent votes have now closed".

Themba Moyo, a Zimbabwean campaigner on asylum and immigration issues on Tuesday shed new light on the text craze.

He said: "大象传媒 television ran a very unscientific survey during one of their news programmes last week, as they always do on many issues, and urged people to text that number.

"That survey was targeted at all TV viewers, which includes British nationals, an overwhelming majority of whom rejected the amnesty suggestion during the vote. Someone, it would appear, then made this as a text and added a few details to make it sound like a government project."

Sarah Harland of the Zimbabwe Association said they had received several enquiries from Zimbabweans who also received the text message.

"I got a couple of texts myself," she said. "We contacted the Refugee Council who knew nothing about such a government survey. I don't think it has any foundation...my initial thoughts were that it was some sort of scam. We have no idea where it came from.

"There is no shift in the UK government's policy on this issue. There are always lots of rumours about this amnesty, but if anyone believes a government policy can be changed by text message, then they will believe anything."

In July last year, UK ministers ruled out an amnesty for illegal immigrants at the end of a review of UK border controls.

Campaigners for an amnesty have said it is unrealistic to think that about half a million "irregular migrants" can readily be deported.

"We can say that we will be ruling out an amnesty," Immigration Minister Liam Bryne said last July.

Byrne stressed the immigration department had made progress, with asylum applications down 72% from their 2002 peak and more failed claimants being deported.

"That didn't happen by accident. It took a lot of people a lot of hard work," he said. "We will be pressing on, not going backwards."

The government estimates there are up to 570,000 illegal immigrants in the UK.

The Joint Council for the Welfare of Immigrants (JCWI) said illegal immigrants who had been in the UK for at least two years should be allowed to stay.

And any illegal immigrants with no serious criminal record should be given the right to stay permanently after they had spent seven years in Britain, it said.

Habib Rahman, chief executive of the council, said a solution to the illegal immigrants in the country had to be found now.

"It's a political reality that around half a million irregular migrants can't readily be deported and EU migration alone cannot be relied on to fill the jobs many of them are doing," he said.

"It's time to get real - put this beyond politics and start talking practical solutions. In the end a system that denies full rights to all migrants in the UK is both socially unjust and is creating losers all round."

But the right-wing MigrationWatch UK claimed it would take 20 or 30 years to build enough social housing for illegal immigrants if there was an amnesty.

Zimbabweans cannot be deported at present pending the finalisation of a test case brought by a Zimbabwean asylum seeker known as AA, in which a he is seeking Zimbabwe to be declared an "unsafe" country to deport failed asylum seekers to.

The long running case is at the Appeal process after an Asylum and Immigration Tribunal ruled in favour of the UK Home Office Minister who is seeking to resume deportations.

Sarah Harland of the Zimbabwe Association said a ruling is likely to be made by mid-February.
Additional reporting 大象传媒
JOIN THE DEBATE ON THIS ARTICLE ON THE NEWZIMBABWE.COM FORUMS
newsdesk@newzimbabwe.com

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Material may be published or reproduced in any form with appropriate credit to this website
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The Blairites and Blair should be banned any political activities as it's not conducive to the british public.
I would issue them all with an ASBO
(anti social behaviour order).
It's a crime to have 750.000 people exploited and abused by the system.
This is not a social justice that marginalises a quarter of a million
hardworking people.
This is a crime beyond a limit.
We need to act NOW. I urge all unions, organisations for immigrants wellfare to rise their voices and speak out to get an Amnesty NOW.
I want to ask :what LIBERTY and AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL are doing about this ? The political arena is a corrupt one right now.
I urge all the activists to join and press for an Amnesty NOW.
JULIA.

Why is it that no one cares about
a half millon exploited human beings?
There is a bid mafia out there that is benifiting from this.Businesses are enjoying low costs employees who haven't got a choice.So they're bond to suffer to survive.The system is turning the blind eye on this.
Immigration wellfare organisations and unions are quiet about it. The british public is not aware of what people are going through.Shortly, I reckon the government is losing the plot by not coming clean on this subject.juan lopez

Pray tonight for an amnesty to illegal immigrants with no criminal records!
Beware of the answered prayer !
Pray tonight for famillies to reunite !
Beware of the answered prayer !
Laura.

Dear all.
let your friends know about this forum.Encourage them to join and have their say here.(pros and cons welcome).
Don't just sit and look. Do something for your fellow humans.
Illegal immigrants Unite !
julia.

not a quater of a million.it's a three quaters of a million. correct please.
julia

Is there a chance these nice chaps can live like the rest of us?
Give them an amnesty.
thanks
tom sawyer.

To David Cameron, leader or the tory party att:
Dear Sir:
So, what you're going to do about it?
Give us a plan. You talk about substance,I would love to know what you would do about it.
Are you going totell us that the best thing to do is to chuck these fellas up in containers and send them back to their home of origin to face the music?
give us a clue.
are you thinking what new labour is thinking?
Julia.

To David Cameron, leader of the tory party att:
Dear Sir:
So, what you're going to do about it?
Give us a plan. You talk about substance,I would love to know what you would do about it.
Are you going totell us that the best thing to do is to chuck these fellas up in containers and send them back to their home of origin to face the music?
give us a clue.
are you thinking what new labour is thinking?
Julia.

it is quite understood that some of the money(ghost income) the government earned are from the tax deducted from the work done by the illegal immigrant. This is because they cannot reclaim the overpaid tax.
Anyway these are the people who have contributed one way or the other to the economy of Britain.

Also there are qulified immigrants in various professions who can contribute positively and qualitatively to this economy but cannot due to their status.
The government should champion the move for amnesty for better Britain.

" ONE DAY A GOOD RAIN WILL COME AND WASH ALL THIS SCUM OFF OUR PARLIAMENT !!! "
JULIA.
Pray tonight for an amnesty for all illegal immigrants.
Beware of the answered prayer !
julia.

" ONE DAY, A GOOD RAIN WILL COME AND WASH ALL THIS SCUM OFF OUR PARLIAMENT! "
JULIA

The thing is that the illegal immigrants Card can't be used anymore by this new labour party and their spin doctors. They had ample time to sort this problem out.Their arrogance is beyond belief.
The British public haven't got a clue as to how and when new labour scum is going to be washed off our parliament.
This is it for new labour.
An AMNESTY is a must right now.
julia

amnesty is a must for the uk to boost up it's economy .

any news yet????????????????????

Last night I fancied to listen to the radio. By mere accident a voice came out from LBC saying : " I arrest you for working illegally in this country and also I arrest You for hiring an illegal immigrant ! "
There is a advert on Lbc telling people to shop illegal immigrants.
I urge the British public not to do so.
this is wrong. people who are woking to survive are being targeted right now, whilst criminals,peados and so on are FREE to target their next prey!
Tony blair is not conducive to the british public. I want him deported to USA. You're a criminal Tony by all standards !
julia

It is terrible to read some of this comments. I am not particularly concerned about Dereks comments but the heat that Julia has generated in responding to the comments made by Derek has prompted me to post this comment.
No direspect to Great Britain,this is a Great country indeed. The fortunes of this Country started a long time ago, the glory of this country started during the scrabble for and the partition of Africa by the 1st world countries, they took all that would make Africa great, man and resources, the 1st world made Africa Barren, killed, looted and destroyed both human and culture that stood in their way. Africa was left completely stripped.
Talks on reparation to find a form of Payment to Africa for the injuries inflicted by the 1st world countries came up and some men of honour forth dor this in Africa, untill they all met their untimely deaths.
Now a chance has come for the UK to show affection for the offspring of those they persecuted long time ago, and some one like DEREK could open up his mouth and emit sucg rubbish.
In comparism Derek was born in civilised economy were everything is optional, I was born in a place where you have no choice, raised in an over crowded house were there is no ventilation, horrors of malaria altering DNA's over a period of time, taking malaria medicine with chronic side effects, walking 25km to school and back, getting home from school and finding time to hawk wares on the street for funding the family. Have any of you, against this amnesty ever tried helping your pareents at anytime they call, have you at anytime sworn that as long as you are alive your little brothers and sisters will not suffer what you have suffered have you at anytime become the bread winner of your fathers family were ur younger ones required contant medical check and you can do nothing than to watch them die, has any of the people born in the seenyour entire community masacred and Ken says amnesty while some people say rubbish.
Derek what was your decision on the choice of country to be born? Put your self in my situation, you have a child you can not see, take care of brother you don't see, you can't even be there to pay last respect to departed family members. This is just 1% of the life of the so called illegal immigrants.
Food for thought Derek, How many COLONIES of the UK is prosperous in Africa, please name one.

newsnight there should give an answer nw about whether our views are being taken into consideration or not??????????????

is any1 else concernerned apart from us immigrants actually reading this???????????????????????

we want an answer nw be it from the blog owner.......... k??????????

The Immigration system in the UK only benefits those that want to abuse it. Immigration who contribute greatly to the economy are unfairly treated and prevented from doing alot due to the rules of the land

I'm not being rude.
I'm talking subtance.
What we're looking for here is a fair debate about that backlog of illegal immigrants who are facing a lots of music with a lot of rhythm !
I would love to see newsnight presenting some of the vews here to the british public.Instead, right now,what the media -newsnight included- and the government is doing is not more than sweeping the matter under the carpet ! The british public is not being told about the reasons behind the chaos our immigration system is in.
The new labour and the tory party have exhausted what they think to be their think tank or food for thought.
I urge them not to throw us that bone anymore.By now, everyone should know what they're about. It's no rocket science ! I get blown up with better political views in my local caf茅, better vews about what matter to us and better analysis as to what went wrong and how to bring solutions that last. The new labour and the tories are using the plight of the illegal immigrants to keep the game on when we know that it's over !!!
Again, ONE DAY, A GOOD RAIN WILL COME AND WASH ALL THIS SCUM OFF OUR PARLIAMENT !
AN AMNESTY NOW.
keep it on mates.
julia

This is exactly what needs to be done. I know of a few individuals who have been in this country 鈥業llegal鈥� for up to 11 years trying to make a living under these arch conditions. Some have their diplomas and certificates but are unable to get a proper job because the system won鈥檛 permit this.
They also have, well started their family but are unable to provide a proper life-style; doing odd jobs here or there for cash which they sometimes don鈥檛 get because of the situation they are in.
This is also hard on those who genuinely need to work and pay tax and provide a life for themselves.
in other words: i am all for it.

We're celebrating mediocrity here in the british isles! A government that has been dancing on that same old song for a decade now !
I see it as a FROG longing to be a saxophonist !
julia

Politics has lost substance!
we've witnessed the tories trying cosmetics on it: a political facelift!
They were illusioned by the misleading "lust" of Tony back in 1997.
Result: you can't say noe who is who in terms of policies ! I have an idea for a new political party: I would call it "All IN ONE PARTY!" in contrast to all in one washing powder !
It's a political laundry !
Hey politicians! wake up and smell the cofee!
you're all the same, you've got no substance whatsoever !
We're in deep shit! does anyone know where we're heading politically?
Personally I haven't got a clue,and I'm frightened to think that we're
" waiting for GODO!" if you know what I mean! Gordo himself is waiting for godo!
Just imagine An AMNESTY,VISUALISE IT AND IT WILL HAPPEN ..
Julia

You're traped mates!
No "political vaigra!" would cure new labour's impotence !
Pray for a miracle "tonight!"
love. julia

E=MC^2 !
my interpretation to it:
WE NEED TO TAKE THE MASSES ON BOARD TO PARLIAMENT SQUARE TO MAKE ILLEGAL PEOPLE OUR EQUALS !
E= EQUALS
M= MASSES
C^2= PARLIAMENT SQUARE !
julia.

The tory party compain to scrap ID cards is an utter nonesense !
The delay in implementing ID cards is an other complete shambles !
The two parties are really out of touch and they should realise that they lack creativity and action.Instead, we're bound in the british isles to suffer from their paralysis.
As far as the AMNESTY is concerned, there is no other alternative to it.
I you happen to have one, bring it on to the debate.I promiss to refute it !
julia

I am very proud of you Julia, keep on the good fight we are all behind you. All we are singing is amnesty! amnesty!! amnesty!!!. We are all human being, some of us are only fortunate to have been born with silver spoon in our mouth, but we should not be inhuman to people who are only struggling to make their life better. What we are suggesting is that, the government grant amnesty to those that are already in this country for many years and put in place a secure border to control any future arrival of illegal immigrants. This is for Tony Blair, your party will lose the next election by not calling amnesty now, the Tory party will then snatch the glory from you be declaring amnesty as soon as they seize power from Labour, that will then impress people to keep on voting for them for many years to come for their good.I am having the feeling that they are likely to do that to repair their political image.

God bless u Julia for the hard work.

Amazing to hear someone like JOHN R. giving a statment straight when he took over as a home secretary :
" The Home office is not fit for purpose ! ...etc "
That statment is still true tonight !
My fears is that we'll have to live with it ! but their joy is to get away with it !
Someone told me: I wanna quit smoking!
I told him: just quit! there no other tool to do it, just quit !
This government has no political will to act ! Forget about education education education ! forget about national hell service !
What are they right now doing about the 750.000 people who are here tonight. These people have access to one service only in this country: public toilets ! few of them were found guilty of a huge criminal offence : cleaning the home office offices ! the same office which is letting them down ! what a paradox !!!
Well, question: when we're going to get an AMNESTY for these nice chaps?
I have a dream to hug some of them when they get it and scream: well deserved mates !
love. julia

Remember that poet I have mentioned before? I met him at my local pub and was nice to talk to him; he's got no accent at all! I thought he was a londoner by birth. I was wrong. He's been illegal here for last 10 years and pick up the accent. He speaks 6 exhotic languages minimum. He asked me: how many languages do you speak? I went: two. Oh he said that's good for an english young girl. I said yeah, I speak good english and bad english !that's all. hw went laughing! Since then I made a decision to learn spanish, and I'm proud of him coz he's been handy to me.
I'm fluent now.
the education system has failed me and that chap has made me proud of myself !
I will fight to get him an AMNESTY.
Join me today and make a difference !
change someone's life to better !
make a contribution.
They say: those who can teach !
My chap can teach, but the system is failing him and us !
Education, education,education !!!
AMNESTY,AMNESTY,AMNESTY.
julia

These are our fellow mankind that needs to be given a state pardon and granted amnesty in due course.
Immagine this World without God's pardon or even this Nation;UK without God's pardon? It would have been in total dis-array.
They are deligent, time keeping, hard working, easy going, God fearing and Law abiding people with no criminal record who live in fear of being deported home at any time. Most of these people do the low income jobs and even get taxed heavily. Who do they complain to? rather, they try to increase their working hours so as to meet up with the expensive and high cost of living without going into fraud or crime.
They are religious people that stands in gap for the whole Nation,praying relentlessly day and night for this country to flourish the more and not to fall into the hands of her enemies i.e ''terrorists and evil minded people''. They form a substantial , strong pillar and backbone of the day-to-day running of the economy. Ranging from cleaning,to care, to security, to car park attendant,to factory workers and to all other sort of un-skilled labour which generates millions of pounds to the country on a daily bases.
Now, immagine this country without immigrants? would it not be better, regularizing their stay rather than frustrating their sinscere effort towards the economy? Life for them will be more misserable if this amnesty is delayed or not granted at all.
Tell me , who will fill in their gap if over 500,000 people leave the UK in the next five years? Remmember; '' A KNOWN DEVIL IS BETTER THAN AN UN-KNOWN ANGEL''
Humanly speaking; it will be worth the while granting an amnesty to the illegal immigrants living and working in the UK.

I have read most of the comments posted on here and have realised that app. 2 people have believed that calling an amnesty is a bad idea.
Derek and some other person - I do hope someone of some importance reads my suggestions.

Call the Amnesty with of course restrictions to put the citizens of this country minds at ease.
1) No recourse to public funds for the first 3 years after the amnesty has been granted
2)Housing which was a major argument (where to house all these immigrants if the amnesty was granted) That responsibility should be that of the individual being granted legal status and not that of the State.

I am happy to have noted there are not alot of Derek's out there... ones who seem dead focus on what could go wrong and what problematic implications an amnesty might hold. Truthfully, whichever way you take it there will be problems. However, I do say this there will be more revenue garnered from the increase number of tax and NI payers.

I strongly believe that the Amnesty with restrictions should be called and most definitely will work....these immigrants would even work 2 jobs and be much happier...don't you think Derek?

I think there should be a Nationwide Voting on the Subject of Amnesty.
Not all the People living in Britain are dumb and backward like the Immigration Watch Chairman, how has the Country survived up till now in terms of the State of the Economy.
The so called Immigrants are the ones that have worked and are still working ceaselessly to better the lot of this Country. It is evident that if the entire foreigners in this Country were to return back to their Original Countries, the entire Economy of this Country will collapse, and this is as a result of the fact that an average Briton does not work, but rather they all live for the State "handout" Benefit.
大象传媒 recently had a Telephone Voting System which does not seem to reflect the true feelings about Amnesty, i think they (大象传媒)should open the Telephone line for a proper and wide spread vote on this sensitive issue because it affects a larger percentage of people, not just two or three people. Amnesty is the way forward, if the Authorities do not decalre an Amnesty, it shows the backwardness of the people of this Country.

has any1 in fact noticed that the creator of this petition has is in fact supporting amnesty for those who have been here 5 years or more only waht about those who have been here less??????????????????????

I'm most definately in for an amnesty for everybody Adishti. I never created it, just discovered it a few weeks ago on the internet. But my guess is that if you have been in this country for five years or more, then it will be possible to do a criminal check on you in this country. but if you have not been in the uk long enough then you will have to get a criminal record from your country of origin which is not a bad idea should an amnesty be granted for every illegal immigrant. That would be brilliant, this way exploitation of illegal immigrants or workers would cease.

I think this amnesty is a positive idea for any person living illegally with the fear of getting deported. Afterall, most of the illegal people here in Britain, work, pay taxes, keep the streets clean and except the minimum wage. I pray and put my trust in our father up above, to touch Ken's heart and to put words in his mouth that would grant the most lenient cases, a good chance for them to live without this fear. A feeling that is caused by a different kind of fear for return to sometimes, less quality of life. A struggle that may sometimes mean going without food for days and other unmentionable horrors. Give this amnesty the right to go through.

i just found this new website wher they want comment from every 1 who supprt an amnesty. please guys do the best you can to stop the misery and torture we have to go through now...

let's all just be sensible. AN AMNESTY IS WHAT WE NEED IN BRITAIN. I TRAVELLED WITH A LADY WHO WAS BEING DEPORTED BACK TO MALAWI WHEN IN ACTUAL FACT SHE WAS ZIMBABWEAN. BECOZ SHE HAD BOUGHT A FAKE MALAWIAN PASSPORT TO COME AND WORK HERE THEY CAUGHT HER AND SHE WAS IN HANDCUFFS AND ON HER WAY TO HELL. SHE CRIED THE WHOLE NIGHT IMAGINE. WOULD ANYONE CRY BCOZ THEY WERE GOING TO THEIR HOME COUNTRY? NO. IF IT WAS SAFE AND DEMOCRATIC.MOST ILLEGALS ARE HERE TO WORK AND GO BACK. THESE PEOPLE WORK HARSD AND DESERVE AN AMNESTY.ITS UP TO THE UK GOVT TO KEEP THEM HERE WITHOUT PAPERS TO IDENTIFY THEM. YET AGAIN ITS UP TO THEM TO PUT IN PLACE AN ELECTRONIC SYSTEM/CENSUS TO ACCOUNT FOR IMMIGRANTS

This makes perfect sense. What do u make of deporting someone who's lived here for, say, 9 yrs; has always worked and paid all taxes; does some business on the side; has never bn caught in a crime; owns their own home; works with a few British charities? They contribute immensely to the economy. Not only is deporting them inhumane, it is against all common sense. On this one, i fully support our Ken! Spain, Italy et al grant amnesty. From all reports, their countries are better off for it. Its good to be good to aliens! Then, Britain will win SOMETHING in sports and do good for once!!! Have mercy as a country for goodness sake, and do what is right!!!!

Funny how many justify immigration of any sort are themselves immigrants. Many from countries who kicked the North Europeans out of their respective countries.
i suggest they sort out the white free countries they wanted, they've got them.
As for those who refer to immigrants having paid tax's etc. seem to forget that the subject refers to illegal immigrants and no illegal immigrant has paid any tax, but they do get health care Poor as it is, they use all parts of the infra-structure, they consume finite natural resources and create congestion etc.
Just remember Enoch Powell - he as it turned out, was not wrong!
Take a look at the type and number of crimes committed by these lovely legal or otherwise immigrants, and be happy todate you have not been a victim.

I say YES for amnesty NOW, It's what we need, have a look at this SHOCKING report and tell me where is the JUSTICE:

Maurice is right!
Illegals should be deported so should any foreigner who commits a crime. We must take control of our borders. Immigrants should be required to obtain a visa and have a medical examination before being granted entry. They should also have a skill enabling them to get work here.
Genuine repeat genuine asylum seekers are another matter.

The only way forward is for us to give Amnesty and tighten the borders.I have come to realise that most of this illegal Immg are here to work and have agood life.

Hi TONY.
You will be out soon !
tough on crime didn't work.
education education education didn't work.
the backlog of illegal immigrants hasn't been sorted.
shameless !
you're out soon.
blood shed is your only legacy !
you should be striped from british citizenship.

So people want to give an amnesty to Illegal Immigrants.
By definition they want an amnesty for Law Breakers.
What sort of message does that send out for God's sake?
They already know the country is a soft touch, but an amnesty for law breakers is absolutely crazy - bit what else can anyone expect from Kenny Boy Livingston, the boy is a moron!
The land mass of the country land mass is shrinking and the Government want a larger population.
Natural resources are running out.
The infra-structure is close to collapse. But I suppose they figure by letting all a sundry in, they will be so grateful they will vote Labour - typical Labour Logic, to hell with indigenous people, get those who will be grateful for anything mediocre!
You want a 3rd World Country - import one, whilst increase the emmigration of Brits and in particular the English - excellent.
"Change Britain forever" was the cry - well they have and it's current shamble will continue to compound at an increasing rate.
Mediocraty moves in whilst Meriticracy moves out, the way it has to be to match this Government.
And any country is direct reflection of it's Government. So God help Britain.

i agree with ken there are a lot of illegal people who is working in the system and paying tax and insurance with there correct name and i find that they should get amnesty so that they can contribute more not every illegal person want to harm people some come for better life and really want to learn nd live here to help boost the country. i hope the get the right to stay it will be a good thing

i agree with ken there are a lot of illegal people who is working in the system and paying tax and insurance with there correct name and i find that they should get amnesty so that they can contribute more not every illegal person want to harm people some come for better life and really want to learn nd live here to help boost the country. i hope the get the right to stay it will be a good thing

I have been illegal immigrant in this country for over three yrs.My ambition is to be a black taxi driver and for one year I did the knowledge by bike-it was hard work and I took some knocks.But now I must work as illegal mini cab driver.This leaves me in a very bad position.For example a passenger can say I have robbed them or assaulted them,or they can insult you just for a laff.I cannot do anything because I dont want trouble with the plice.I am thinking of returning home.Even if I die there I will be a free man.

It seems rather strange to have an amnesty when we are trying to cut down on illegal immigration.Surely this sends out the wrong message? But knowing Ken this amnesty will happen as surely as day follows night.

It's been a while since I'd visited this debate and to my dismay the same cadre of people and their half-baked preferred solution to this on going debate still prevailed.
This matter like I previously analysed is too complex to leave in the domain of societal lepers that are dominating this blog sites. I have read how a lot of these 'kraunts' advocate crazy measures to eradicate this problem . These range from outright NO ie MAURICE Post152 to ARY Post141 who in his/her infinite understanding would accept HALF AMNESTY ie no recourse to public assistance if needed.
Firstly,let me address MAURICE, Enoch Powell will forever be wrong.It's a pity that in every society people like you do exist & thats how it'll always be.White Europeans that were ever purged from any African/third world country deserved it because they were dominating every aspect of opportunity in those countries to the detriment of the indigenous populace.
This,anyway one wants to look at it,is not just wrong but immoral.Remember South Africa, Namibia and even India all these occured WITHIN the last century.India resorted to outright desent[salt protests] even after blood-letting for the EMPIRE during the war which a lot of other BRITISH colonies participated with the promise from the crown that independence would be granted.Again remember Mandela,Steve Biko. They both fought for the emancipation of their country.One paid the ultimate price the other 27yrs of incarceration.In all these
situation WHITE Europeans still live and prosper in these countries with exception to mutations like ZIMBABWE.
2ndly, this is to people of ARY' deposition antics like wait 3yrs before one can obtain help from the state after AMNESTY is ludicrous.By that you would still be less of a 'HUMAN'.Majority of these 'illegals' have been here for 'yonks' and you still want to further prolong their inclusion into mainstream society..?hell no it's not fair. I'll tell you something today ARY, in case you are one of yourself don't think you are less of a HUMAN.Stand for what is right cos if you don't you run the risk of falling within the cracks of life and fall for ANYTHING. Check the definition of AMNESTY, for those with no dictionaries it I believe the total absolvance of guilt granted usually to individual by a state.The word PARDON comes to mind so if you are pardoned for something it usually doesn't come with a precursor.So pls stand straight cos you are no different from others that have been given the same.
All these 'illegals' want to do is eek out an existence in whatever country they happen to inhabit add lets all know that whatever the government of the day while these illegals were being allowed in knew what it was doing or maybe it was nonchalance.But whatever the situation,no society should manipulated situations to suit its purpose to this degree.Don't on one hand tell the world that we are now a global village but want to make access to yours unattainable.Illegals just want a chance to work their way out of dire situations instead of waiting for politicians from both divides approving and delivering aid to their pet projects that never gets resolved.

Again I say,I do understand the plight of the indigene who thinks he's been encroached upon beyond acceptable levels. But do they know what deals their government are hatching on their behalf with other vulnerable countries, that invariably make these less fortunate countries inadequate to provide for its' citizenry?
One would need an ivy-league degree in international relations and politics to even start to unravel the enigma of the 'illegal immigrant'.
The west has always prided itself with humane treatment of life in all its' ramifications and its' close to pristine environment.These are one of the few 'WOW' factors that ensures peoples from less privileged quarters yearn for that opportunity to enjoy such existence.
But really, it's all a fallacy. If the RSPSA can investigate,persecute
and convict on matters of inhumane treatment of animals why then can't the same society exponentially ascribe the same rationally to illegal immigrants...? The term ILLEGAL is quite arbitral people need to think deeply before voicing opinions/utterances.

now that's what I'm talking about, tell them some more Jide.
The UK Government goes on about ending poverty in poverty striken countries and yet refutes the prospect of an amnesty!!!!!!
Men, talk about contradiction!!!!!
Come on you good people out there,
sign the petition for an amnesty by following the link below this dialogue. We have about 650 signatures for an amnesty and 30 against the amnesty. We need all of you.

Closing date 4th March 2007

Oh yes Ken lets do that and when the word gets around you will need another amnesty then another after the further influxes which will of course triple.

I live on a council estate Ken, this is where immigrants come to live and as much as you want and dream of a globalist integrating world the reality is completely different. My estate has been picked as the Polish area. I really wouldnt mind if they integrated but they dont Ken, come and stay with me for a fortnight and no matter how hard you try and speak to them it just doesnt work. But you would peg me as a racist and try and shame me in to keeping my mouth shut.

Tell you what Ken, lets designate your nice suburban street as an immigrant friendly area and see how you feel after six months of constantly smiling, saying hello only to be met with a mumble and a head lowered. It somehow chips away at your soul. Im not alone, my friends have tried and we get nowhere, but of course were all ignorant racists.

If Im to be judged as a racist NONSENSE!]
My opinions are based not on the skin colour, religion or race, I base my opinion on someones actions.

Call me cynical kenneth, but i think a million new and legal voters that think your the best thing since sliced bread would happily put their X where you wanted it. Im usre as we speak your printing up your PR stuff in thirty different languages
"Vote Ken I Did It For You"

adishti wrote:
"comments that are being made against amnesty is RACIST. "

You see this is the kind of double speak I cant abide in this country now. How dare you accuse me of being a racist. This is the exact same tactics used by Bush when he said
"Your either with us or your not" when refering to the Iraq war. For a while it got to the point if someone said they were against the war they were a traitor. People were scared to voice an opinion.

You and a number of other contributors are trying to silence my free speech and how dare you do that. My grandfather died fighting for my freedom of speech.

This is nothing personal against you or anyone else who has a different skin colour or culture to mine. My prime directive is tolerance which is more than I can say for you. I just posted on the reality of th epolish influx in my area and how there is a lack of integration. Does this make me a racist? I have black friends, two Czech friends but they have integrated, we have a common ground which to base a friendship on.

I simply dont agree an Amnesty is good for this country because once it happens it will happen again and again. A one time only then I could agree, but it would go on and on. This has been proved in other countries.

Quite frankly far to much of the indigenous population of the UK are being labeled racists for nothing more than their political views and this has to stop or we dont live in a democracy.

Sorry, but I got quite angry when I saw your comment.

robert hendry, one person's actions does not represent evreyone else. A person like you does not need to hear that from me!!
Better yet, I Know British people who act exactly like you have described. Even worse!!

IN REPLY TO:MR ROBERT HENDRY
Like I've tried to address in my previous post that humanity is quite diverse. There'll be perfect harmony if each sector practices what it preaches.
You got on the band wagon that that Poles in your area are reluctant to integrate. Have you ever been out of these isles to personally see how the ENGLISH live elsewhere? It's the same, they live in little pockets like every and any race does in diaspora. Yeah, feel free to voice your opinion that I believe is one of the inherent rights of being in this society or a least I hope this assumption still prevails in the current atmosphere of the nation. Check out this definition of racism
[hostile attitude/behaviour towards memebers of other races based on a belief in the INNATE superiority of one' own race] Don't you see how slippery a slope utterance like your' come so close to the defined...?
No one in their right mind should advocate an Amnesty every now and then. I implore you to open your eyes to eloquent reasoning. What was government agenda behind allowing such influx of migrants into the country? Now the number is nudging the the million mark there is now a panic towards a pseudo-solution.
The only moral solution would be to regularise those here and then fortify the borders which would not be an easy task especially with the UK being part of the EU with its free movement across borders of member states who don't share your currency.
This society cannot continually grab the best from the rest of the world and expect to stay neutral.
My only hope is we don't go down the same road like the third reich with their 'FINAL SOLUTION' to the problem of these ILLEGALS.

Brits we should not be greed and selfish,what is wrong in given a healping hand,yet we call our self a christian state,the immigrants we are talking about 98%(percent)of them
are from the countries that britain has rule,enslave,people or products of people that have help to build this country,railways,trainways,roads and up to date the are still contributing to the economy,i tel you what if all this immigrant leave this country and refused to come back,we will go back to the dack ages,by invaiding them and enslave them again,lets try to be civilize,thou we are not practically, work with labour idea,because there are people in this country for ages the got every thing illegally because of faulse id and the know the (in and out)of this country you cant trace them allowed them to come and identify them self that may help solve most problems,if we dont need some one to come to britain let dont let them in but if we let them in the should be allowed to work,other wise the might be living on public funds,fraudulent acts,or become pest on friends, relatives and an unused brain is full of evil, we need to keep making this country grate by developing every living human or thing in this country,if we can go to every country we want weather by peace or? and others cant if the manange to come let allowed them to bride for God sake,we know there are some jobs that we cant do,and some of us we are too lazy to work,let dont forget we are plumpose to do; that why we need this people,this country always preach democracy,human right,freedom,let try to put it to practies and let the amnesty be part of compenzation of the slave trade

yes there is should be an immigrants amnesty,,,

its a good thing to grant amnersty

same here coz most of us here wud agree im talking sense wen supporting an amnesty.... most immigrants have skills, education and diplomas although we may speak bad english at least its understandable n we have a perfect knowledge what is being said 2 us....

UK Government should grant amnesty to everybody for once and all, so that they can contribute to UK economy. GRANTING AMNESTY IS THE WAY FORWARD.

Amnesty should be granted reason... there are 100s of people who have good communication skills, good knowledge, & they r multi skills but because they cant get good life in the countries they r here illegaly, but if they get chance, they will not sit back, but will prove themselves.

most of European countries had introduced an amnesty for the illegal immigrants for example Spain Italy Germany France Belgium and also the Netherlands government are going to give amnesty this year 2007 as well.
only Great Britain are ruling out this amnesty .i do not know why they are thinking tough despite a problem of a backlog of cases.
think properly before acting and follow the other countries .

i just cant believe that despite our pleas the blogger has not even once written a note to say anything and/or the matter is not being discussed again on bbc???? what do we need 2 do for our requests to be taken into consideration? we r tired of reid and this awful govt practice... i would pray along with others that God remove all of our obstacles.. if there wud be no amnesty say it again but dnt give us false hopes..

the amnesty will be granted one way or the other, at the moment it just a matter of time. I know for a fact that the Government is considering the prospect of an amnesty for illegal immigrants and workers. They are just afraid of the tabloids.
The churches started a one year campaign last November called strangers into citizens. Enter "strangers into citizens" in the google search field and you can read all about it.

Dear all
I am one of the so called 鈥渋llegal migrants鈥� if you are allergic to such phrase do not carry on reading. There is a strong legal and moral argument against the use of the phrase 鈥渋llegal migrants鈥� the correct phrase is 鈥渋rregular migrants鈥� or 鈥渦ndocumented employees鈥� we may come back to this if we lived to die another day.
No other issue could generate more hostility than the immigration issue and it seems almost impossible to have a proper intellectual debate about it because people are driven by all sorts of ideologies.

The anti-immigration argument dates back as far as 1904, I am sure the tabloid readers will figure out the significant of such a date, if you do not then you need to stop reading and go back and read about Britain鈥檚 modern history. What I would like to say is that the bottom line which all scientific evidences support is that Europe as a continent (that include big European countries like Poland Ukraine and Russia) is aging faster than any other continent, in order for an economic growth to be sustained it has to be accompanied with a similar growth in the population where the working force is drawn from, global economy and global market has its positive and negative sides on one hand it means free movement of capitals (British companies investing on third world countries generating tax revenues) but on the other it means free movement of people (people from oyher countries coming so settle in Europe) whether we like it or not, those of us who will be around twenty thirty years down the line will find out exactly how valid our argument is.

A hysterical anti-immigration campaign had been running in the Netherland for the last four years or so following a death of an anti-immigration politician and then the tragic death of Theo Van Goch an anti-immigration activist, the campaign was criticized by the UN and other NGO such as Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International, it was considered to be a departure from what was a strong Dutch tradition, however the new government has announced that it is granting an amnesty to thousands of irregular migrants this year 2007 the new prime minister described the decision as being tough but added it would open a new chapter in the Dutch politics.

I strongly feel that many people are repeating the integration argument with no clear understanding of what it means, my question to those people is how you define integration? Is it learning the language? We have done that. Is it playing a positive role and being positive members of our communities? We have done that. Is it volunteering, obeying the law and seeking a peaceful life? We have done all of that so what is it then?
Guys Britishness has never been a passport, a leading poll suggest that 40% of the British public would give up there citizenship to live abroad, Britishness is a set of values that any civilized nation will adopt, as long as anyone is prepared to observe and adopt these values then I do not see why they should be denied the opportunity to celebrate that like everyone else.

God bless you Julia where ever you are, you have demonstrated to all of us what human elevation is all about, there is no more rewarding feeling than looking up to those whom everyone else look at down.

As to people in the same position as myself whatever you do guys you NEVR have dream, imagination or a vision for that matter because our life, after all, is not worth while.
Raise globalization

i am not illegal immigrant but i have stayed for 3 years in this country and i have all the deception we put ourself through in this country.
The home office use the excuse of public fund to send illegal immigrant home, meanwhile most of the public fund is been contributed by the illegal immigrant and consumed by the citizen of the country. Most of them don't work, they depend on benefit, they wait for Friday to arrive, and the next you see is the public fund been squandered in the pub and casinos. We don't see the people spending the money as problem but we see people contributing to the money as problem. Send all of them home and you will see how the public fund will go down.
My advice is that we give them a chance to live free and be able to contribute more to the society with peace of mind.

Hi there this amnesty thing is going on from last year july and still not got anywhere !!!! mgs is still not getting through the govt.... when will they all have amnesty... Govt. is just too busy making excuses..

Please follow the link & help people to come out from darkness.

Any time you think old Red Ken is mellowing with age & responsibility, the die hard lefty comes up with this twaddle ref amnesty.

They is no popular mainstream support for such corrosive measures.

It's only in the minds & fantasies of committee rooms of the UK's self appointed 'societual engineers' i.e. The Liberal Left (a distinct unrepresentative & unelected minority in themselves)

If they had their way, the existing population of the UK would be ousted as a measure of 'reparation' & replaced with the world's dispossessed.

Obviously the 'Liberal Left' would have to remain, if nothing else, to bore the newcomers to death with RIGHT ON & PC spin

Then watch them get kicked out or more likely shot by such newcomers :)

vikingar

[red] Red Ken is deluded, does he think the illegals will vote for him? [/red]

vikingar

[red] Red Ken is deluded, does he think the illegals will vote for him? [/red]

vikingar

i suggest we complain to the bbc on /complaints/ so that our views are taken into consideration as we never have any feedback from any1 concerned..

Any discussion about immigration, immediately results in all the racists and others of their ilk coming out of their petty little individual holes and making sweeping derogatory generalisations about Somalis, Pakistanis, Indians, Nigerians etc.

The plain fact is you can put up all the barriers you wish, but nothing is going to change. The world today is a small place. Travel is cheaper and easier. People do not leave their lands of birth on personal whims and fancies, but either for economic advancement or as a direct result of upheavals such as war, famine, natural disasters. In most parts of the world, this is to neighbouring countries e.g. Afghans to pakistan, Zimbabweans to South Africa, Mexicans to the United States, etc. Smaller numbers move longer distances. Migration is part of the human destiny. You cannot stop it.

It is time to open the doors to people everywhere. This will make things easier for both the host and immigrant.
Most migrants when they first leave home dream of coming back. Their heart is where they were born and grew up.

Let me give an example. The young(usually, in the case of economic migrants) migrant when he first comes to Britain, his wish is to work hard, earn as much money as possible and return to the home country to live, invest, etc. Unfortunately, the restrictive laws on people movement mean this migrant has often to use people smugglers. He has to pay these people smugglers exorbitant amounts, which he often has to borrow. To pay these debts, he has to work even longer periods. Often he has to work illegally which means again he is exploited with very poor pay etc. which again means longer periods. He does not even contemplate returning home to check whether conditions are better, because he is worried about how he will get back into Britain, and therefore he stays even longer and longer. If he knows that he can come and go freely, he may come back to Britain but for much shorter periods if at all. Porous borders as between many African, South American and Asian countries allow unquantifiable movements of people e.g. between Afghanistan and Pakistan.

of course where there is war and repression, people are less likely to return unless conditions have eased. Very often, but not always, these are worsened by Western and outside governments interfering. The sales of arms by the big arms producers (USA, Britain, China, France, Russia) does not help. Unfair trade agreements and tariffs worsen economic conditions in migrants' home countries. Active attempts to strongly control arms production and sales and elimination of unfair trading practices are likely to reduce mass migration. However, developed countries seem intent on follwing the very policies that are likely to precipitate emigration from poorer countries.

The argument that easy migration facilitates criminal and terrorist activities simply does not wash. The criminals and terrorists wil always find a way to cross immigration barriers. The fight against organised crime and terrorism needs proper policing and cross country co-operation,not artificial immigration barriers.

As a migrant, I am now a British citizen, for better or worse. There is so much which is good in this country and yet so much that depresses me. I now have two homes, but my heart is always where I grew up as a child and my early adult years.

So I say once again, open the doors. Let there be no barriers. When humankind is planning living on other planets and moons, how can we stop free movement on our planet? Suspicions and barriers can be overcome only when ordinary people meet each other. That is why London is such a wonderful city. You can meet virtually people from every country. Let all the people free.

I will say yes for amnesty in the uk. the home office makes excuse of public fund to send illegal immigrant home, meawhile most of the public fund has been contributede by the illegal immigrant,please do think about others as well, i have been helping one family the man is illegal but he has all read a family in uk,and his wife is not illegal got two children and they survive with income support which is not enough for why? because he has to report every week at baker house(london bridge) also they don't give money for transport one day he were very ill made a phone call explaning that he will not make they replay we don't care just come to report thers no choice he went and his famly are british all ready accept him so tell me what do you think theres also others things like:bill,rent,food,nappies,clothes,shoes,gas,eletric etc...is not all immigrant are terrorism,give them the chance to stay and jobs,so that they will start to pay tax,NI then others,theres other countries like france,spain,italy could be more they gave one year,five within permanet stay with condetion of working the government need look at this matter i will say no deportation:on another hand it is offence in britain to possess produce or supply substances such as heroin,cocaine,ecstasy,amphetamines and cannabis,stealing,crime this are the people that they should be reported in their countries and the home office should check also other people before sending them back, because most of illegal immigrant want papers so that they will get job. the population they just wait for friday to go pubs then do others things this not right because there a numbers of immigrants in jobs such as cleaning etc...with fake papers just get some money so tell me is this is the right thing? think for others as well many don't have a qualifications, many want to to collge they can't because of papers or ID.
please my proved commet its very important.

UK has a population of approx 60+ million.

More people travel through the UK yearly than are in the UK.

Our border controls are pathetic & we do not know who is actually here & who stays/overstays.

An amnesty makes a mockery of:

- those who have used the existing system (no matter how flawed)

- the rule of law & a states ability to uphold the law.

- encourages others to try (as other amnesty's abroad prove).

NO TO AMNESTY FOR ILLEGALS

They are welcome to leave & find another lifeboat.

vikingar

they should grant amnesty. they where the one who went around the world an rob teef and kill for riches.. they made the world more poor. now they use illegal folks to build there economy . with out giving nothing back. but dont worry soon all those imigrants will be running back to there home land , when the great war break out in the uk.

let me anser tha person who was givin the exemple of a person goin home and findin a stranger with no invitation in his house .. he was askin wat wud he do .. the most logical answer is throw him out as he wasnt invited ... by hey Mr remember tha in this house there isnt only u .. so he cud be invited by ur wife .. who knows .. then how can u throw him out ... same with those illegals .. who let 'em in the country ? how did they arrive here? who they are ?? are they all criminals ?? my direct answer is NO ..c man .. easy to throw judgements but very difficult to analyz facts .. so my suggestin to u is .. read between the lines .

Hi..
One Day A Good Rain Will Come And Wash All this Scum Off Our Parliament..!
Persist wherever you are,don't give in .Use you immagination to bring a solution to your problems.
....
Amazing that the tories are now backing every policy that the new labour comes up with !! why don't they scrap their party for that matter and be fostered by the new labour ?
We live in an era where the only oppsition to the party in office is that within it ! New labour's back benchers are playing the opposition role. The tory party must be shamed and named. My theory is that we've got here a situation with no precedent to it in human history !
.....
Shame on amnesty international that can't bring an amnesty to 750000 hard working souls !
julia.

this is to Vikingar,
the uk has a population of 91 million, let's us make that clear compaired to the USA which has about 300 million.
Americans offer green cards to 50,000 foreigners every year.
That is one of the reasons that distinguishes America from other nations with regards to its superiority.
An amnesty does not make a mockery of anybody or anything, what it does is make life better for these illegals who only want a better life.
Are you going to deny a hard working person to make an honest life for themselves because of a so-called mockery?
The Uk goes on and on about comic relief, ending poverty in Africa, and so on, but an amnesty is refuted!!!!
If you look at the benefits of granting an amnesty verses the benefits of refusing one, I can assure you that the benefits are far greater when and amnesty is granted.
Some of theses illegal immigrants have got special skills that the average Briton hasn't.

Julz (193) Your penultimate paragraph. Tell me what the benefits are. Where is the proof? One amnesty will lead to another then another. The country is overcrowded as it is.

The truth is that all polls show over 80% against further immigration, this forum seems to run on the same basis as the audience of question time as being the direct opposite to what the public want. All rationale people can see its already gone way beyond the numbers that this small Island can sustain,roads gridlocked,no room at NHS,no where to put waste,and theres eight people chasing evry house,so if you doubled house building wherby vandalising and destroying the enviroment it would not make the slightest diference except four people would be chasing evry house instead of eight.Its seems many are advocating this madness as to somehow show the world what splendid liberal people they are,the truth is they are engaging in an unfolding tragedy for all on these Islands

HEY JULIA, ADISHTI AND ALL AMNESTY SUPPORTERS GO CHAT WITH MR JOHN REID THE HOME SECRETERY INSTEAD SITTING HERE ACTING THE WALLS. YOU CAN ASK HIM. CLICK HERE.

Read the Government Response.
You recently signed a petition asking the Prime Minister to "give an amnesty to all ILLegal immigrants."

The Prime Minister's Office has responded to that petition and you can view it here:

We're on transit.
this government is oblivious to the fact that they've lost it..they're out and never about !
" ONE DAY,AGOOD RAIN WILL COME AND WASH ALL THIS SCUM OFF OUR PARLIAMENT !"
Julia.

i agree with Ken. Immigrants have worked so hard but no-one really appreciate. Guess its a curse especially if you are a black immigrant trying to work hard. Some of us never chose to be born in poverty. so why cant someone give us a chance.

I say yes to Amnesty to be granted for those who are here in the uk.

The NHS or (national Hell service) as I love to call it is failing 750000 people living among us tonight in UK.
We're living now in a Butchers' state. People are being denied their right to a health care.
We're killing thousands overseas and sucking 750000 peopele's blood.
The political arena is flawed and the political show has come to a dramatic end.
end off.

Dear sir/madam,
the home office will continue to dream about deporting each and every illegal immigrant in the uk.
This period as they have quoted will last about 25 years costing them billions of pounds, but have they
or will they wake up for a minute and think that by the time the 5th or 10th year has passed, many will have
the right to apply for citizenship.
I have learnt that an illgal immigrant only needs to be in this country for 14 years to apply for citizenship. So think people, in 25
years, you will not be deporting todays illegal immigrants.
The decision to deport them is not only unreasonable but irresponsible.

300 per plane 10 flights per day 24/7 will put a hole in the numbers - the sooner the better!
And very economical!

Ha ha ha ...john!
You said the H.O wasn't fit for purpose.
it's not fit to deport people, nor to legalise them...we like in an anachy !
beautifull !
julia

HI KEN . COME ON. GIVE AN AMNESTY TO LONDONERS .
YOU GOVERN NOT BLAIR !
U COULD BE A GREAT PM .
COME ON KEN.

It's a shame taht we've lost 10 years under new laber !
julia

I totally give my support to an amnesty for the following reasons.

Agreed that this people entered the country illegally, they have suffered for many years for doing the wrong thing, yet they have form part of the society in the sense that, though they work illegally, but they make positive contribution to the economy as a whole.

some people have been here for up to 10 years and yet they are still illegal, can you imagine what they would have been through, for someone to leave his family for the past 10 years and not able to see them just simply because they are illegal?

On the other hand, the government would be the loser, and those that are responsible for bringing in the illegal immigrant will be the winner and the profit maker. This is simply because, they would be paid to trade in black market, bringing people in, they have got nothing to lose, whereas the government will be responsible for tracking this people down, and if successful in tracking them down, would also be responsible for removing them from the country, which will cost a lot to do. As at the moment, the cost of removing one illegal immigrant stood at 11 thousand pounds per head, if you multiply that figure by five hundred thousands people, you know how much it will cost the government. Such money could be used to improve standard of Education, the fading NHS and to tackle crime. But until the government is brave enough and tackle this problem, the problem will remain the same.

The measures I would love to be introduced is, that the amnesty are called to drive those working in the black economy out of job, to grant individual between two to four years leave to stay in the UK without any entitlement to the public funds, and to monitor individual within this period that they do not commit any crime and after the initial period of two/four years they could then be granted indefinite stay to remain in the UK. Those years will be for them to contribute to the economy for entering the country illegally.

Finally I do hope the government would do the right thinking and do the right thing at the right time. By allowing them to stay. The country has nothing to lose but by not doing anything will contribute negatively not only to the economy of the country but will only give birth to more criminals. My reason is so simple, desperation can make people do anything.

Let the government admits that there is problem removing these people, do something about regularising them, and introduce tight border control that will make it difficult for other people to enter the country illegally.

The introduction of electronic border patrol is a good thing but this could only work if the problem within are resolved. This system will only work with new arrival to the country not with people that are already here who are not willing to leave the country.

Granting amnesty for an army of illegal foreign migrants strikes me as lunacy. Capitalising employers may benefit - but hold on a minute, it's widely known that businesses can't afford to pay a decent wage to anyone, let alone desperate economic migrants. Talking about a "level playing field with lower-paid British born workers" is plainly irresponsible. What do you base that idea on? Setting people from working class backgrounds against the migrants? Creating massive competition for low paid jobs! It's fine if you aren't claiming Jobseekers Allowance and you're earning 拢50,000 a year in the finance sector, but hey, what about the rest of us? Who have been caught in the debt trap, who are constantly looking for decent work to get them through the year and find they have to negotiate with ruthless Recruitment Agents who hold back jobs from people because of their commission structure? What about you? What happens when you walk into a shop and try to buy groceries, but you have to leave empty handed because the staff couldn't speak English properly and don't give you the right change? What happens when all the hospitals DO actually close because money is just being 'thrown' at the NHS and nobody is getting anything done because there are so many people who are unable to communicate effectively in English, and nobody gets well because nobody really cares enough - tell me what happens when all the poorer British people end up on the streets living rough because they are written off as yesterdays News? Tell me, in your experience, do you really know what you are talking about?

Dear Sir / Madame,

I am a immigrant living in Britian for 7 years without being able to travel anywhere since i dont hold travel documents.

I work full time and i earn over 拢30.000 per annum, i pay my taxes and i rent a private property.

now should i not have the rigth to go on holiday.

you tell if ammnesty is not good.

USA did it, spain and so many other countries, brits should chill when it comes immigration rules.

Hi Christopher neville "BA hons !!!"
You become a laughing stock mate by mentioning that "BA hons !". Your poor english speaks for itself. You're talking loads of rubbish and I would suggest that you burn your BA certificate and boil on it some broadbeans that you could sell in Marrakesh, where PhD young people are common place. Instead of taking your life in your hands you're trying to blame decent hardworking people for your failure.
BA hons he said. I got something to laugh about tonight. ha ha ha hons

Keep taking the pills, Julia.

Amnesty is coming, blair the liar is going. I'm calling for a general election. it's a must.
julia

I DISAGREE WITH KEN LIVINGSTONE ABOUT A IMMIGRATION AMNESTY IF PEOPLE ARE IN BRITTAIN ILLEGALLY WE SHOULD DEPORT THEM.IF WE GIVE AMNESTY WE WILL ENCOURAGE MORE ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS TO COME TO BRITTAIN AND MORE CULTURAL PROBLEMS. WE HAVE TO BE VERY CAREFULL WITH IMMAGRATION AS WE COULD HAVE BIG PROBLEMS IN EVERY PART OF BRITTIAN WITH A OPEN DOOR POLICY.

An amnesty for illegal immigrants is morally wrong. There are hundreds of thousands of peole struggling through the legal immigration system in the UK who deserve to be given priority first for being prepared to follow the law. Every single illegal immigrant knew exactly what they were doing when they overstayed their visa or entered illegally - committing a crime. None of them are "trapped" here in the black economy, they could leave at any time they wanted as there are organisations that would help them return voluntarily and resettle in their own countries. If we granted amnesty then immediately we would be faced with new waves of immigration from all of their dependents applying to come to the UK and people smuggling would increase as the word got around that Britain had again become a soft touch.

YO Adam.
GET A LIFE , your english is as poor as your mind.
in the last analysis, you've got no analytical mind.
Amnesty is coming I can assure you.
Blair is going. He has already applied for asylum in the USA.
Brown is bringing the amnesty.
1 billion pound in tax revenue.

"Yo Adam.
GET A LIFE , your English is as poor as your mind.
In the latest analysis, you've not got an analytical mind.
Amnesty is coming I can assure you.
Blair is going. He has already applied for asylum in the USA.
Brown is bringing an amnesty.
1 billion pounds in tax revenue."

Thanks Julia

I have corrected some of the grammatical and English errors you made in your last entry to try to help you learn.
You are very sweet and naive but Gordon Brown isn't completely stupid, he knows an amnesty would wreck his chances of ever winning an election. By the way as you seem to have spent the last few months blogging on this website in pidgin English rudely insulting anyone who disagrees with you and trying to claim they cannot speak English you are the one who appears to need to find something better to do with their time not me.

Yo Adam.
You've made my day mate!
I have laughed madly at your stupidity, and i would love to tell you that you're no angel when it comes to the mother english language!
Your punctuation is wrong, and those you believe to be my mistakes are done for your own good 'you low level english' !
I prefer my version : " In the last analysis, you've got no analytical mind ! " and I stick to it.
In your entire entry, I couldn't see a COMA. What a joke you must be.
I prefer to keep it low for you. You're no high standards english.
Yo, I don't see a reason for " trying to claim" ...this is not english mate! wake up and smell the coffee!
I leave it to others to get you done because I can't get that low. sorry.
ha ha ha ...english he said ..." if you can't grow bananas, grow COMAS and learn how to use them ! shame on you mate .
julia the great

Julia

How was your last entry, or virually any entry that you have made on this site, a valid point with regards to this debate? Please explain.

I am willing to bet when you put a reply to this you will not be able to provide any sensible reason why we should grant an amnesty.

I am not going to even bother to replying to the rest. Even trying to have a reasonable discussion with you is enough to make anyone sink into a coma.

I have made an official complaint to the 大象传媒 about allowing your antics. Your behaviour should make you ashamed not proud.

Adam,
The establishment and its sructures isn't there to resrict my freedoms in any shape or form. I'm entiteled to my views. Those who don't agree with me must look away now,look for other shores and make choices for themselves. I'm not prepared to celebrate mediocrity. Debate favors only prepared minds to attract different views. I leave it to you to sink your ship in boredom-land shores, as to those who wish to embrace the wind, they can sail and land at morecomb bay at will, and shed -like me- hot tears on those chinese cockle pickers who parted us,just to invade my heart.
It's for them and their memory, that all undocumented people have to get their right to an amnesty right now.
I can't see undocumented people abused in a free country.
get a life Adam.
Julia the great.

Dear All,
I have been talking about migrants issues for months, now I can see that some hearts and minds have joined the wagon, my dreams are taking shapes and forms in the rainbow's colours. Strangers into citizens have arranged a rally to trafalgar square. I was there on may 7th 2007, the emotion was great and greater are my hopes for undocumented people to live their dreams.
Now that we're halfway through, eveyone has a duty to join, we need to keep the pressure on.
This government must be named and ashamed. Some of those migrants living among us have been here for a decade, and a decade of new labour in office has done nothing to sort their plight out.
It's time we changed our voting patterns, time to chuck new labour in history's dustbin.
AMNESTY NOW.
blair OUT.
julia.

amnesty is not the answer, we need to round them up , deport them without delay & then let them apply through the proper channels to come back , if we need their skills then they are welcome, if not then thanks but no thanks

Hi Adam( under martin taylor 222).
I would rather deport gordon brown to Scotland.
You're locked up in your tiny mind.
AMNESTY HAS GOT NO REVERSE GEAR. IT IS A FACT NOW.
julia.

Martin Taylor was not me Julia. Giving an amnesty to those already here will just encourage more incidents like Morecombe bay as it will encourage more people trafficking. Actually I disagree with Martin, deportation is not practical, we should concentrate on prosecuting employers who employ people illegally eventually this will encourage illegal immigrants to leave of their own accord as no one would be willing to exploit illegal labour.

AMNESTY IS THE ANSWER THAT WORK INSTANTLY, SAVE US MONEY AND RESOURSES, PAY IN THE MONEY IN TAX REVENUES, AND WITHOUT YOU KNOWING HELP THESE PEOPLE TO HELP THEIR FAMILIES BY SENDING THEM SOME OF THEIR SAVINGS.
AMNESTY NOW.
julia

hiya adam/martin whatever,

since you appear to read a lot mate i guess you should have known by now 'there is no way UK can deport all immigrants as this country is financially unstable. uk does not have the power/capability that the US has to deport all illegal immigrants. and just to let you know, in the past few weeks i have had 2 friends caught by IND officers. they were both visa overstayers but uopn their arrest they refused to sign any document so the home office could proceed with their removal. 15 days in cell and now they are walking freely in Peckham. do you still believe in this country's competence? aha! and if you are one of the people who say illegal immigrants are claiming benefits, taking your jobs etc well i truly believe you should go back to school and take the rset with you because even the most illiterate person would never give benefits to someone who is undocumented. LAST BUT NOT THE LEAST- DURING THAT RALLY IN TRAFALGAR SQUARE THERE WERE THOUSANDS OF ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS WH ATTENDED WHY (SIMPLY) DID THE HOME OFFICE NOT ARREST THEM- EVERYONE KNOWS THEY WERE GOING TO BE THERE... you are plain stupid man... B.O!

Demand of time. A well presented amnesty. Then we can concentrate on border security. Stop them from entering the country.

WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IMMIGRATION FOR LAST DECADE, NEW LABOUR HAS FAILED EVERYONE ! NOW, HISTORY IS REPEATING ITSELF, BROWN IS TALKING ABOUT A "GREEN TOWN" !!! A "GREEN TOWN" WHERE LOADS OF PEOPLE will have to WORK IN A "BLACK MARKET" ! ISN'T IT FUNNY THAT INSTEAD OF SORTING OUT THE BLOODY BLAIR DISASTER LEGACY, SOMEONE COMES UP NOW TO TALK ABOUT A "GREEN TOWN " ! DO WE NEED IT?
THEY'RE really HAVING A LAUGH AT US!
I hope one day we get a politician who could put his nose where his arse is ! coz unless they smell it they wouldn't have a clue what's our priorities.
A green town for me i just another way to take your attention away from the real problems.
What a nation we become !

Why?why are they teating them like somthing that you throw in a bin!We are human just like you who,we have a right to live just like anyoneelse they dont want to go out ant steal They just want a honest living just to feed there family.just free migrant free at last free at last we have a life free free free amnesty amnesty amnesty

Anyone who entered this country ILLEGALLY should be removed to their country of origin. Trouble is, if you threaten this course of action, they claim Asylum.
If they had something to offer us, they could have entered LEGALLY. We have enough problems with Eastern Europeans who, because of their country's EU membership, we can't (thanks to the current administration) defer their admission as most other EU member states have done.

amnesty is a good change for everybody,some illegal here,they work hard because they want to be a good and better person one day,thousand of illegal people still hoping that one day amnesty will be given,some illegal people have no business most of the people have a dreams and reason not only for their own sake but 4 the whole families,illegal allien are not stupid to stay here and sacrifice,to feel the FEAR all the time they heard that one illegal was deported,please give the people chance that they can feel the freedom and to be legal citizen,nothing to lost if you give them the chance,this country needs a workers with qualities,is not easy to be away to your own family and country,but reason they need to do some decision to survive....hope one day someone will knock your heart,& give the illegal a chance to renew their life.
god bless! more power.

hii julia im agree with you now is time to grant amnesty for immgrants like me. im here last 7years overstayed my visa and still working paying tax taking nothing benifet, and funny thing is home offece have my passport my all detail home address they are not bother. so julia me and my all friends thanks you for talking about amnesty.

They all managed to find the door into this country, perhaps they can shut it on the way out.But before they do take that stupid fool
ken with them.

In the USA, the republicans and democrats have agreed a process that would allow illegal immigrants to become citizens and at the same time they will reinforce their borders to stop new generation slipping in .
So, would gordon take note from that and do the right thing or he is just an other zero squared !
Hey Gordon, feel free to grant an amnesty for the undocumented population in UK, coz you've got no other choice anyway. It came to this end. Amnesty now !
julia

Dear friends,
ONE DAY A GOOD RAIN WILL COME AND WASH ALL THIS SCUM OFF OUR PARLIAMENT!
TEN YEARS HAS PASSED BY, AND OUR POLITICIANS HAVE BEEN OBLIVIOUS TO THE SORROWS OF THOUSANDS OF HARD WORKING undocumented PEOPLE THAT LIVE WITH US.
AMNESTY IS A MUST.
SOCIAL JUSTICE BEGINS HERE AND NOW WITH AN AMNESTY.
SOCIAL JUSTICE IS NOT INK ON PAPER.
POLITICIANS ARE A BUNCH OF CORRUPT SOULS.
WELL. NOT ALL OF THEM, BUT MOST OF THEM. CHANGE YOUR VOTING PATTERN AND THE WIND OF CHANGE WILL FALL INTO PLACE.
AMNESTY NOW.
RIGHT NOW.
NOT TOMORROW.
NOW. DO YOU HEAR ME?
NOW.
AMNESTY IS A MUST.
END THIS INJUSTICE NOW AND GRANT AN AMNESTY TO THE UNDOCUMENTED PEOPLE.
NOW.
THIS IS A CRY OUT.
julia.

The so called 鈥渆nd exploitation you end illegal immigration鈥� slogan was described as a perfect spin specially designed to appease the tabloids and appear to the Guardian sense of social justice. Launching the point-based system the Immigration Minister said the system is designed for non EU nationals whom we can do without, which, by analogy, means we could not have done without for more than a decade, how are you going to reward them Minister? Destitution!!!!! Thank you very much.
The system is designed to attract skilled worker from outside the EU. I am hundred percent certain that every policy maker in the EU knows or ought to know that it is the shortage of low-skilled labour that needs to be addressed. The real danger of what I call the Frattini鈥檚 鈥搕he EU security and justice commissioner- vision echoing in every immigration department in Europe is that it is marginalising millions of people, millions of kids are growing up in an underclass world psychologically traumatised with no sense of belonging what so ever, someone at some point in the future has to deal with these kids whom will be grown men and women, I can hear someone whispering 鈥渃ommunity cohesion鈥�. Destitution creates desperation, for those people it would be a game of desperate times, require desperate measures, whatever that will lead to.
Unless the issue of illegal immigration is decoupled from all the myths surrounding it I will not be surprised to wake up one day with The News of The World head line reads 鈥渇ind an illegal and win 拢1000鈥� it happened in Spain it happened in the US and I can see it happening here in the UK. To all those people trapped in the dark like my self I say.
We are destined to choose the impossible
We are destined a dawn after a dark night
We are destined a better tomorrow sun and trees
Love shall prevail everything else shall not

TODAY IS A GOOD DAY FOR AMNESTY,
YES IT IS A GOOD DAY FOR AN AMNESTY,
AND BAD DAY FOR BLAIR,
AND IF GORDON DOESN'T MAKE IT A DAY FOR AN AMNESTY, HE WON'T MAKE IT IN THE NEXT GENERAL ELECTION.
HE IS NOW JUST EATING THE blair LEFT-overs.
Amnesty sounds good today.
julia

No to any amnesty. These people came into the country illegally and should be deported to where they came from. This is exactly what any sensible country would do. We already have huge numbers of people here making up this "multi cultural country" and it's time to stop the complete erosion of the British culture. Try finding a native of these small islands on the Tube in London - it's proving more and more difficult.

Britain has done more than it's fair share in accepting legal immigrants and enough is enough.

Please remember Enoch Powells warning - he may well be proved correct.

One of the biggest myths surrounding immigration debates is 鈥渢he pull factor鈥�. If we take Carl Marx own words that 鈥渢he economy is the main factor behind any human activities鈥�, then, I think a distinction between the legitimate movement of people and its implications needs to be drawn to gain a better understanding of such an issue. In the late eighties hundreds of thousands of Eastern European Jews immigrated to Israel, a little tiny country with very limited resources but because the Israeli leaders at the time foresaw the implications of such big movement and prepared for it, its all side effects were minimised to almost zero.
The prime lesson that anyone will learn in any economic school is that (in economic terms, security always means inefficiency, bureaucracy, less productivity and ultimately greater prospect of corruption, the more secure the system the less efficient it is, because the guard needs a safeguard and the safeguard needs a watchdog, more paper work more staff and so on.
In an article published in the Sunday Times yesterday Michael Portillo 鈥揳 former defence secretary and conservative MP wrote 鈥渢he reason ministers behave so stupidly is that Blair made clear to them that their survival prospects hinged on looking busy, there had to be constant flow of initiatives to create an illusion of dynamic modernisation and to hog the headlines, bad policies were better than no policies, even when inaction (another word for stability) would have been preferable and much cheaper鈥�.https://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/michael_portillo/article1814153.ece It seems however, because the Government back in 2004 mis-predicted the number of people who might come to the UK from Eastern Europe exercising their rights to free movement under the EU treaties, and because the Government has lost the public confident on that, they are in desperate search for someone to crucify. Who is better than those undocumented migrants stealing our benefits, as they claim? It is clear that they are hitting the wrong side of the mountain.
I hope one day people in this country wake up to find that all undocumented migrants have gone just to find out once and for all whether this country is really capable of doing without them.

As Ara was drowning in the sea, on the pay just few yards away from him, there where tens of restaurants and caf茅 shops, packed with top-class metropolitan men and women enjoying chilled chardonnay, eating sophisticated food, that, contaminated with sweat, tears and anguish of millions of hard working souls, the music was flowing from every corner, loud and cheerful, it seemed no one was paying any attention to a human tragedy that is taking place nearby.
Thick clouds were gathering in the sky.
He looked at them and silently prayed they can reach those souls.
Rain softly on there fields and shoulders
Wash them from their sins
May survival be their destiny.

((No more wars for me, except against the French)) George Orwell, the moon under water, 1946

The above quote is from one of Britain鈥檚 finest writers, analysing the Anglo-French relationship. He says, at the same time when the elite of both societies admired each other for too many different reasons, the balk majority of both societies could not hate each other any less.

Diane Abbott a Labour MP wrote on her website a year or so ago calling for an amnesty from the tabloids so a rational debate about the issue of undocumented migrants can take place.
Polly Toynbee wrote in the Guardian on the 5th of May saying that, when it comes to issues such as immigration, prisons and law and order, there are no %100 solutions.
Will officials realise that or will they just keep giving promises they will never be able to keep and risk jeopardising public confident not only on politicians but on the whole political system even further.

What freaks me out more than anything else is the conservative policy 鈥搃f there is any- on the issue, do they really think that keeping, things regarding undocumented migrants, as they are where the problem is accumulating and the number of people falling in the dark is getting higher could win them the next election? Are they thinking how they are going to deal with it once they are in power? By using the same rhetoric? Or is it just because they are conservative, they have to sound tough on immigration? Or am I missing something here.

Hi ALL.
We live in a status Quo state !
We're taking stock everyday,
we buy and sell, but undocumented people are left on the shelves!
Our bogus political parties fear they undermind the public trust by granting an amnesty now! what the ignorants parties don't know is that what underminds the public trust is not to bring a solution that fits right now. we know it and Jon Cruddas knows it: an AMNESTY NOW! and END OFF all the issue!
What is bogus in our lives is not the undocumented people, what bogus is our political system that doesn't represent us.
I feel the obligation to tell all the undocumented people : sorry, sorry for what you're going through. It's part of blair wars, in IRAQ,AFGANISTAN, AND HERE !
blair out.
JON CRUDDAS IN !

Dear all
Following what Julia has said -post 243- one of the biggest myths surrounding the immigration debate is that the tabloids managed, somehow, to make it a no-go zone in an era where everybody is fighting everybody over a square inch in the centre-ground.
However, sorting out the immigration mess, in one way or another has its political advantages, the French president Nicholas Sarkozy introduced, when he was an interior minister, a regularisation scheme that benefited thousands of families. the act was not chartable by any mean. It is true that Mr Sarkozy came under fire from the French tabloids but such a move meant the far-right parties were deprived of the only political card they can play with. For an ambitious Sarkozy the move was difficult, but with his eyes on the presidential elections taking place in a year time, the move proved vital as a pre-emptive attack on his opponent.
In Germany the scheme was introduced as a response to strong indications of an economic recovery after a long period of economic recession, getting the calculations right encouraged the German policy makers to make the move.
For countries like Spain and Italy, the regularisation schemes were introduced over the years because these countries have population crisis and deep pension problems, introducing such schemes was a mean of filling the gap and generating the revenue pensioners need to stay alive. The claim that an amnesty will make the situation worse arguing the Spanish and Italian example is just a false argument.

Hi again;
It was once said 鈥減olitics is a brutal game鈥�. Words are the only redemption to those caught in the middle, sometimes not even that.
Thank God, humanity has come that far 鈥搒cientifically at least- to create this parallel invisible world, where the hopeless, helpless and powerless can find a voice.

Daddai is abusing the word :myth !
What I'm saying isn't a myth, it is De facto ! we're talking reality and not a big brother house !
Tabloids are misleading the public and the parties are avoiding to talk about any possible solution.
This morning on bbc1, we had to hear rubbish again about the police gettig 5 illegal migrants working in an indian restaurant! the policeman who was talking said that these illegal migrants are causing lots of problems!
that was talking bullshit.
These people are going through crisis, and trying their best to get a better life. They're not criminals.
Instead of keeping an eye on drug dealers and real criminals, they found a scapegoat in migrants. What a pitty.
It makes me vomit to hear a policeman talking nonesense.
What more!
the system has collapsed. is that it?
The cowards political parties haven't got the courage and balls to come clean on this matter.
david cameron is a fool. He has backes every single new labour policy,
he went to war with them in Iraq and Afganistan, he backed them on grammer school, ..you name it ! what a blow this society is going through!
Well, it's down to education, and othe public is busy with the apprentice and big brother show and sex factor !!Cowards are traking a piss ..!
new labour and the consevatives are no better than the BNP=Bum Note Party ! It's same shit really.
Who is going to bring an Amnesty?
it's stupid to see a sign sayin: no ball games on a government building! this government has no balls !!!
julia.

" but one day, a good rain will come and wash all this scum off our parliament !"
AMNESTY NOW.
julia

"It's not enough for the powerless to have a voive, when the state we live in has no ears !!!" julia

Dear all
If you are hopeless, helpless and powerless like us then all you have left is your voice, the last thing anyone in our situation will do is not to talk.
In Serbia a beat of a drum in the street of Belgrade brought the whole state of fear to the ground.
What William Shakespeare, William Wordsworth, Dylan Thomas, George Orwell and many other great men and women have left behind? Few words, I would say.
Honest words are all we have left I wish I could make them a beautiful song, who knows they may change the world.
Brothers and sisters
Sing loud,,,, we still got time for one more song
You will fall down!!!!!
Get up, like a date tree looking up to the sky
Nothing can daunt you!!!!
No fear,,,, no surrender
Sing loud,,,, your song amongst the crowd
Will turn the darkest night to light and happiness,,
Will mend your wounds,, will make you strong
Sing loud,,,, dream big!!!!
You may get locked up,, you still can sing and dream
Nothing will daunt you!!!!
No fear,,,, no surrender

I totally give my support to an amnesty

Dear all
I read in the Guardian, the other day, that Alan Johnson, one of the Labour deputy leadership candidates has revealed that he will support a partial amnesty 鈥搘hatever that means- for illegal migrants. Will he?
I read also the Conservative are proposing some tough immigration measures. Welcome home folks, we have been here before, you left it too late, bravo.
Set all free AMNESTY NOW

It has to be done, seeep the country for illegals and ship them out forthwith.
Then do as we always do, follow:-

Amnesty for law breakers - not ever!!

It seems it is easier to follow Livingstones' idealistic fairyland vision, i note a lot of valid points in favour of amnesty, but i note an almost utter lack or any reason and thought as to the consequences of such a policy or its long term practical costs.

As MigrationWatch has shown, Italy and Spain have both tried such policies on at least two occasions in the recent past and on both occasions, illegal immigration has increased, indicating that such policies only make the millions of potential illegal economic migrants more determined to risk a deal with organised trafficers as they become more determined to lose all or make it(?).

To make it to a country that is seen as a soft spot, a country where quite literally (the organised know) you can be illegallly present for so long as you like. Where law is only theory, practice is simply this:

As longs as you are not single and obviously fit (without any trauma from torture..) laws are there to be ignored. If a number of individuals can even hijack a plane from afghanistan to UK AND win asylum as a reward complete with housing (greater need) and NHS benefits etc Is it worth taking a chance on the UK if you are a determined economic migrant or terrorist looking for opportunities?

I agree that an amnesty is practical only so far as New Labours' incompetence especially in the implementation of human rights principles, makes it thus. It is obvious that such huge numbers cannot be deported within a realistic time frame and within existing legislation. An amnesty is the best solution for NEW LABOUR, not for the UNITED KINGDOM

Hi all
It is clear that we all agree. Those in favour and those against amnesty, it is practically impossible to deport all undocumented migrants in the UK and any other country for that matter. The bad news is that, a big proportion of those people will manage to stay here for fourteen years or more which means they will automatically be qualified to apply for citizenship. What kind of citizens they will be? I leave it to you to think about, but I can assure you none of those people, who make it and get the citizenship certificate, will be proud of the damn thing.
Moreover a regularisation of undocumented migrants is neither charitable nor an act of generosity. Read Philip Legrain鈥檚 book 鈥淚mmigrants your country needs them鈥� 拢12.99 and Bill Ong Hing from the University of California Davis 鈥渄eporting our souls鈥� $23.19.
The Spanish and Italian examples are irrelevant, people travel from one country to another fro better jobs and better life not to get an amnesty.
The majority of those people can do more than just clean and wash dishes. They are not illegal they are a massive reservoir of energy within your border. Whether to make use of it or waste it that鈥檚 your choice, just show us that you鈥檝e got the balls!!!!!
AMNESTY NOW

Hi Maurice
Monsieur Sarkozy could have netted himself a staggering 8000 Euros had his plan been implemented when he was a young boy being bullied at school because of his strange surname. I just wonder what country he would have chosen to go to!!! Hungary the country of his dad or Greece the country of his mum!!!!!!

A sign on a government building reads:"No ball games !"
I replied to it : " this government has no balls !"
AMNESTY IS LONG OVERDUE !
julia

Dear all
The Daily Mirror has reported that three of the Labour deputy leadership candidates are in favour of a regularisation scheme for the UK undocumented migrants, the tree are Alan Johnson the favourite, Harriet Harman Mr Brown鈥檚 favourite and Jon Cruddas the dark horse of the race.
Let us all pray for sunrise after a long dark night.
Vive la liberty

I totally give my support to an amnesty becouse if you lived here long enough you become british. that it is you do not need explanation.i gave a pledge of loyalty to the united kingdom and the british people befor i even become british.

AMNESTY NOW PLEASE
can you imagine yourself staying in country for 10 years or more paying taxes bills and living like the british people, then begin asked to leave how would you feel? I believe that british hospility will not be mixed with anger or hate.

hiii julia and all
newsnight yesterday 3 duputty p.m candidates are agree to regulised illegal immgrants now the polticians are serious to about this problem... now we can hope we are getting amnesty soon... thanks good

254. At 08:12 PM on 27 May 2007, daddai wrote:-
Hi Maurice
Monsieur Sarkozy could have netted himself a staggering 8000 Euros had his plan been implemented when he was a young boy being bullied at school because of his strange surname. I just wonder what country he would have chosen to go to!!! Hungary the country of his dad or Greece the country of his mum!!!!!!
------------

The Questions are:
'Was he in France illegally'?
In war involving the whole of Europe the answer is NO!
'did he apply openly for French Citizenship'?
YES!
'Had he broken any French Laws'?
NO!

What those who are calling for an amnesty in Britain are saying is that the answers above are to be reversed and accepted.
Nope, not ever!
Law Breakers are Law Breakers are Law Breakers, an amnesty would encourage more to come.

Hi
Amnesty is too close now than ever.
devil blair has less than four weeks to go.
Most probably alan johnson or jon cruddas will get the job, in which case the amnesty is going to be granted.

Don't underming the power of prayer.
Amnesty now.
julia.

Hi Julia MAY GOD BLESS YOU AND BLESS THE UK.
Don't underming the power of prayer.
yes i totally agree

Amnesty now.

I am all for amnesty and i beleive the time is right for it. God only knows what immigrants go through in this country especially illegals. Living here for years and not being able to see their loved ones or go home and pay last respect to their departed loved ones is very heavy on the heart.

They work hard and pay taxes but always living in fear of being sent back. God only knows.

So i beleive this an opportunity for Mr Blair to make things right and make one of his last acts as prime minister an amnesty to all illegal immigrants including failed asylum seekers as well.

We will keep the candles lite and will keep on praying for all. God bless.

Good old Ken. I hope all illegal immigrants are reading his words - for Ken is an honourable man. They can all then go to London where they will be welcomed with open arms for their diverse multicultural heritage helping to enhance the wonderful housing and social services available in that great metropolis.
Mike

What a load of tosh!

If an immigrant is illegal - how without a NI number is are they paying tax?
If they have an NI number then it was fraudulently gained.

You people are mad as hatters, and as dangerous as the numpty Red Ken and his ilk - all certifiable!

" NEVER UNDERMIND THE POWER OF PRAYER ! "
PRAY FOR AN AMNESTY AND IT WILL FALL INTO PLACE !
julia

NEVER UNDERMINED THE POWER OF PRAYER
A pray for those whom everyone one is looking at down
A pray that the table may turn and we survive.

鈥淗alf of what I say is meaningless, but I say it so that the other half may reach you鈥�
Khalil Gibran 鈥淪and and Foam鈥�
God bless you all without exception
daddai

Hi Mr Maurice - Northumberland

228. At 04:37 PM on 16 May 2007, Roy wrote:

Why?why are they teating them like somthing that you throw in a bin!We are human just like you who,we have a right to live just like anyoneelse they dont want to go out ant steal They just want a honest living just to feed there family.just free migrant free at last free at last we have a life free free free amnesty amnesty amnesty

hii all, more than 70 mp, mostly labour mp and 3 conservatives mp are supportin for immgrants amnesty. doday is 1st june wait till 24 june when duputy primeminister elction result iwill come out,and Mr.jon or Mr.alan will be come d.p.m ..... amnesty is coming just ready to wellcome it....

hii all, more than 70 mp, mostly labour mp and 3 conservatives mp are supportin for immgrants amnesty. doday is 1st june wait till 24 june when duputy primeminister elction result iwill come out,and Mr.jon or Mr.alan will be come d.p.m ..... amnesty is coming just ready to wellcome it....

oh god my eglish poor but im getig well step by step, i red somewher 1 man sya how illegal immgrants can pay tax or N.I so mr. if u know nothing why u here, i tell you something manny pepoles come her with right to work like short trems work permit holder, and with students visa, or working holiday maker visa, but overstayed their visa and they are continue working and paying all tex taking nothing (BENIFETS). now another illgals like visitor visa holder and fail asylem seekers so let me tell you this things for yors good information, before2006 any body could aplly for n.i no. and they had no right to cheak aplicants immgration stuts, they had look only passport and job leteer.

be free.
you're equal to everyone else.
don't think that just because you're illegal in this country you're failing. it's the system who is failing you !
We live in a society that celebrates mediocrity.
We know that you're a major contributor to our economy, but the politicians are take a piss out of you!
Cowards are too busy waging wars all over the globe. countries have been swept up. people are dying as we speek. people are being exploited as we speek.
don't tell me these bloody politicians are humans. they're not. they live on planet mars.
what an era we live in !
change your voting behaviour, change something tonight, try new ideas, feed hope. don't trust politicians, throw shit at them rather. they have failed all of us.
julia

Dear all
The political correspondent of the Daily Telegraph 鈥渁n anti immigration mainstream right newspaper鈥� wrote an article today June the 1, titled candidates pressure Brown over immigration, he concludes his article by saying 鈥淪ome Westminster observers have privately described an amnesty as "the right thing in principle which just happens to be political suicide in practice".
I really hope, for the sake of this nation, that people and politician learn from the Dutch experience when a far right government led a hysterical anti immigration campaign that lasted five years, did they succeed? No, they didn鈥檛, instead they are granting an amnesty to all illegal immigrants who have arrived before 2001, looking at it from a different perspective, the damage that has been done by such xenophobic irresponsible toughie-talk politicians to the orange dream, is an ugly legacy that will last for a long time to come, for the time being they are thinking about a honourable way out of that disastrous era, the centre question of how many human being鈥檚 life has been shattered, has not and will not be even mentioned.

Dream on folks, Dream on!

The Political Party that grants an amnesty for illegality is dead in the water, and they know it!

Hi Mr Maurice - Northumberland

Those against amnesty, it is practically impossible to deport all undocumented migrants from the UK. The bad news is that, a big proportion of those people will manage to stay here for fourteen years or more which means they will automatically be qualified to apply for citizenship. What kind of citizens they will be? I leave it to you to think about, but I can assure you none of those people, who make it and get the citizenship certificate, will be proud of the damn thing.

The Political Party has no way out of this but to grant amnesty, this is the only practically solution.
so it is not only dream, it is the true that you will never except.

amnesty now please

Hi all
If there is anyone still believes that all undocumented migrants can be deported then you lots need to be told the truth 鈥渋t ain鈥檛 ganna happen鈥�.
Considering the dynamism of social movement, those of us who will be around in fifteen twenty years time will pick up the pieces for not being a pragmatic and for failing to face up the challenge, the problem is like a snow ball the more it rolls over the bigger it gets.
Just before I shot off, does anyone remember what Celine Dion sang in the opining ceremony of the Olympic game in Atlanta in 1996? The song was called
THE POWER OF THE DREAM

hi all
amnesty it is a fact not a dream

Hi Mr Maurice - Northumberland

What do illegal immigrants do for uk?

1. Immigrants work on the farms, factories restaurants and supermarkets, Immigrants build the cars roads railways, Immigrants build the cars roads railways They look after the young, sickly and elderly in nursing homes, hospitals.

Immigrants do not take benefits they work , pay national insurance and tax,

Immigrants do not use the NHS the NHS uses them as nurses cleaners and as they are illegal means they can not go to the hospital for they have no documents.

Immigrants are the people you don't see, don't know and don't like to see, work behind the scenes making Britain great.

Dear all
Nick Cohen one of the Guardian contributors wrote an article in the Sunday Observer you鈥檝e got the whole link below I just abstract to following:
((Last week, three of the candidates for Labour's deputy leadership supported an amnesty, a stance no mainstream Labour politician would have had the guts to adopt at the height of Tony Blair's commitment to tough lines on crime and immigration.
The argument against is a good one. Amnesties reward those who break the rules and if today's immigrants get away with it, more will come tomorrow. As every Conservative columnist points out, the indigenous working class loses out as more cheap labour pushes down wages.
Yet sticking with the status quo means keeping parts of Britain semi-submerged, leaving them with hundreds of thousands who can't complain about exploitation, who can't protect their health and their families' health and who can't help the victims of crime, including, maybe, Conservative columnists when they are victims of crime. The Immigration and Nationality Department says it will take 20 years to deport the over-stayers who are here, assuming it knows who they are and where they are.
Amnesties don't have to be blanket exemptions. George W Bush is proposing one in the US, which, typically for Bush, manages to outrage the right for being too generous and the left for not being generous enough. But what Bush shows is that terms can be set and conditions met.
On the other hand, we could carry on in a kind of daydream and pretend that when we talk about population movements, social trends, the nature of poverty and immigration targets, we know what we're talking about when, in truth, we don't know anything.))

thank you daddai and keep up the good work

#278
Illegal immigrants are legally entitled to do nothing!

If these people are so good, then why are they not being good in their countries of origin, making them into attractive places to live?
With a Birth Rate Ratio of Ethnic - White of 15:1 (ONS) as in Britain, it should come down to what the British want for Britain.

It should and has to be upto the indigenous population who make the decision who enters their home or is refused access!
Governments, those who see themselves as do gooders will all get a vote in a referendum.
Labour don't honour the results of a Referendum - so you folks had better hope Labour stays in Office.
the longer they stay in Government the objectors will reduce due to the continuation of the British emigrating in ever greater numbers, being driven out by the unacceptable.

amnesty is coming with smileing...be4 new year start we will be here with fealess.

hi Maurice

i donot understand why donot you want to see that these people (Illegal immigrants )deserve to stay they lived here half of their life, why they are fright to you?

most of these people are our or your colleagues at work, they are good people.

hi Maurice

it is time for you to admit that
all Political Party has no way out of this but to grant amnesty, this is the only practicall solution.

an fact we all know this amnesty is the only solution.

I find some of the comments from those with an obvious personel interest in such an amnesty really funny.
They accept that their own kind and countries don't want them, so they left them.
Then assume that host countries and their people have an obligation to accommodate, ignore their illegality and want them.

Some Politicians may think so - but Joe Public does not, do you really think Politicians are going to sign their own Political death Warrant?

So any such Amnesty is a None Starter, it aint going to happen.

Dear all
I was going to write something today but I saw the following picture of a man trying to get through into the filthy rich continent

Our existence has much bigger meaning than that.
God forbid

me daddai i red this this news as well you done good job to put a link on this deebat, now who dont like illgal immgrants they must be inhuman being

Being British
Being British is about driving in a German car to an Irish pub for a
Belgian beer, then travelling home, grabbing an Indian curry or a Turkish
kebab on the way, to sit on Swedish furniture and watch American shows on a
Japanese TV.

And the most British thing of all?
Suspicion of all things foreign!
Only in Britain can a pizza get to your house faster than an ambulance.
Only in Britain do supermarkets make sick people walk all the way to the
back of the shop to get their prescriptions while healthy people can buy
cigarettes at the front.

Only in Britain do people order double cheeseburgers, large fries and a
DIET coke.

Only in Britain do banks leave both doors open and chain the pens to the
counters.

Only in Britain do we leave cars worth thousands of pounds on the drive and
lock our junk and cheap lawn mower in the garage.
Only in Britain do we use answering machines to screen calls and then have
call waiting so we won't miss a call from someone we didn't want to talk to
in the first place.
Only in Britain are there disabled parking places in front of a skating
rink.

NOT TO MENTION..

3 Brits die each year testing if a 9v battery works on their tongue.
142 Brits were injured in 1999 by not removing all pins from new shirts.
58 Brits are injured each year by using sharp knives instead of
screwdrivers.

31 Brits have died since 1996 by watering their Christmas tree while the
fairy lights were plugged in.

19 Brits have died in the last 3 years believing that Christmas decorations
were chocolate.

British Hospitals reported 4 broken arms last year after Xmas
cracker-pulling accidents.

18 Brits had serious burns in 2000 trying on a new jumper with a lit
cigarette in their mouth.

A massive 543 Brits were admitted to A&E in the last two years after trying
to open bottles of beer with their teeth.

5 Brits were injured last year in accidents involving out-of-control
Scalextric cars.

and finally...
In 2000 eight Brits were admitted to hospital with fractured skulls
incurred whilst throwing up into the toilet.

Let the government admits that there is problem removing these people, do something about regularising them, and introduce tight border control that will make it difficult for other people to enter the country illegally.

The introduction of electronic border patrol is a good thing but this could only work if the problem within are resolved. This system will only work with new arrival to the country not with people that are already here who are not willing to leave the country.

amnesty for people are already here.

Hi all
I find the 鈥淚 assume that you assume鈥� argument rather appalling if anything else, those so called illegal migrants come from too many different corners of the universe, trying to put them all in one basket is exactly like trying to squeeze a square bar into a circle hole.
I never had any doubt that the anti-immigration argument is a mere cover, the indigenes concerns, and the cultural implications are legitimate arguments and could easily be put forward as prime arguments rather than disguise them in some rhetoric, but yet again who鈥檚 got the balls to do so. The easiest thing for everyone, that includes xenophobic tabloids and wishy washy politicians, is to scapegoat and sing 鈥渆veryday is the same鈥�..we gonna find someone to blame鈥�.
English is my forth language, not the first not the second not the third, it gives me great pleasure to see those I disagree with quoting my phrases.

Without Immigrants, UK would not have been far off rom Zimbabwe

Activists rally to urge amnesty for illegal immigrants
By Colin Brown, Deputy Political Editor
Published: 07 May 2007

Religious leaders, musicians, actors and union chiefs will join the largest migrant rally in British history today, calling for an amnesty for 500,000 illegal immigrants which would give them rights to stay and work in this country.

MPs to debate amnesty for illegal immigrants

On Wednesday June 20, an debate on 鈥楾he Regularisation of Migrant Workers鈥� will take place at the House of commons, inspired by the growing body of support for the Strangers into Citizens campaign launched in December 2006.

New poll finds most British people support amnesty for illegal migrants

A new survey has found that two thirds of British people believe that illegal migrants who have been living and working in the UK for over four years and paying taxes should be allowed to stay in the country.

Amnesty on illegal immigrants is 'worth 拢6bn to UK'

Immigration: The facts we are never told

* There are between 310,000 and 570,000 illegal immigrants in the UK, according to Home Office estimates

* If allowed to live legally, they would pay more than 拢1bn in tax each year

* Deporting them would cost 拢4.7bn and leave acute shortages of cleaners, care workers and hotel staff cIf allowed to stay, the net benefit of nearly 拢6bn would pay for 300 new schools, 12 district hospitals or 200,000 new nurses

* Nearly 50% of foreign-born immigrants leave Britain within five years

* Migrants fill 90% of low-paid jobs in London and account for 29% of the capital's workforce. London is the UK's fastest-growing region

* Legal migrants comprise 8.7% of the population, but contribute 10.2% of all taxes. Each immigrant pays an average of 拢7,203 in tax, compared with 拢6,861 for non-migrant workers

* There were 25,715 people claiming asylum last year. If allowed to work, they would generate 拢123m for the Treasury

Articles : MPs call for 'amnesty' for illegal immigrants
by Charles Kelly on 29-May-07

For immigration updates see: www.immigrationmatters.co.uk

What is it you need to be a politician today? Besides having a hole in your head, or beind devoid of all common sense. Amnesty is an open invitation to never solving the present problem. Just look at the USA. And , how do you expect those who came into the country legally to feel? Those who waited their turn, and went through the painstaking ritual to become citizens. Whether politicians are aware of it or not, right now, it's costing the British and American tax payers an arm and a leg to support these lawbreakers. They are draining the life out of your welfare and Medical systems. Your schools are overcrowded because of them. And most refuse to learn the language and businesses aquiess to their wishes . Over here, they have a choice when they use the phone. Spanish, or English... You think this will help to make them learn the language ? Big business is behind it all. The almighty vote is utmost. Here, the Republicans are afraid that the Hispanic bloc will go completely Democratic, so Bush , Kennedy and McCain are making a last ditch effort to please them. The White American Middle class is the real minority . What will the British do when Muslims are large enough to create their own bloc in Parliament, and swing votes in favor of their pet projects ? Wake up Britain, and stop all immigration now, before it's too late. And above all, NO Amnesty for any reason.

noone like illgel immgration, but those pepoles in uk last manny years and have no cimnel recored and willing to pay tax or paying they should be alowed.

Hi all
The claim that illegal migrants are burden on the state welfare is a false one, prove it if you can.
The majority of those people ended up illegal because of deep rooted failure in the immigration system, do you know that at some point a visa extension could takes up to two years, do you know that hundreds of passport are lost, and most recently 40,000 people were told to get lost after changes to the highly skilled program were introduced, now those people were invited to apply, some of them sold their property abroad, you know what that is? It is a culture of disrespect to human life as if the whole universe is queuing in Dover to get in.
The current Home Secretary, in his not fit for purpose statement, accepted that mistakes were made, on one hand some people were let in by mistake but also many others were deported by mistake.
The Polish, the Slovak and the others are not here to stay, they are going home, either because they have made enough money or because they found a better place, Holland is the hotspot at the moment.
To grant an amnesty or not is a question for politician to consider, for the time being what practical solution do you have to deport those illegal.
The American example does not and will not apply to the UK enough to know that the USA grants 50,000 green cards every year, you need to read what Bill Gates had to say about the draconian American immigration rules and the damage they are causing to the US in general.
I welcome Falafel to this blog, keep the momentum rising guys.
The sun will rise and the dark night will soon be over.

May 8, 2007

We鈥檝e earned an amnesty, say protesting migrant workers

Dear Gordon Brown,
You will be loved, honoured, and respected more, if you declare an amnesty when you take your position as the prime minister of Britain.

You will surely make a whole difference to the country, and will be voted into the next election with so much speed.

Please consider the illegal immigrants and set an example, so that the world
will hold you at high esteem.

They are human beings, and will like to have a stable life. Thank you as you consider this option.

We have got alot to offer to this country.

J, Bromley, Nigerian

May 8, 2007

We鈥檝e earned an amnesty, say protesting migrant workers

Dear Gordon Brown,
You will be loved, honoured, and respected more, if you declare an amnesty when you take your position as the prime minister of Britain.

You will surely make a whole difference to the country, and will be voted into the next election with so much speed.

Please consider the illegal immigrants and set an example, so that the world
will hold you at high esteem.

They are human beings, and will like to have a stable life. Thank you as you consider this option.

We have got alot to offer to this country.

J, Bromley, Nigerian

Dear all,

You should know that the home office is unable to deport all half a million illegal immigrants in this country, not because they do not want to but because it is impossible.
The home office has said that it will take 25 years to deport each and everyone of them costing billions of pounds in the process.

But let us think about this for a moment,

This period as they have quoted will last about 25 years, but by the 5th or 10th year, many will have the right to apply for citizenship.
I have learnt that an illegal immigrant only needs to be in this country for 14 years to apply for citizenship.
So think people, in 25 years let alone 14, who is the home office going to be deporting?

If an illegal immigrant came into this country today, the home office will not be in a position to deport them after 14 years assuming that they will be in the process of applying for citizenship.
This is not rocket science, it's about time we came to our senses and let these illegal immigrants stay.
there is alot of tax payers money being paid for failed asylum seekers and yet they can work if given the opportunity.

Allowing these people to work will gain the British economy 6 billion pounds a year.

So instead of playing cat and mouse with these people and wasting tax payers money in the process,
for God's sake, give them the right to work.
The decision to deport them is not only unreasonable but irresponsible.

hii all, anybody know??.. on 20/06/07 in housr of common a deab wos heald on amnesty for immgrants.. im trying to finout any news on this deabat does anyone know link plzzzzz

Dear Mo

Here is the link you have asked for, it is probably four or five pages long, click next section on the bottom left to go to the next page.

2007:a bad year for tony,
a good year for illegal migrants.
AMNESTY IS LOOMING. AMNESTY NOW.
julia

A current email going the rounds sums it very well!

"Recently, large demonstrations have taken place across the country protesting the fact that parliament is finally addressing the issue of illegal immigration.
Certain people are angry that the UK might actually want to protect its own borders, might make it harder to sneak into this country and, once here, make it harder (as an illegal immigrant) to stay indefinitely.

Let me see if I correctly understand the thinking behind these protests. Let's say I break into your house.
Then, when you discover me in your house, you insist that I leave. But I say, 'I've made all the beds and washed the dishes and done the laundry and swept the floors; I've done all the things you don't like to do.

I'm hard-working and honest (except for when I broke into your house).

According to the protesters, not only must you let me stay, you must add me to your family's insurance plan, educate my kids, and provide other benefits to me and to my family (my husband will do your yard work)because he too is hard-working and honest, except for that breaking-in part.

If you try to call the police or force me out, I will call my friends who will picket your house carrying signs that proclaim my illegal right to be there. It's only fair, after all, because you have a nicer house than I do, and I'm just trying to better myself.

I'm hard-working and honest, um, except for well, you know.

And what a deal it is for me!! I live in your house, contributing only a fraction of the cost of my keep, and there is nothing you can do about it without being accused of selfishness, prejudice and being an anti-housebreaker. Oh yeah, and I want you to learn my language so you can communicate with me! English is too hard for me to learn. You should also allow me to vote - in my own language, since I live in your house!

Why can't people see how ridiculous this is -
Only in the dumb
leftie liberal UK. No where else!

I just want to say how long it will take for liam byrne to send back all illegal immigrants 5 years 10 or 20 ????? nobody knows. i myself have been here for nine years now been illegal nearly 2 years but i m still working paying my taxes flurnt in english. i could actually be a good citizen i can get much better jobs and contribute to the society but the judge had to refuse and the reasons he had to say really rediculus. I think the reason why they dont want to give us an amnesty is because the still get our taxes we do all the dirty hard jobs, and we cant get any benefits like going to hospital and many more things which others like us have. Why the homeoffice is such a mess if they had donr they job properly so many people would not suffer. I am staing here like this because i have nowwhere to go i have nothing back home in kosovo and i have everything here. well as u can see i am still living here living a life without destination because where i stand and many others like me cant look farword. So liam byrne who refused to give an amnesty to illegal immigrats just take a closer look to these people and then u and your colleges might change your mind. i have got so much to say and i hope one day my story will be published on a news paper cos that the only way i can make myself feel better.

amnesty should be whean id card will be take palace

THANKS MR,DADDAI SENT ME USEFULL INFORMATION.

mrs, harmn have become deputy leader so guys a big hope now...

i think there should be an amnesty in UK 2007 because the number of asylum seekers in UK is too much.

Many of these people have worked the hardest, most undignified jobs the United Kingdom. They are exploited by their employers who gain unfair competitive advantages over law-abiding businesses. They are illegally paid under the minimum wages, and they live in fear each day of being deported. Employers can decide not to pay them for work done, and they have no recourse.

They cannot access the health care system legally, or any services, even when many have paid taxes for years. Most cannot even report crimes against themselves.

They are not doing this because it is a lifestyle they desire. They do it because their lives in their home countries are so much worse.

MPs say illegal migrants should be able to work

By Colin Brown, Deputy Political Editor
Published: 26 April 2007

Backing demands for action on the plight of "illegal" workers who were the subject of his film Ghosts, Mr Broomfield said: "Our economy would collapse overnight without immigrants. Their labour enables us to have a much higher standard of living but the Government won't recognise the debt we have in this mutual relationship."

UK poll showing 66 per cent in favour to support their case for an amnesty.

Unions and MPs urge amnesty for illegal migrants

Dear all
The following quotes are neither from a liberal-left columnist nor from an old revolutionary socialist, but they are the words of Mr John Greenway a conservative MP who is commissioning an inquiry on the regularisation of irregular migrants in Europe for the EU Council,

鈥淪ome say that regularisation in effect encourages more irregular migration. I have not found that to be the case. Spain was mentioned, and I was in Madrid in February to talk to politicians of all parties, trade unions and employers. They believe that the one-shot regularisation programme introduced two years ago, which is now coming to an end and has regularised nearly 600,000 people, has not had any impact on encouraging more irregular migration.鈥�

鈥淭he reason for that is that Italy鈥檚 immigration policy is completely different to ours. In Italy, 1.4 million people have been regularised in the past 15 or 20 years, but that is the way in which it provides a route to migration and everyone knows that.鈥�

鈥淭hat leads me to my next point: we need to distinguish between a regularisation programme and an amnesty. None of the recent regularisation programmes has been an amnesty, which is when all irregular migrants are legalised. That is not what has happened. In Greece the regularisation programme introduced by the Conservative Government elected 18 months ago is a combination of regularising people who have earned their right to be there and have employment, many of whom came from Albania and the Balkans, and forcibly returning people who should not be there. There is a strong return policy in place. The arguments need to be balanced.鈥�

鈥淭he critical issue that we must face is that, as the hon. Member for Walthamstow (Mr. Gerrard) said, on the Government鈥檚 own analysis there are several hundred thousand people in this country whom there is no prospect of returning. What on earth are we going to do with and about them?鈥�

It has been said a long ago that, explaining the obvious could be the most difficult task,
Philip Johnston wrote in the Daily telegraph today coming across the report Mr. Greenway is talking about, if you have spare time in your hand then have a look at the readers comments, you find most readers using the illegal migrant argument as an scapegoat for other issues that have nothing to do with finding a solution to the problem by expulsion or indeed otherwise.

Amnesty is coming Martin Luther King thought us enduring pain is the first step toward victory.

The most practical thing to do for the incoming labour government of gordon brown is to legalise the over half a million illegals in the uk,allow them to contribute to the uk economy,and bare the from getting any state benefit apart from the NHS for 5 to ten years.its impossible and impractical to deport half a million people,especially when they're educated in britain,working or have set up bussineses in britain,have kids in schools in britain and have lived in britain for ten years or more.Grant them legal status,and introduce ID cards to deter other would be illegals.that's the only practical solution

does any boody knows new p.m gordon brown make any comment on immgrants amnesty issue..tell me plzzz

Just talking about change doesn't make you any different from the others gordon, show us how you're going to inplement change in immigration and the backlog of illegal migrants for this matter !
julia

Well, well, some of you want amnesty that much !
Fine , have it, and do not complain about what has been happening in UK airports .Just shut up about the consequences.

Plusss, I am foreigner - do not live in the UK, hope some people do not go critical about my English. (lol)

gordon doesn't give a toss about the 750000 migrants.
he is still in denial!
john reed has played his cards and gone in history's bin ! was he fit for purpose? obviously not. did he managed to deport illegals? not a single one.
it's a shame that the "PM" gordon has accepted the humilation of taking over the leftovers from blair. I would call for a snap elections and get in by vote not through a coronation.
If you want to know how great is a country, look at its systems, its constitution, its PM, its parties! the tories has brought shame to every conservative voter. you could hardly see them standing for anything, they stand for labour policies. to be honest I have all time found the lib dem leader a great politician, he belongs to that generation that honor politics. The lib dem is better opposition and is actually the only opposition.

the tories are definitly thinking what the labour are thinking in all matters.
who is going to bring that backlog to an end?
I'M going to form a rock band and start a revolution !
do you -like me - think that we need an amnesty right now to meet the threat of terrorism. we need to know who is in and who is out. knowing that those behind glascow are not british, it's time we granted an amnesty. gordon of course in in denial . do you really know what he is about ? i think he's got load of shit policies and not a single clue about the plight of 750000 people living among us.
HARIETT HERMAN WAS IN FAVOUR OF AN AMNESTY BEFORE GETTING THE JOB, NOW I BET SHE DOESN'T GIVE A FIG ABOUT UNDOCUMENTED PEOPLE. SHE'S GOT THE TITLE AND THAT'S WHAT MATTER TO HER.
AM I SURPRISE? NOT A PINCH!
OH DEAR.
DON'T GIVE UP PEOPLE. KEEP HOPE ALIVE.
julia.

I know someone who settled in UK years ago, legally of course than got the citizenship, never wants to come back to homeland, as public funds available is too sweet to give up, has not got to work there unless there is a nice job. Because of such types,I cannot apply for a settlement viza although I had plans to live in UK , not on public funds, but my own sources. Sweet,sweet public funds! Since there are people who like illegal immigrants, give me an idea how to be an illegal immigrant there, so I will be able to fight for an amnesty, with the support of (long live) you people!

Many of Britain communities have experienced extraordinary rates of change primarily driven by mass migration, changing patterns in the demand for all parties. Moreover, the communities undergoing these rapid demographic changes are often the most poorly equipped to do so, and maintain high levels of mental poverty, social immobility and poor media(losers) misinterpreting about race and migration. Those negatively affected by migration perceive government efforts to tackle immigration as being woefully inadequate, as the issues which concern them are not sufficiently reported in the media and therefore are not commonly understood. The economic losers from immigration are becoming increasingly alienated from their traditional Party representation. On the one hand, the current situation has created a contest of tough policies on migrants. On the other hand, migrant labour has contributed to the economic prosperity enjoyed by Britain. Migrants bring an enormous range of benefits to the British economy, and many low-skilled workers are filling gaps in the UK labour market. The combination of migration and economics can also result, in the worst cases, in racism and extremism.
The way we have sought to neutralise negative political issues regarding race, immigration and asylum has been particularly damaging. The government has never attempted to systematically annunciate a clear set of principles that embrace the notion of immigration and its associated economic and social benefits

gordon, ...don't expect any help wednesday !!! PM questions has revealed how feable you are !
hariett herman ...where are you?
that's all talk and no walk ...
you're load of rabbish!
amnesty now !
aln johnston is freed ! 750000 people are still traped here.

Amnesty is the only solution which is in the benefit of this country followed by even tighter border controls...this has happened in US ,spain,italy etc.

This talk of AMNESTY has brought up several unhealthy topics (someone mentioned RACISM !!)

Several individuals have posted comments here. Some quite learned and articulate while others lack the needed benefits of intellect, but in assessing the IMMIGRATION issues all the standpoints have to be considered.

In as much as i would vote for AMNESTY, my fellow AMNESTY seekers we should realise one thing. Though we try and make a case for ourselves due to the fact we contribute no matter how little to the economy, the fact remains - we are in the UK and should obey and abide by the laws of the land.

Let's reverse the order, the main reason americans opposed the war in vietnam was because it was not their war..... VIETNAM is sovereign same goes for Iraq...i mean we have heard a lot about IRAQ but not a lot from IRAQIS. The main reason americans and british folks alike oppose the war is cos it is not their war!! IRAQ is also a sovereign.

The U.K is sovereign,(when you are in rome, behave like the romans!!!) the rules they have laid out to govern themselves and and anyone therein in our favour.

If tomorrow, we are all summoned to go back to our countries it will be proper disheartening but the choice is theirs and not ours.

Now for the policy makers, the issue of immigration should not be too much of a bother. I believe only one course of action needs to be taken in resolving this issue.

It is general knowledge that the HOME office has an estimate of the number of illegal immigrants in the country and also an estimate of the number of industries/ sectors of the economy that engage their services.

Armed with these data, government can simply conduct a COST-BENEFIT analysis. I am sure the result will be more than useful in ascertaining the wisest course of action regarding MIGRATION.

If it is of great concern, then it is important to the continued existence of the UK, if it is important to the continued existence of the UK, it should be promptly dealt with, if it should be promptly dealt with, funds should be made available for this purpose and results publicly published so as to bring this issue to a close.

Thank you.

Why on earth does it refer to "migrants" rather than immigrants? Is there also a problem with people leaving the country illegally? Or contravening the law by roaming around the in countryside?

without immigration london dosn't work think about it they r human just like u and me some of them they been here for many years without seen there parent can u imagine u cannot do that if it's u or me , just think about it without thiking about racist people who don't want an amnestie

Illegal people just do the work that others dont like to do. Whats is the difference between a Spanish lazy guy who has all the opportunities to work in UK and who was a gupsy on his country mantained by the goverment and a latin american guy who speak spanish as well , is hard worker and coming from the same etnic and whole live never acostum to received any kind of donations frome any one. We are humans not animals, we have same rigths as you and everyone in this planet.we know very well how to earn our wedges, working day by day. the only thing that we want is being treat same as others. Can you tell me whats the difference? and Why i cant pay taxes same as Slovakian ans Polish people?

we all contribute to the economy of the uk.both citizen and immigrants.the press has serialised immigrants to look like beggars yet many are innocent and have contributed for so many years to the economy of this country, how do a legal or illegal immigrant working side by side with any british have an impact to the british.like the Americans the british should wake up and start recognising that we are all the same and have contributed to the well been of the country.The government should hold an amnesty based on taxes paid and length of period these people have lived and contributed.
In the contrary the government should put tighter controls on benefits claims and tell people to go to work.Jobs are their and illegal immigrants have not finished them, people are been picky.The best escape goat for all problems in the UK is immigrants wake up and compete in the market like a developed country.

Most of the illegal immigrants in this country are failed asylum seekers. The reason why they should be given amnesty is that the justice system for asylum seekers in UK is very questionable. The latest report by UNHCR says "serious problems remain both in the quality of individual decisions [asylum claims determination] and the context in which they are made".

Life for a failed asylum seeker in uk is horrible. He doesn't have an id, he can't work legally, he doesn't have access to the higher education, he's scared to seek help from the police, he's scared to seek medical assistance, he can't drive, he can't open a bank account, the fear of being deported back to his country hangs on his head 24/7, he is hated by the society, he is treated as a third class citizen. In short he has to live a miserable life. I just don't understand why on earth would he choose to live such a life if he didn't have problems in his own country. Think about it!

Amnesty for illegal immigrants has been granted.

by the british people as 70% say yes to amnesty and soon the goverment will

dear all,
We will know about the outcome of this "strangers into citizens" campaign in October or latest November. Those are the speculations at the moment.

why in October or latest November Julz

where are these polticions who favor an amnesty during the deputy priminister elction...

Giving an amnesty to more than 500k illegal immigrants will raise more than on billion in taxes

The cost of deporting all of them will amount to more than 拢5 bn , and the sensible alternative to bring back of these invisibles inti the system . By 2008 when the Gv will be issuing Id Cards we should be able to know who is here and who is not

So we have a choice , make people live in the shadow -exploited and living in fear ; or bring them into the mainstream

Amnesty is only sensible way to solve this problem

dear all,
this is in response to B.A. message number 325.
racism does play a part in the decision making of an amnesty. There will always be people who will want to weigh the benefits against the losses as an outcome to the decision.
While there are others who just don't want to know or cannot be bothered. So Mr. B.A. if you know a racist who is in favour of an amnesty, or a pathway to citizenship for illegal immigrants, I would very much want to meet them and their reasons...

And as for Falafel, immigration MPs will make inquiries into the proposal of the strangers into citizens campaign. They have to reach a decison before the Queen's annual speech in November. You may here about it in November when they reach a decision or in November at the Queen's speech. But once again I would like to emphasize to everybody that this is only speculation taken from what was said in parliament last Monday.

Over the last 250 years, the English have flooded Wales without a Passport or any knowledge of our culture. In doing so they've demolished our culture, language and pride. Now, I am part of some 500,000 who can speak the Welsh language, and live my life Welsh.

Who are you (English) to decide who can and can't come into your country. We didn't have a say in the matter during the industrial revolution!

Of course, your culture and herritage won't be affected by these groups, so why should you panic. It's probably too late for my culture!

I have to say live and let live to anyone who wants to come to this country, after all how did we end up living here? People should open their eyes and move on and if they aren`t happy with the country they are living in, then they should go and live somewhere else, maybe being on the other side of the coin would make human beings less Xenophobic..

Joe Wilson

A decision to reconsider and an amnesty should be welcomed by illegal immigrants and the British people alike. More than 500k are living in misery and exploitation. They have no voice and no rights. Some of these people have spent donkey's years in the UK. To deport them (if possible) is unhumane and unpractical. The home office has has no choice but to consider the possible benefits of regularising the majority of them whom most of them are working. Those with no criminal records should be given the right to earn their living decently and pay tax

Immigrant amnesty 'will raise 拢1bn'

Jacqui Smith has been urged to launch an immigrant amnesty

Spain granted amnesty to the same number of illegal immigrants which increased their taxes.

In the UK we should do the same thing and tighten the immigration system : that's the only way we can solve this problem. How many bn do we have to spend to deport one million immigrants?

Public opinion has always been against amnesty . If we start from a clean sheet, we will be able to know how are inside .

If they are given amnesty , they shouldn't be entitled to any kind of benfits and they have to suppoirt theselves till they get full citizenship

The ingenuity and diversity of arguments against immigration and immigrants are impressive, like the proverbial hydra, no matter how many heads are cut off. The monster instantly grows new ones. It suggests that the arguments do not matter. It is the state of mind producing the arguments which is important 鈥渂laming foreigners鈥�. If immigrants did not exist, it would be necessary to invent them, to create scapegoats.
Nigel Harris Thinking the Unthinkable. The Immigration Myth Exposed 2002.

The static state that emerged from the nineteenth century wanted stable population, with immigrants either here or elsewhere, as long as they were settled permanently. The state in the twenty first century will have to get used to managing the rights and status of nationals who are outside its territory and aliens who are in its territory, in other words, to dealing with population on the move.
Patrick Weil. Population on the move 2000

Just mention the word immigration to see those politicians wriggling, out muscling each other. Has anyone seen Mr Blair last PMQs the one took place a week before his departure, when he told the house that an early release of prisoners was necessary, he repeated the words 鈥淚 regret鈥� six times. Why they are going to be released? Because we don鈥檛 have enough room to squeeze any more, that is the price of talking tough and not telling the public what they should be told rather than telling them what they want to hear. We have got another snow ball rolling over and getting bigger by the day, there is a lot of tough talks but not much on the ground, so if you missed the first one it won鈥檛 be long before another prime minister gets the same humiliation and introduce new measures that will cost the tax payer dearly.

A new row over immigration is on the making, however the Lib Dem Home Affair spokesman said for the first time, I quote 鈥淣ick Clegg called for a process to be established so the estimated 600,000 illegal immigrants in the UK could earn legal residence鈥�
鈥淗e added 鈥︹��.it was "fanciful" to think that the estimated 600,000 illegal immigrants in the UK could be deported鈥�

it is good to grant illegal migrant amnesty

1-improve econo
2- make illegal people to work and pay for what they are here for(housing,tax,...
3-make good security for country
4- improve a problem with them

Daddai, the argument is not against immigration or immigrants; the argument is against ILLEGAL immigrants.

There is a revealing twisting of facts going on in some posts, so just to re-establish the facts and clarify the situation:

1. There is no such thing as an 'irregular' immigrant.
What could that possibly mean anyhow? Any immigrant to the UK who avoids the legal immigration process is an ILLEGAL immigrant: a criminal.

2. There is no immediate or urgent need to deport each and every illegal immigrant.
This issue has been raised by pressure groups supporting illegal immigrants simply as a diversion. They can be gradually deported as they fall foul of the legal system, and the costs of deportation can be met from the criminals' money and possessions; they paid to get to the UK, so they can pay the costs of deportation.

3. There is no sensible reason to grant illegal immigrants an amnesty.
They chose to enter this country illegally and for their own benefit. If the situation doesn't entirely suit them it is a situation of their own making, to which there is a very simple remedy - they can leave.
(Please note that there is no such course of action as 'regularising' illegal immigrants; if they are given legal permission to stay in the UK that means they have been granted an amnesty for their crime of entering the UK illegally. So any politicians talking of 'regularisation' are really talking of an amnesty. What are our politicians thinking when considering pardoning criminals because the criminals are unhappy about their legal status?)

4. The most basic, important and urgent course of action to effectively manage immigration (and also address some anti-terrorism issues) is to take immediate control of our borders.
This does not require waiting for yet another government computer system (over-complicated, wildly expensive and ineffective as it would eventually turn out to be); it does seem, however, to require some will and backbone for politicians to put the interests of UK citizens before those of foreign criminals.

Dear Derek
I would leave the criminality issue aside to discuss it later if we live to die another day, it is an important argument that requires separate debate.
The problem with illegal immigration is that, because those illegal are invisible, have no voice, whatever the tabloids throw tend to stick in the public mind.
If you are a lawyer, accountant, journalist or a policy maker you will definitely need facts to build your argument, budget, report or policy on.
In 2006 1.500 people entered the UK without coming through the normal channels the highest number was 10.000 in 2002 if you add up these numbers the highest and the lowest and take the average you will still end up with a massive number of around 400.000 people whom I would want you to tell me how they got here.
We leave there until I get your answer.
Good night

This sounds like a very very bad idea. Italy had an amnesty for illegal immigrants once. Then another and another and another, as migrants started to view Italy as a soft touch, (which they will also do with us) which determination could exploite. There are rules set down reagrding migration for all peoples of the world. No exceptions, none should be made. All illegal immigrats should be deported.

I HOPE NO ONE WILL EVER GIVE YOU A SECOND CHANCE Derek Phibes

dear Mr.Dereck Phibes and Nick,
you have the opinions of narrow minded citizens. I'm not saying this to offend you though. But have you ever thought of the fact that the illegal immigrants in this country also include failed assylum seekers and visa overstayers?
Nobody wants to be in this country illegally. There are so many technicalities involved when applying to stay in the Uk, and if you blip once, you are here illegally and in many cases the blips are irreversible.
Lyam Barn an immigration Mp has said it over and over again that deporting illegal immigrants costs alot of money which is why he is concentrating on the boarders to send back anybody with a suspiscious immigration history.

There are say 600,000 illegal immigrants in this country, deporting one of them will cost the tax payer 拢11,000 per head. To deport each and every one of them will cost 拢(11,000 by 600,000). Just remember your the one footing the bill, and will take 25 to 30 years to deport each and everyone of them. During all this time Uk citizens will be paying, better yet many of the illegal immigrants will have applied for citizenship. It only takes 14 years by law for someone who has been in this country illegally to apply for citizenship, so you will be paying the government to deport people who may not exist in the next 15 years.

So tell me, what is the sensible thing to do????

And as for Nick, you call amnesty a bad idea because of repeated amnesties, like the ones in Italy. well, let me open your eyes my narrow minded friend.
the reason Italy has continued to grant amnesties is because they have come to the realisation that each time they have granted an amnesty, the economy has boosted to a certain extent. I mean why spend money and I mean alot of money deporting illegal immigrants yet you can make a whole lot more by allowing them to stay?
That is the reason that there have been repeated amnesties in Italy.

And as for the UK, the only humane decision will be to grant the amnesty and to use the 拢6 billion generated from it to employ systems that would deter future illegal immigrants.

this government is bound to grant an amnesty by january the latest.
watch this space!

------------ A MUST READ-------------
The world is not fair, you work hard, pay tax,you being in a developed country serves as security for lot of people back home.. you provide school fees/medical etc. infact helping to make poverty history.. But within you, you know things are not right. You can't travel or plan. You live in fear..Knowing anything can happen at anytime. Many people who live with this status are refusing to have children or they live it till very late.. you're considered illegal and criminal just because you're runing away from poverty. Most of these people are very well educated and can contribute to the economy if given the chance. Ask matured Africans doing odd jobs...What job they did back home and you'll be surprise comparing it to the job they do now.
I agree with Julia. January is the last chance I think amnesty can be done. The government should not listen to the few others who have not put themselves in the shoes of so called illegal immigrants. Nobody wants to live in somebody's country without the correct papers. It's the situation that decides. Example: How can a student work 20hrs a week and pay 18k a year in fees. He will go for loan, Minimum 4yrs to pay back. Remember the H/office does not extend visa for students who wanner pay back loan.. You've Overstayed.. The Stress Starts.
Mr Brown should start afresh. Give Amnesty and it will be among the best human rights decisions you'll ever make.

A bunch of ignorants is running this government!
Remember what I said before: "one day a good rain will come and wash all this scum off our parliament!" It has happened in middle england and I guess this bloody governement is oblivious to it. You better grant an amnesty now before you get washed off.
Amnesty now !
julia.

A new survey has found that two thirds of British people believe that illegal migrants who have been living and working in the UK for over four years and paying taxes should be allowed to stay in the country.

66 per cent of British people questioned said that un-regularised migrants who have been living and working in the UK for over four years and paying taxes should be allow to stay without being referred to as 鈥榠llegal.鈥�

The same poll found that 67 per cent of those questioned believe that asylum seekers should be allowed to work

Amnesty to undocumented people in UK should be revisited since these people can not be deported, leave on perpetual benefit, commit crimes since they are idle, and can be influenced by the terrorist since they perceived themsleves as enemy of the state already

I do hope if amnesty is given to illegal immigrants in UK it will not only generate more tax income for the state but as well reduce crimes and potential criminal act in the society

DAVID HENRY

Illegal migrants' right to work wins support of public in poll

But an opinion poll commissioned by Strangers into Citizens - a campaign to give employment rights to illegal immigrants -shows that 66 per cent of people in the UK would accept refused asylum-seekers and those who had overstayed their visas if they worked and paid taxes. The poll was conducted last weekend by ORB with a sample of 1,004 adults across the UK.

Dear Falafel,
I can see that you really are an advocate for the amnesty. But one thing I would like to point out to you is that, illegal immigrants in this country are tarnished as the main criminals of the British society.
I for one know that it's a load of bull and when the amnesty is granted crime will not fall, not because we don't want it to but because some British individuals will never change.
I have worked as a security guard and seen alot.

dear julz

please look at the end of the comment and you will see it is sign by DAVID HENRY, but i do agree amnesty should be given so these people will come part of this society and not the enemy of this state.

I fully respact all the previews comments in this page. but just wanted to make my point.
of course all of you people who disagree with the idea of the amnesty for illigals in uk, and it is true that those people are strangers to our society, and how should that amnesty be the right thing?
we dont even know them,and they are lazy they only live on benefits, they do not work, they do not even learn to speak our language or learn about our culture, the do not engage with or socialise with brtish people.
now how can it be our fault if we don't accept them in our own land?
If some of them had children in uk should still be deported I feel sorry but they have no place in here.

who is doing hard work in this country??? those who have no right to get benifet, working like donkey with no holiday no benifet geting 2 or 3 pound per hours doing 12 to 14 hours a day but they are happy to work hard and keen to pay tax for lazzy bitish who dont works, how can any body say illigal immigrants are lazy ...

andrew, andrew, andrew,
are you that sort of person that engages with or socialises with each and every British person?
Illegal immigrants especially those from poverty stricken countries are one of the most social people in the world. The reason that some of them avoid other people is that they are cautious of whom to trust with their immigration status. Unfortunately for them, they cannot do the same things that many of you us take for granted. Just remember, it's not just British people they avoid.
Some of them have been taken in by some individuals who feel sorry for them, others have found a way to support themselves by using false documents. Would you blame them? I wouldn't, some have sought benefits because they are not allowed to work.
British police have even run into some of these illegal immigrants on more than one occasion and have let them go because they are good people.
I bet there many more situations that these good people go through that I have not put down, but for someone to say that they don't want to work because thay are lazy is an understatement.
It's the law that defines them not they themselves.

hii all friends can all off u go throw ti this nink..

What a mess! politicians have never been known for exceptionally high moral values. As for the recent Act passed by the Commons to allow MP's freedom that the electorate may not have! Put up by a poorly informed Tory MP and passed by a pile of Labour MP's. They don't wish the electorate to see their little financial fiddles! Not that they play at all well. Members of the electorate are now inundated with Quangos so that bits of paper abound
everywhere. Let us have ALL MP's included in annual tests for performance. And stiff ones for would be Ministers. Nice if all were actually elected. Fair do for all!

I had a dream last night..!
without going to the details of it, I can assure you that an amnesty is around the corner! watch out guys.
julia.

hii all does anybody know wot is legacy case its for only asylum seekers?... wot about non asylum case like visa over styed who is waiting from long time and have no answer from home office...if any body know tell me plzzzz...

United Kingdom its consider to be one of the must flexible and comprehensive country in the world where his population including immigrants live in parfait appearance harmony. Don't get me wrong there the word appearance is just to express the everyday stress and fear that immigrants carried out with them and have to live with. Must of the time they don't show out because they are illegal in the country. As I said UK is a tolerant country that why the question of amnesty is brought up. This denote that the government do care about the question of immigration and about those who are in the country illegally. Thanks to Mr. Ken Livingstone who have brought this question in front of your attention so you can listen the cry of 1/2 millions humans hidden behind a sheet of paper. come on only for this time let put that smile on their face by signing this amnesty.

Ben

344. At 08:46 PM on 18 Jul 2007, Derek Phibes wroteThere is no such thing as an 'irregular' immigrant.
What could that possibly mean anyhow? Any immigrant to the UK who avoids the legal immigration process is an ILLEGAL immigrant: a criminal.
This is an absurd simplification you lots are all criminals!!! Why? Just because I say so!!! Brilliant, to save your time and my time I would just say this, a person can neither be criminalised by assumption nor by analogy, in CRIMINAL LAW we are all innocent until proven guilty, so find me the piece of legislation that says sneaking into this country or any other country for that matter is a criminal offence and you will have me shut up for ever. Thank God Criminal Law is not that simple other wise
1) we will have an army of lawyers and judges out of work
2) there are technical issues such as intention and whether it is objective or subjective the way it is applied to different crimes and how judges direct the juries accordingly Lord Diplock is in heaven still thinking about it.
I wish I could buy that nonsense of opposing illegal immigration but not legal, it is the same argument stretched when it is needed and applied to both, pick up the Daily Telegraph, I don鈥檛 want to say the Daily Mail, any day you feel like it, read and make up your mind.
306. At 03:21 PM on 23 Jun 2007, Maurice - Northumberland wrote I'm hard-working and honest (except for when I broke into your house).
I have so much respect for Britain the least I could say about it is that it is the country where I have been making my living 鈥揳lthough in the underground- for almost a decade now, and I have so much respect for the British People the majority of whom are decent man and women, but the ugly truth is that, when It comes to entering other people鈥檚 houses illegally i.e forcibly or without the owner consent stealing their wealth for centuries, shipping home everything of a value that could be found, including young men and women as slaves, changing the demographic landscape of many countries for ever, when it comes to that it is not the British who are going to go around lecturing the rest of the world on that. On these criminality and illegality issues I rest my case. Written with no pleasure whatsoever by daddai

Hundreds of thousands of failed asylum seekers may be allowed to settle permanently in Britain under a "back-door amnesty" scheme.

dereck Phibes,
if you support MAKE POVERTY HISTORY, with an honest heart, which I presume you do like many other people against the amnesty, then you are a self contradicting deranged mess.

Dear all
Here is a photo of a failed asylum seeker family being deported, the Scots intellects say their population is declining faster than any other nation in Europe and these kids should be seeing as the future blood of Scotland. Damn nasty amnesty man. How wonderful life is without those bloody foreigners ay.
If you have spare time read through the comments, trust me guys you will have no comment.

The failed migrants told its their right to stay

Hundreds of thousands of asylum seekers are set to be granted an 'amnesty' to stay in Britain - on human rights grounds.

Border and Immigration Agency (BIA),
Case Resolution Programme - FAQs

Is this an amnesty?

No, each case will be evaluated on its individual merits, with an assessment of any human rights factors that may be relevant. A decision will then be made on whether the particular case justifies granting leave or effecting removal.

There is 'No Amnesty' - There is 'No Amnesty' - There is 'No Amnesty'

Dear all
Those who admire Nicolas Sarkozy鈥檚 rhetoric and tough stance on immigration, check this out!!!!

As somebody who has been on my local council's housing waiting list for 13 years, I'd like to address all the wealthy pro amnesty people. It is people like ME that an amnesty would most negatively impact upon, it is alright for YOU as you own your own homes. Once granted an amnesty, watch these people push in infront of people like me in the housing queue.... Immigration in general negatively affects us poor people, & when we complain, you sit in your ivory towers & yell 'racist' at us! NO to an amnesty, YES to tough/strict border controls.

Dear Charlotte
I do not think the thirteen years you have spent waiting has got anything to do with illegal migrants, what you are expressing is a mere sub-conscious resentment more than anything else. However according to a police report published last year the amount of wasted tax that the treasury could net out of those illegal if they are regularised is 3 billion a year, also according to the IPPR a total of at least 1 billion could be raised by making the same move, with all this money your waiting time could be cut shorter rather than deporting all illegal migrants which would cost at least 4 billion, it really could be a win win situation, think about it.
I could be your next door neighbour, if someone breaks in to your house, do not expect me to help or call the police, sorry you are a very nice lady but I have been driven to desperate measures and my life has been reduced to attempting survival not being a good neighbour.
Nity nite
daddai

Dear Charlotte
I do not think the thirteen years you have spent waiting has got anything to do with illegal migrants, what you are arguing is a sub-conscious resentment more than anything else. However according to a police report published last year the amount of wasted tax that the treasury could net out of those illegal if they are regularised is 3 billion a year, also according to the IPPR a total of at least 1 billion could be raised by making the same move, with all this money your waiting time could be cut shorter rather than deporting all illegal migrants which would cost at least 4 billion, it really could be a win win situation, think about it.
I could be your next door neighbour, if someone breaks in to your house, do not expect me to help or call the police, sorry you are a very nice lady but I have been driven to desperate measures and my life has been reduced to attempting survival not being a good neighbour.
Nity nite
daddai

,the only deference betweene, you and me ,you are lucky to be borne in england ,and me in afriqua,you are lucky your government is watch in on you ,and i am an lucky because mine is not,way you have the wright to go were you please ,but i cant,why you have to chose ,and i cant,our diference is were we are,united kingdom still make in there fourtune on the back of countrys like mine ,the still suportine my gouvernement policy,for the name of business.can you not see a round you, we all are immigrant in this world ,the big eat the small

Any such Amnesty would bring the Government down quicker than the Twin Towers - so you can all forget it - go back to your roots and help where you are needed!

Dear Charlotte..
You've failed to idenitfy those who are failing you; I wonder why you keep voting for them ..isn't it time you changed your voting patterns? are you a lifetime member of Status Quo club?
The establishment is failing eveyone..I'm about to invent an eternal engine for a huge ship ..we'll embarque all these migrants on it and start the engine which has no breaks by the way ...this way they'll keep sailing non stop ..and they can't make it to our borders ..
my Dear Charlotte ..there is enough for everyone out there ...supply is unlimited ..tightness is in hearts and minds not in space ...
My dear...those who set the agenda are in control of the outcome ...!
I wish you the best and I understand where you're coming from , in the same way I understand those who are looking for a place under the sun of freedom ... we're all here on this planet for a very short term ...let's make the best of this journey.. a smile can make a big difference and it's free ...
good night love.

The oyster card system must already be an enormous boost in tracking down illegal immigrants-they can trace every tube system visited.

Unbelievable
As expected it has begun,people are now blaming illegal immigrants for their mis-happenings. I wonder who they would blame if their were no illegal immigrants!!!!
The one person I find the most annoying is Sir Andrew Green, this guy thinks like his name "GREEN" , he brands illegal immigrants as low skilled workers. I know illegal immigrants who make more money than him, let alone most people. One of them is a web site developer. And if you are reading this Andrew Green, you really are Green

Dear Sir & Madame

I am a forein myself, been living in UK with my family since year 2000 and our case was "closed" 'cos the lawers did not do the work properly...

Anyhow, after getting a new solicitor he got us back on track (under section 4) BUT since then, there is no desicion!!

We ARE NOT entiteld to WORK, and at same time we get people on neck saying "you foreign people dont work and claim money" .... this not our fault, it's the british home office system fault - isnt it?!

It would be very great for an amnesty so FINALLY I can have the right to STUDY, TO WORK, TO HAVE A LIFE ... and not like now, living like an "open prison" :(

Wish you all had been in same situation like mine and all asylem seekers + imigrants then you would understand how it is!

Hopefully one day soon, we will be blessed with happyness and joy by GOD

Half a million illegal immigrants should be given the right to stay in Britain, a think tank has said.

Asylum seekers could be allowed to stay due to Home Office turmoil

l support ken 100% amnest should go on.l dont understand why the govenment is taking longtime to decide this issue

l support ken 100% amnest should go on.l dont understand why the govenment is taking longtime to decide this issue

yes i too agree with mathew govenment is taking longtime to decide this issue

yes amnesty now as soon as better

Up to 200,000 asylum seekers will be allowed to remain in Britain because Home Office officials admit they will never be able to track them down.

Excellent, giving amnesty to failed asylum seekers is the only right thing because people have integrated in the communities now.

amnesty we want

Immigration: Well: to me as a pensioner,Widow,Mother,Grandmother, soon to be Great Grandmother, Volunteer,and voter,depair of those that perport to speak on my behalf,being paid by me their wages,pension,redundency,golden hand shakes. I live within the law of the land,a Democractic society, two world wars to acheive this,I have the right by birth to insist that others can join us can only on this understanding,abide by the British rule of law, or leave, forget Human rights,forget EU that is farcicial, if one breaks the rule of law of the land,one automatically loses their right to insist they are different, I paying taxes,never receiving benefits are sick to the teeth of the immigration talk, talk is all that is happening,in the meantime British born old and new are losing out, can I suggest, God forbid if there was another war would our Country suddenly empty of the so called here for a better life people, or can we assume they would serve Queen and Country. Perhaps if these so called people were invited to join our Armed Forces and return to their Country of birth,would they be willing? Pcrane

So the Lonodn Mayor thinks we should reward all the people that came here illegally by giving them exactly what they want? So I suppose we should give thiefs, money? People speeding, fast cars? Perverts a brothel?
This man is a halfwit, but the bigger halfwits are the ones that elected him, only in London!!!!

387. At 12:39 PM on 04 Nov 2007, hakim wrote:
amnesty we want

Well you ain't going to get it!

Hey Mike and Andrew Davidson, the amnesty is coming whether you don't like it or whether you really don't like it. These people want to work so give them that chance unlike some British individuals who are on benefits simply because they can get it. Did you see panorama 2 months ago about British teenagers who refuse to go to work.
Better yet, the government is currently talking about forcing teenagers into work or else face a fine otherwise stay in school till they are 18.
So what does that tell you about some British individuals. Imagine growing in a society on benefits for the rest of your life, it will mess up your eagle.
Man, if you have never been poor, you will sound like yourselves.
Remember the slave trade, how some British patriots worked so hard to abolish it, there were individuals like you who were totally against it. But you know the what happened eventually, and so will the amnesty.
Amen

Crane, Andrew I can鈥檛 even be bothered to respond to your arguments, you know why? Because there is no argument in your argument, no essence no intellectual depth whatsoever, the same old scapegoat nonsense.

Mike, good to hear from you again, we鈥檝e been here for more than a year Miky haven鈥檛 we? You know what we will be here for a long time to come, if you don鈥檛 like us close your eyes and you won鈥檛 see us anymore but that doesn鈥檛 mean we don鈥檛 exist, one thing you can take for granted guys is that don鈥檛 be fooled us to where these half a million people鈥檚 loyalty lies.

Yes we have Daddai - and your still a law breaker along with how many more, who knows!

But nothing can change illegality into legality - the Political Party that does it is Dead for ever and they know it!

ILlegal immigrant. should be given amnesty for this becomes a precedent for other to follow. Those who legally apply are either delay entry into a country mainstream because this illegal immigrants back log or occupy the slots alloted to the legal immigrants. So be firm... Not only in U.K. but also in the U.S.

Yes Mike, illegality can be changed to legality and the opposite can happen, the execution of witches was legal it became illegal, converting to another religion, on the other hand was illegal now it legal.
What has changed in the US before and after the civil right movement? The ghettos are still there the colour is still there, nothing has changed on the ground, what really has changed is people鈥檚 state of mind.
I鈥檓 still here and will remain here for a long time to come, I just hope that your obsession does not go that far that you start seeing me in your dreams.

Click top right audio&video
This report suggest that %90 percent of workers in the Chinese catering industry are illegal, so next time you grab a Chinese on your way home think, because that food may stink of one of my brothers or sisters sweat.

It may sound ridiculous but i see the immigration debate as more of time issue, the longer you stay less immigrant you are. A classical example to demonstrate my point is Michael Howard the former conservative leader. His parent were once immigant and infact could be illegal but after 60 years the is now a poacher turn game keeper. Again most will argue that the colonial era was so long ago and does not influence the current debate. think it is central to thedebate. Since when does it become important to carry a passport to go to another country and seek their permission to do anything work, marry etc. We continue to hear this selfish language that the country can allow "high skill immigrants" doctos, business men nurses etc trained by poor countries to come to the uk, easily lured away to come here at a great financail and social loss to the mother countries. Those who are against immigration are by default against all international treaties. If the bristish dont want anyone in their country they should keep quiet and allow each country to do what they think is best to stop their citizen emigrating to the UK even if that country chooses to shoot their citizens to prevent them coming here to innconvinience the brits. The past of every nation shapes the future. Developing countries are contiually told how to live their lives what their goverment should provide them some obligated byy international law. In fact the world has always been a global village distorted by imaginary lines as borders and papers as passport. This is similar to territorail protection by early man, the chimpazees, and many other species to ensure survival. in fact the native population is scared of competition cause they have been cocoon for long and want the good times to continue. th irony is it is these immigrants who make everything so chaep and contribute enormously to the uk economic boom.

GOOD FOR YOU Gabby THANK YOU

If the bristish dont want anyone in their country they should keep quiet and allow each country to do what they think is best to stop their citizen emigrating to the UK even if that country chooses to shoot their citizens to prevent them coming here to innconvinience the brits.

the british have never said they don't want anyone in their country and they have a history of taking in war refugees and migrants from ex-colonies/commonwealth

the british believe in free speech for everyone so they exercise it themselves

the british would never condone killing anyone except in self defence and even then our laws are fairly harsh on when such a defence may be allowable

Hey there, Mike - Northumbaland 393

Did you say, "Nothing can change illegality into legality"?
Is this based on the laws made?
Coz I can tell you that the leaders of the slave trade were Britons who have stubbonly refused to appologise for it.
But here is the point I'm trying to make. Not only Africans were forced into Britain as slaves, but would you have branded them as illegal immigrants then?
Stop, think and receive!!! You are sneaking Africans into your country because you have a use for them, but then they were not so-called illegal immigrants. But at a more contemporary dacade and time you will consider them to be illegal immigrants but why??? Because you have no use for them!!!!

Spare me the "Nothing can change illegality into legality" rubbish coz I don't want to hear it.

And Yes, the political party advocating for an amnesty may be dead and buried but it will be the home office to grant it in the end as you will find. I will reitterate that an amnesty is on the horizon whether you don't like it or whether you really don't like it.
End

Helooooooo =]

How Are You?

What You Been Up Too?

Wb
Your bestest Friend =]

Wooooop!

XXXX

I am a british citizen with few more brothers and sisters who are also british but we have been struggling for the rest of the family who wasnt born in uk. My rest of family has lived in uk since their very young age and highly qulaified, aware of UK culture and society but we have been let down and not been treated fairly. I have a question....why you allow so many people to enter uk who purely come on the basis of abusing the country and those kind of people already have big bank statements to show to enter the country and they get the visa on the 1st time they apply and honest and innocent people like us struggle and struggle for many many years for our right. I am a british and I should be given right to keep rest of my family with us. I paid high fees to solicitors but they play with our applications. Where should we turn who should we tell?We strongly believe that britain is our country and we are dual national. We respect the law. Please give us right to work so that we can help ourselves as well as the nation. I assure if you allow people like our family to reside legally in UK it will bring huge positive difference to the nation. Please do not ignore our comments because we have nowhere to go and no one to tell about how badly we are suffering. Many thanks

What's the matter Bob, caught your tongue??

What's the matter Bob, caught your tongue??

The other two immigration strands have been taken over by Giant Hogweed, so am posting here until this one falls victim too.

To get rid of Giant Hogweed, is going to take a team of superbly uneducated and magnificently unskilled labourers, sweating for a pittance because they love their country and do not care about earnings.

Is this a metaphor of how our civilisation is going to self-terminate? Unless some Beowulf appears?

Hi Ed

Your posts are pure application. A great relief to me - they mean there is sometimes some point to learning, the getting of wisdom, etc.

See you on the other side.

i agree with everything people have been saying, but be fair they are taking our jobs

Catherine (#407)

That's not all:
/blogs/newsnight/2007/11/the_big_immigration_debate.html

Food for thought for Ken: New Left feminism has, looking at developed world demographics, turned out to be a far more destructive force than many may ever have thought. How many of its activists were rebellious Orthodox Jewesses possibly because of a gender biasing autosomal NCAH given that 1/3 Ashkenazi are heterozygotes for the Chr6p21 CYP21 polymorphism (1/27 are homozygotes)? It's the most common autosomal recessive polymorphism known to man, but it's highest in this group (which may explain the salience of Jews in the feminist movement), it has lowest prevalence in the Blacks. I am suggesting that this may explain ethnic differences in brain/behaviour gender overlap.

Radical feminism's main 'achievement', it seems to me, has just been the facilitation of a slow, ethnically differential, demographic extinction whilst increasing dysgenesis, in that the indigenous population's birth rate has fallen well below replacement level since the 1960s whilst also producing (numerically, through a process explained elsewhere in NN) less bright children, which in turn has necessitated compensatory mass (non-secular, often Black or Muslim in the UK) immigration to keep the school rolls up. Did the 60s-70s left-wing activists ever appreciate that this would be the inevitable consequence, or were they just fielded as 'useful idiots' by harder core Trotskyites?

Is it time for Ken and friends to do a U turn, or is it now too late?

By the same genetic mechanism, the converse would also be the case, namely that whilst NCAH affected females would be slightly androgenised through the CYP21 polymorphism mediated shift in sex-steroid metabolism, NCAH affected males would be slightly estrogenised, making them more verbal and perhaps more shrewd in business/law/politics than normal males. A sign for this might be shorter stature males, shorter stature also being a consequence of estrogenisation.

Edith (#404) Which element(s) of below replacement level, differential, fertility, its politics, causes and consequences, do you not understand/accept?

Edith (#404) Which element(s) of below replacement level, differential, fertility, its politics/drivers and consequences, do you not understand/accept? Or do you think this debate is just an opportunity for a nice online get together and chat?

Edith (#404) With all due respect, which element(s) of below replacement level, differential, fertility, its politics/drivers and consequences, do you not understand/accept? Or do you think this blog should just be an opportunity for a civil online get-together and chat - i.e. entertainment? I can see the latter's merits if what I say is true, as it seems there's not much that any of us will do about any of this if we just sink into denial.

Perhaps Newsnight is destined to go the same way as the rest of TV, i.e. mass entertainment/distraction.

what are you people talking about????!!!!
Will someone please elaborate? I'm I missing something? Gosh!!!!!

Let's just take a look at the word illegal, without 'immigrant'. It relates to braking the law, and I don't blame all people that make tough comments because much of their opinion relates to this word.
To ask my opinion about something, I would answer only if I have knowledge about it, otherwise I wouldn't be ashamed to say sorry I don't know much about this. so everybody who knows about illegal immigrants should put things in a scale.
How much does the economy benefit from this category of people.
How integrated are they in the society.
How likely are they to commit crimes or break the Law and the impact that causes the deportation.

Over 1 Billion pounds are generated as tax revenues. All people that have been here for over 5 years speak good English and are fairly integrated and I鈥檓 sure that everyone knows a foreigner that has been here for a few years.

An illegal immigrant avoids every situation of confrontation with police, because it costs him deportation. This equals (no crime) and becomes a way of behaviour for not breaking the law.

Deporting someone that has been here over five years and is a good member of the society is contradictory.
Speaking of my self. I have been here almost 9 years. this country gave me the right to study, gave me the working papers and permit without any restriction, which encouraged me to work , not take any benefits. As every year goes by I integrate more in the British society.
After 8 years a Home Office worker picked up my file and said that my asylum application doesn't have good grounds so, GO Back.
Had I been given an answer in the beginning, the impact would have been less. I earn 40.000 Pounds per year and I pay 10.000 pounds Tax per year. Wanting to deport people like me equals less tax revenue. simple.
Meanwhile I am completing a Degree in business and still working with my papers.
Based on logic , what is the crime that I am committing???
what law am I breaking that effects others as equal members of the society???
We are only asking for our contribution to be recognised and have the right to stay like every other INTEGRATED member of the society.

on 26 Nov 2007, vini wrote:

I have friend working for the home office and he tell me that soon you will hear good news, for people do have a case like your self.

Ken is right and i do believe he speaks for Londoners on this issue. That is, apart from the bit about inheritting the problem from the Tories which is a bit silly - i think we need to study history a bit more (I'm not a Tory supporter)!

We need these imigrants to stay and do the jobs they are doing. To round them all up and send them back to where they came from would be a pointless and expensive waist of time.

Also, if the system made a mistake, and is actually responsible for allowing them in, in the first place, then the label "illegal" should not apply.

Secondly i believe it is unfair to discriminate people on the basis of being non-European as the government are proposing in new imigration laws. This is verging on racism and is disrespectful to our friends across the British Commonwealth who support Britain. Asside from the issue of refugees, imgration laws should simply be about what people have to offer (in the widest possible sense) by being here in the UK and nothing else.

Thirdly, everyone should be given the opportunity to learn English and learn about our society, by making self-study material freely available on-line everywhere. And, making all 大象传媒 content freely available to the whole world, not just license payers, is in all our interests. It means that when people arrive in our country they will be better prepared to make a contribution.

Lets be pro-active in getting the people over here we need to boost our economy and build a better future for us all. Its time we stopped being a European ghetto and embraced the world properly and effectively.

19,000 asylum-seekers are allowed to stay as ministers deny amnesty

Nineteen thousand asylum-seekers whose cases date back to 1994 are to be allowed to stay in the country, the Home Office announced last night.

Tens of thousands more are also expected to be told that they can stay as officials work through a backlog of up to 450,000 files found in the immigration service. The figures are based on the completion of work on 52,000 files from the backlog. If a similar trend continues with the rest of the case files a total of about 160,000 asylum-seekers will be able to remain.

MORE than 166,000 asylum seekers are set to be allowed to remain in Britain under a 鈥渟tealth鈥� amnesty as part of a desperate Home Office attempt to clear the backlog, it emerged last night.

Some 19,000 asylum seekers on so-called 鈥渓egacy鈥� files dating back years have already been told they can now stay 鈥� more than a third of the cases considered so far.

If the approval rate 鈥� almost four times the normal one 鈥� continues then tens of thousands of the 450,000 backlog cases to be examined will be given the green light.

166,500 MORE ASYLUM SEEKERS CAN STAY

Tuesday December 18,2007

thousands of the 450,000 backlog cases to be examined will be given the green light.

19,000 asylum-seekers are allowed to stay as ministers deny amnesty

MORE than 166,000 asylum seekers are set to be allowed to remain in Britain under a 鈥渟tealth鈥� amnesty as part of a desperate Home Office attempt to clear the backlog, it emerged last night.

Some 19,000 asylum seekers on so-called 鈥渓egacy鈥� files dating back years have already been told they can now stay 鈥� more than a third of the cases considered so far.

If the approval rate 鈥� almost four times the normal one 鈥� continues then tens of thousands of the 450,000 backlog cases to be examined will be given the green light.

166,500 MORE ASYLUM SEEKERS CAN STAY

Tuesday December 18,2007

thousands of the 450,000 backlog cases to be examined will be given the green light.

Home Office grants 19,000 asylum seekers permission to remain


路 Cases reviewed in effort to clear backlog from 1994
路 Illegal migrant found working at Home Office

Alan Travis, home affairs editor
Tuesday December 18, 2007
The Guardian

More than 19,000 asylum seekers, some of whose cases date back more than 10 years, have finally been told they can stay in the country, the Home Office said last night. They are among the first tranche of 52,000 cases that have been looked at as part of a Home Office "legacy" drive to clear a backlog of between 400,000 and 450,000 files.
The disclosure was made as the Home Office embarrassingly

165,000 asylum seekers to get 'amnesty' because of Home Office blunder over files
by JAMES SLACK - More by this author 禄 Last updated at 12:28pm on 18th December 2007

Comments (102)

As many as 165,000 asylum seekers are to be granted an "amnesty" to live in Britain, it was revealed.

The vast bulk of the migrants are failed refugees whose files were left lying in boxes by bungling Home Office staff.

They have now been living here so long that officials have ruled that it would be a breach of their human rights to kick them out.

Ministers admitted that the first 19,000 have already been granted leave to remain under what the Tories described as a "stealth amnesty".

the problem with granting amnesty to illegal immigrants is that it augments the national population with people who dared where others feared to tread - do we need any more rule=breakers? would it be better to start recruiting indiginous people at fair wages or abroad through solubrious channels? why are we fanning the flames of illegal trade all the time - war and weapons, sex and drugs, labour and laundry

it may be a false economy to cry 'we need them for the jobs'

the political class seems almost suicidal in its policies, suicidal for the ordinary person but i expect the elite will survive

i'm sure there are plenty of honest decent people in worn torn sectarian countries all over the world who would gladly shed the fetters of race and creed and help build a stronger secular world with us - let's find those people instead of just giving up and saying 'oh well, survival of the fittest etc.' Darwin would role in his grave when he sees how much science has taught us and we just follow a path yo violence, deception, greed and selfishness.

Amnesty should not be only for the failed asylum seekers but for all the over stayers, illegal immigrants who are working on low paid wages , cash in hand and paying no taxes and N I Contributions. They are availing the NHS and other facilities. By granting them stay, there would be less burden on the Immigration System and courts and they will pay their taxes and work for the betterment of the society. Further the increase in the application fee and use of this immigrants applicants money only to remove failed asylum seekers is discriminatory and not an appropriate solution. To remove half a million people ( failed asylum seekers and overstayers)from the UK by the Immigration Authorities is impossible and is a day dream.There are examples of amnesty granted by spain and other European Countries. Solution is to grant two years leave to remain to these people and indefinite leave to remain on completion of two years if they show that they have clean history and work record .

I AGRRE WITH THOSE WHO ARE FOR THE AMNISTY BUT WOULD MAKE CLEAR ONE THING.
MANY OF THE COMMENTATORS REFER TO IT AS AN AMNISTY FOR ILLEGAL ASYLUM SEEKERS.
MY POINT IS THAT THERE IS NOTHING LIKE AN ILLEGAL ASYLUM SEEKER. ONCE YOU ARE AN ASYLUM SEEKER, YOU ARE LEGAL SINCE IT IS A LEGAL TERM FOR LEGAL PEOPLE.
HOWEVER EVEN THOUGH THESE PEOPLE ARE LEGAL, THEY HAVE NO RIGHT TO WORK OR TO GO TO SCHOOL LIKE OTHER LEGAL PERSONS. THAT'S WHY THEIR LEGALITY IS A IRONIC ONE.
WE NEED AN AMNISTY WICH CAN GIVE THEM AS MANY RIGHTS AS OTHER LEGAL PERSONS IN THIS COUNTRY HAVE.

If they come here work pay the taxes ,bills what's wrong with it?it will help the countery.

Kudos Ken Livingstone, long live the Mayor of London for his positive and fair conments on the issue of Amnesty

It is quite unfortunate that the issue of illegal immigration is one of the most politicised topic in the UK. Irrespective of its importance, politicians trade their sense of humaity and sencerity for political benefits.

It is also unfortunate that the elitist and previleged class chides away from the reality on such important issue that erodes the basic fundamental Human rights of more than half a million people, a senario that could be very much likened to modern Slavery.

I will challenge my critics to prove me wrong, otherwise, how could it be fair to regard certain people as 'Illegal Immigrants'? even though they have so well contributed to the economic stabiltiy of the UK for years, or how humane it is, to use immigration officers to chase fellow humans and prosecute them? simply because they want to work or already working and earning a living as oposed to being a liability to the Govt, or how can anybody convince me that denial of 'Illegal Immigrants' from using public facilities such as the NHS, opening of bank account etc, or not being able to work cause of fear or been detected, or work bellow the minimum wage bracket, or cant move free from fear of not being detected, cant get married except must go back to original country that he/she migrated from even though he/she cant fit in anymore haven stayed here for years, which also could lead to job lost, or not liable to any form of loan facility even if entitled to? etc.

How can anyone convince me, that these are not the Hallmark of Slavery in the twentyfirst century?

God save the Queen and bless the United Kingdom.

I beleave that this amnesty would be helpful, but would undermind those who are working hard to get here legally.

Im still waiting for consideration of my application since Nov 2006. Ive got a son A british citizen and Im still leaving with my partner.is not really pair to him to worked harder to support me and my family.I am really upset because I am willing to work.how many nights do I need to count to see my family.how many occassions that ive missed.. i Dont want them to think that I forgot them already...all illegal workers r came here to work because they want them to give the best life for there family.they suffered already please ... amnesty is the best way...cleared everything and starts a again... god bless you all.