大象传媒

Latest London terrorist attempt?

Not shaken but stirred

.... incompetent cowards

vikingar

I think both Olly Grender and Daniel Finkelstein need to go and have a good hard think about whether their own thinking "...suited the situation, suited the moment.". I'm afraid I find their apparent expectations fanciful and of another era.

The dedication and efficiency of the men and women of the Emergency Services, Police, RAF against the PM on a 'catwalk-tour-in-wellies? I know which speaks more of empathy, to me, thank you very much.

I think it's high time that our Commentators broadened their horizons a little and added more depth to their purpose. A 'jobsworth' approach is out of step with our time.

Thanks.

A 25-year old Mercedes, two standard propane cylinders that would eventually have split if heated for a while in a burning car with 12 gallons of extra petrol, nails on the car floor: ANYONE could assemble and park this load just about anywhere, and basically it would produce a bonfire like the cars set alight in the poll tax riots. The same cars driven into a crowd at a bus-stop would probably be more lethal.

By closing down London and screaming 'Al Qaeda' it is the police and media who are terrorizing the public to suit their own agendas.

Thank you, Mark Urban, for a balanced analysis. And for a couple of other expert views, debunking this latest 'Al Qaeda outrage', see these accounts from real experts (an ex-CIA counter-terrorism agent on NBC, then the head of an explosives company in the Guardian):

We all have to thank God that there has been no loss of life
I can never understand the thinking of people who wish to harm others

'for the acts of terrorism to be effective their message must be widely known and possibly witnessed by many, for it must demonstrate to all the righteous power of the powerless. Thus, terrorists need the news media as their publicity agent.'

Paul Mason's language of analysis gets 5 stars.

Thank you Martin (Comment No 5) for your posting and the links you supplied.

I agree with the fact that hysteria from any quarter is most unhelpful.

However, I feel obliged to say that I do think the police and many in the media did rather well yesterday (Friday, 29th) by clearly taking care to speak with rather more restraint than I have come to expect (and regret). I think the police had to do what they did in sealing off certain areas.

Today, however, as I write, I hear an intermittent hysterical tone yet again coming from the TV set (re: Glasgow) and slightly frenzied tones in questions like "What's your reaction?" etc.etc. I question why we need to know these things 'as-they- are-happening'. What or whom does this help? I do not see how my listening to wave upon wave of hysterical vox-pops or speculative commentary arms me in any way to be of any use to anything or anyone. And my underlying contention is that to live vicariously via broadcasted hysteria and raised cortisol levels has nothing at all to do with living empathetically.

I know from first hand experience in certain situations (geographic and political) beyond these shores, that before the advent of "24/7 Rolling News", the 大象传媒 (and, dare I say it, 'The British Mind') did immense good in certain circumstances where others were indeed manipulating and exploiting agendas (via police & media etc.) in abhorent ways.

Like you, I do applaud and appreciate the factual and sober analysis that we can still, mercifully, get from time to time via the 大象传媒.

I suppose I'd like to think that as the 大象传媒 is paid for by us and is "ours", we can, could and should support a view which might protect it from being being ratings-driven. In short, I'd rather wait for facts and know where to turn for this than be almost 'pornographically' 'entertained' by rabble-rousing rubbish.

Thank you

Ref Martin #5

'debunking this latest 'Al Qaeda outrage' ..By closing down London and screaming 'Al Qaeda' it is the police and media who are terrorizing the public to suit their own agendas'

So heard about Glasgow airport incident? nothing that seems out of the ordinary here?

There is a difference between being 'fair' & being in 'denial' as to what is happening.

Pretty clear what your agenda is :(

vikingar

It's clear Al Qaeda is trying to pressure Gordon Brown to "Spanish out" of Iraq by showing him they can hit Britain any time, anywhere including where his family and friends live. We'll see if the British have any more mettle than the Spaniards have. Will Britain fight on or cut and run? The recent defeat in the Straits of Hormous at the hands of Iran recently is not a good sign.

US Warned of Glasgow Threat Two Weeks Ago

Ref Martin #5

"By closing down London and screaming 'Al Qaeda' it is the police and media who are terrorizing the public to suit their own agendas"

Care to review your position given developments?

Or is it these developments & this incident don't tally with your views on 'terrorism' period, irrespective of emergent details/facts.

vikingar

The Glasgow incident also involved setting fire to a car. Hardly the 'new level of sophistication in Al Qaeda's operations' in the 'war on terror', as Lord Stevens claimed in the News of the World.

Of course it's frightening and utterly deplorable that disaffected young men with psychopathic tendences are prepared to more or less indiscrimately attempt to kill innocent civilians in Britain.

But the few small groups involved in the planning and attempted execution of these sickening crimes are hardly a 'sophisticated' army with developed logistics, command structure, weapons, safe houses and the rest.

Over-dramatizing the situation is thoroughly counterproductive, in that it feeds the pathological self-dramatization of the sick individuals who want to disrupt our society and its institutions - it also does much of their work for them by creating the disruption which is one of their main goals.

Gordon Brown and Jacqui Smith have provided a model of sober and balanced response, as did Mark Urban on Friday. They quite rightly appeal to the only people who can, over the medium to long term, reduce the threat: the communities in which our new style of amateur terrorists live. This is not a war, as Brown correctly implied, but a struggle for the 'hearts and minds' of the British muslim community.

In the meantime, of course, the police must take all necessary measures to tackle this deranged criminal activity. In my view, over-dramatizing the situation is not only unnecessary and unhelpful, but counterproductive, effectively (in the terrorist's sick mind) glorifying the role of 'sophisticated' global warrior. The media must also be 'vigilant' in resisting a natural temptation to make these sick criminals anything more than they really are.

I find it reassuring that people who are mad enough to wish to kill others indiscrimately have not, in the six years since 9-11, displayed anything like the sophistication of the attacks on America. The IRA developed a relatively 'sophisticated' logistics and command structure, and had access to military-grade plastic explosives, RPGs and other weaponry much more lethal than a burning car.

I'm also reassured that given the number of vehicles on the road in Britain, very few people intentionally use these potentially lethal machines for anything but transport. Anyone could, for example, drive into the approaching stream of vehicles on the other side of a motorway, but, amazingly perhaps, they never do, not even jihadis. The amateurish attacks of the last few days should be ridiculed as a grotesque anomaly, and muslim communities should be urged to condemn and shun anyone attracted to, or apologizing for, these sick antics.

But anyone can set fire to a car: don't encourage other potential 'martyrs' by exaggerating and over-dramatizing these sad anomalies as 'a new stage in the global war on terror'

Ref Martin #13

Yours not an answer

"la la la .. its not happening"

.... is not a defence its denail

vikingar

Sensible comments from Martin #5 and #13.

The media has succeeded (through over excitement perhaps) to make this entire sequence of events surreal. The picture of the off-duty policeman (?) hosing down a seemingly hooded jihadi aeronautical engineer who allegedly has special skills in gas fluid modelling, with no sign of a fire inside his jeep at the time, is just Kafkaesque contrasted with the policemnan's interview account:

though I'm sure it all makes sense to somebody.

I eagerly await the full story of all of this to date, somewhat "Team America" sequence of events as to date it's got the lot, terrorism, immigration, Muslims, angry junior doctors, global warming... and all within 48 hours or so of Brown taking on the job and a new Home Secretary.

"Engineer Kafeel Ahmed, 28, told relatives he was working on a top-secret project in the UK 鈥渓inked to global warming鈥� and would complete his mission."

"Ahmed, 28, who was previously thought to be called Khalid, has a masters degree in aeronautical engineering and a doctorate in computational fluid dynamics, a highly specialised subject in which computers are used to simulate the flow of fluids and gases."

The 'facts' keep changing of course.