大象传媒

All UK crimes involving parties that are inter-racial should be classed as racial/racist/race related crimes like in US?

This is done in US where 90% of certain types of crime (most common crimes against the person) are carried out by 'black/ethnic people'.

At the moment in the UK, a 'white person' who attacks a 'coloured person' is automatically suspected &/or accused of a racist crime but same does not apply for a coloured person attacking someone is who is 'white'?

Isn't it time that UK crime is recorded properly by police & media?

wholesale gas down 25%ish in 3 months

shhh. don't tell anyone. must keep them bills high and transfer the wealth of the many to the few.

'1. At 15:48 4th Jan 2012, nautonier
Isn't it time that UK crime is recorded properly by police & media?'

You'd think, but... probably.. not gonna happen.

Tonight we look at the ongoing fallout on the ongoing slant of the only ratings and agenda perfect storm many media still seem to obsessing over.

The wheels of justice seem to have ground pretty slowly, but some sort of a result has oozed out.

However, not just the 大象传媒, but all media seem to have spun this one as an M&S murder, namely not just any murder, but a [prefix] murder.

Hence, in future, in reporting (and possibly messing up any fair trial), I am anticipating headlines revolving the 'pissed-out-their-chavvy-treeist murder' or 'too-thick-to-not-drive-awayist murder of all kinds of folk who were simply unlucky enough to be of a certain type topped by another type.

Unless, of course, exceptions apply. Then the unique thing kicks in.

'Justice must not only done, but seen to be done. Depending'

Spiffy. Lessons will be said to be learned, but won't be, and as memories in some politico-media quarters rival a mayfly with Alzheimers, the stage is set for the same tired cliches to be rehashed pretty much monthly.

Ethical Man would be proud of such recycling.

MY BIT OF 'ONGOING FALLOUT' 鈥� ART OF THE STATE PARENTS

If problem parents create problem kids (can Dave be wrong?) then the STATE must share responsibility. We have STATE ante-natal provision, STATE birthing provision, STATE post-natal provision, STATE nursery provision, and STATE schooling, RIGHT THROUGH CRISIS-PUBERTY! Those individuals who emerge from this PROCESS (note the industrial term) 'IN A STATE' - unable to cope with either the inside of their head or the outside world, RUN A HIGH RISK OF MAKING INCOMPETENT - 'ART OF THE STATE' - PARENTS.

We need (as proposed on the previous thread) 'STATE INTERVENTION' which is to say: LET'S HAVE INDEPENDENT INTERVENTION IN STATE FAILURE.

AND WHEN A BUNCH OF USERS ATTACK A GINGER BLOKE? (#1)

My understanding is that alcohol is not only the most common factor in violence, but it also is a releasing agent for all sorts of unadvised comment (or truth as we simple folk call it).

Alcohol is grossly connived at by government (many MPs are users) hence disingenuous strategies are resorted to by Westminster, like invoking 'racism'. When will the first MP admit to being a user, who tends towards revelatory acts and utterances when under the influence? Have we not just heard the amazing fact that police and hacks SHOULD NOT MIX ALCOHOL WITH CONVIVIALITY?

They never (choose to) join the dots.

Nuff sed

I see you've found a new story to vastly over hype this year. I suppose it makes a change from phone hacking.

The most trusted source of the most trusted media... according to some:)

Here's an article from another 'news' medium on this topic:



Plus some comments.

I am also reading of the turning point made by advances in science.

But some media seem to think some murders work 'better' (for what, other than ratings or agenda, is unclear) with a prefix.

These I no longer value for their analysis, or especially that of those they 'select', often to provide one degree of separation deniability.

3.
At 16:44 4th Jan 2012, JunkkMale wrote:

"You'd think, but... probably.. not gonna happen.
....
Spiffy. Lessons will be said to be learned, but won't be, and as memories in some politico-media quarters rival a mayfly with Alzheimers, the stage is set for the same tired cliches to be rehashed pretty much monthly."

++
Yes - tonight's programme very predictable from the same apologist mis-informers?

Lesson learned - 'black/ethnic people' in UK still disadvantaged as still subject to race hate crimes ... inference from media is ...?... because of ...?... by ....?...

In other words ? are racist and 'rest' are victims of this racism?

More sweeping politicised generalisations and/or by inference & use of cliches?

lessons learned ?
boredom factor?
politicised statements?
proper analysis of UK crime statistics?
what crimes are classed as racist & why?

Lesson learned
We've come along way but still much more to do before society becomes 'fair' ?

Solution? More of same from the old politicised agenda?

.
At 17:14 4th Jan 2012, barriesingleton wrote:
AND WHEN A BUNCH OF USERS ATTACK A GINGER BLOKE? (#1)

Well it can't be [ ? ] attack cos the poor blighter's ginger!

Westminster's HoC bar is ususally full of MP's as get subsidised plonk paid for by taxpayer - fortunately our MP's are generally too inert to be troubled by mere alchohol use? What's his face 'ginger' proved that - just locked him in his little office!

More dangerous than alchohol alone is a concoction of drugs & alchohol? No crime statistics for that one?

LET'S HAVE A HUMAN RIGHTS FEST - YOU ARE INVITED NAUTONIER (:o)

We know that no judge will send Johnnie-Villain-Foreigner back to his nasty homeland - BECAUSE THEY MIGHT HURT HIM.

Now we observe a judge sending two white men, convicted of race-based homicide, into a prison system well-full of black blokes (disproportionately disturbed, we are constantly told) with no apparent concern for their Human Rights.

Is it me?

鈥淚n other words ? are racist and 'rest' are victims of this racism?鈥�


Which tends to aggravate those who aren鈥檛 racist rather than educate those that are?

Heard one guy today on Radio 2鈥檚 Vine show claiming that Dobson & Norris were simply the sharp end of the stick, and that in reality the majority of the indigenous population are supremacists.

Can鈥檛 see that helping much either.

11. At 18:52 4th Jan 2012, barriesingleton wrote:

LET'S HAVE A HUMAN RIGHTS FEST - YOU ARE INVITED NAUTONIER (:o)

UK judiciary & legal system does not need human rights or a lecture there as we invented HR - starting with Magna Carta.

UK law better than human rights as based on Christian values as UK gave first human rights to Europe and UN. The law that was first to end emancipation in the 'civilised world' and give rights to the suffragettes, gay rights, women priests etc

UK does not need a lecture from anyone on human rights - we need to sack incompetent judges - rid UK of EU HRA straightjacket - get the best we have available to pull their wigs on & set them free to purge our collective conscience a relate to a sensible sentencing & legal framework with adequate appeal mechanisms.

UK has best legal system in the world when it is allowed to operate without undue interference & with the right relationships between judiciary, CPS, police & parliament, media etc.

Best HR fest is to bin them all & allow our best legal professionals to get on with what they do best? Free it up - speed it up - get better decisions at lower cost

I think its called freedom/liberty or some confused phrase like that?

12.
At 19:07 4th Jan 2012, John_Bull wrote:


鈥淚n other words ? are racist and 'rest' are victims of this racism?鈥�


Which tends to aggravate those who aren鈥檛 racist rather than educate those that are?

++

Don't shoot the messenger - wait & seem what pearls of wisdom on tonight's NN?

If we get more of - there are still problems - black & coloured people still facing racism - my jibe at the politicised cliches used by mainstream media will be well founded?

Let's hope we get more than usual inference that most racism comes from indigenous white population and most if not all those who are black/coloured are victims here?

Anyone expecting any different from the political experts as carefully selected for their 'credentials'?

14. At 19:27 4th Jan 2012, nautonier wrote:


鈥淒on't shoot the messenger - wait & seem what pearls of wisdom on tonight's NN?鈥�

I think you鈥檝e read me wrong nautonier. - I completely agree with your analysis.

11. At 18:52 4th Jan 2012, barriesingleton wrote:

鈥淭HE HUMAN RIGHT(S) PARADOX鈥�

Where does the line between RIGHT & RIGHTS actually fall? Always was a contentious distinction.

Has Human Rights legislation clarified that? It anything it seems to have just turned a 鈥榮traight鈥� line into a 鈥榡agged鈥� line

CHRISTIAN COUNTRY - CHRISTIAN DAVE - IAN McGILCHRIST

Ian McGilchirist has packed a lot of wisdom about the 'Human Condition' into his book (The Master and His Emissary) and his 鈥楢 S Animate鈥� YouTube, and his lectures. Well worth the time spent.

If there is another edition of The Hitchhiker's Guide out, since the one Ford Prefect was adjunct to, I surmise that 'Mostly Harmless' has been expanded to 'Terminally Self-Harming'.

Scholars seem to accept that many branches of the Ape line died out in the past. That we are on our way to extinction, seems a reasonable deduction, from our inept interference, both at planetary scale and down to a genetic level.

Further, I assert that any fule should kno, at a glance, that man's most demon-driven delusionals rise to power, over and over again, throughout history. This is not conducive to wise, competent direction, nor any triumphant arriving - anywhere.

McGilchrist et al reveal the chance of a different human paradigm - Dave et al will ensure it withers to nothing.

THINGS FALL APART - THE CENTRE CANNOT HOLD - HUMAN FAILURE IS INNATE

15.
At 19:37 4th Jan 2012, John_Bull wrote:


14. At 19:27 4th Jan 2012, nautonier wrote:

I think you鈥檝e read me wrong nautonier.
++

Yes - I probably have as my analysis is now in code as 大象传媒 do not allow open discussion as would appear to offend their heightened PC sensibility & politicised, rhetorical, conspiracist, libertarian, pro-immigration agenda

11

That's actually a fair point. What you seem to be suggesting is some sort of a prisoner protection scheme. I just can't see how that will be implemented in practice. Any ideas?

IF WE MUST IMPRISON! WE NEED A WHOLE RANGE OF THEM (#20)

Being almost an icon of The Age of Perversity, myself, it seems to me that the punishment aspect of imprisonment, requires careful attention to the proclivities of each incarcerant. (Isn't Hell sometimes described along those lines?) In the final analysis, somewhat paradoxically, we might need one prison for each offender!

I think it unwise that I give examples (the Blogdog is quite sensitive) but it is not difficult to see, potentially, who is happiest and who most miserable, in which kind of company. And we all know of the punishment meted out by macho men, to child molesters. (And never forget how Brer Rabbit tricked Brer Fox into throwing him into the briar patch, thinking he would suffer!)

So the fundamental question is the 'if' in "IF WE MUST IMPRISON". Which brings us back to Zimbardo, McGilchrist and the guilt of dynastic Westminster, in the creation of those unfit for life as currently configured. (How might our criminals fare if born into a 'primitive' South American jungle community?

The maverick psychiatrist/psychologist, R D Laing, wrote in 1974: "A child born today, stands a ten times greater chance of entering a lunatic asylum than a university. PERHAPS IT IS THE WAY WE ARE 'EDUCATING' THEM THAT IS DRIVING THEM MAD." That was one or two generations ago - since then we have abandoned mothering and equipped our schools with modern aids to madness.

Blair mouthed: "Crime and the Causes of Crime." Heir to Blair Dave identifies the cause in 'the parents', whom he thinks are found under gooseberry bushes.

Nuff sed

Jeremy hit the nail on the head tonight with the Giles Fraser interview. As for the Occupy LSX lot, all they did was get high/drunk/fight and then defecate in St.Pauls. Did it achieve anything? NO. POINTLESS WASTE OF TIME.
Rainforest - snoreworthy..........carbon credits......blah.

THE (once) VOCATIONALLY MOTIVATED, REDUCED TO 'UNITS OF' NURSING, TEACHING AND POLICING.

Surely that is our root problem? I seem to remember a shortage of police was 'corrected' with higher pay? Nurses became lofty graduates, and good teachers were driven off by: "An initiative a day, drives good teachers away." Age of Perversity, in action.

In passing: I had no idea the "Black Police Association" is still with us. Isn't that discriminatory?

And finally: What is causing Jeremy to do the 'Parky Parkinson Self-Hug' so much? Is it some inexorable consequence of being over-hyped and over-paid?
And where was his vaunted interviewing technique tonight? To have crowed: "Not much longer" when the St Pauls guy referred to his place of residence, was about as banal as it gets!

#22

It was probably giggling champagne quaffing bankers from the LSE next door who did the defecating.. probably did it 'for a laugh' and so the Occupy LSX lot get some bad press for being 'filthy no good scroungers' while the real scroungers continue to enjoy false respectability (by virtue of being rich and wearing suits and talking posh sounding nonsense) while creaming off a percentage of all the labours of 'hard working families and small business' without putting any real value back into the system.

They are the ones getting high, drunk, fighting and defecating on the hard won rights of the ancestors of todays hard working respectable moral individuals.

I have no doubt the bankers involved found this absolutely hilarious.


They will be laughing even more when they read your post...

Fell right into their trap.. unless you are one of them of course....

As Barrie would say.


''its all going awfully well''

Until the whole sick mess implodes of course when the excesses of the few can no longer be supported or tolerated by the descent majority.

#23 Barrie here's another

CALL FOR DAVE LIZZY - HE 'GETS' STUFF (#25)

This is where the absence of wisdom, philosophy and candour takes on a life of it's own, and an angelic face to hide the demon beneath.

What we are attempting is NOT WHAT NATURE WOULD DO.

In a small community of homogeneous characteristics, none of these lunatic 'corrections', to innate behaviour, would be needed. Post glacial rampant cleverness, at the expense of wisdom, has mixed the sub-groups of the human race, and the result is a MODERN BABEL-PLUS. If the whole sorry mess were being deftly managed by wise adepts, we might reach accommodation. But the whole sorry mess is being overseen by Dave. AAAAAAARRRRGGGHHH!

Nuff sed

Cool. Laurie Penny & Jonnie Marbles currently on the back burner, but we get freelance 'coverage' of a sensitive issue via PJ and his.. um... 'media company'. Now, how did that role bring him to the attention on the 大象传媒's 'find what we are looking for' 'reporting' team?

The 大象传媒 is in danger, in its role as a pervasive medium, and especially one keen on heat of light and/or agenda-driven opinion vs. objective broadcast, of being part of the problem.

From selection of topics, vox pops and guests and all that is constructed in the edit suite.

All that is needed is the vital calming influence of say, Ms. Diane Abbott to get things back on track. Your producers possibly have her number. She's in the news today, funnily enough.

Can't wait for the next both-ways-大象传媒 'how is this allowed to happen????!' special on knife crime.

'24. At 23:40 4th Jan 2012, Jericoa -
It was probably giggling champagne quaffing bankers from the LSE next door who did the defecating.. probably did it 'for a laugh' and so the Occupy LSX lot get some bad press'

Source attribution like that and you, too, could be a Newsnight 'special correspondent'. Possibly.

Is it 'cos I is IC (+number)? One more only to go...

#28

Nah, I would not be able to put up with their libertarian biased censorship and they would not be able to put up with my northern accent and preference for locally brewed brown ale over champagne.

Ms. Abbott going to be on the naughty chair tonight? Or simply popped away over on the naughty step until things blow over (like a few others), and the iPhone speed dial can again be risked to bring her in to 'comment' on her areas of 'expertise'?



That context thing is so tricky, especially on 大象传媒 shows. What you say, who you say it about and to... and where. Just ask the One Show producers, and Carole Thatcher, or Mr. Clarkson.

There is so much 'unique' about these days, it's all a blur.

Interesting to note the 大象传媒 host on the radio show featured was so keen to push the notion tweeting as a private conversation.

That may explain a lot about the tweets of many staff.

And the notion that an apology will sort it all, is quaint.

Lessons will be learned. Until the next time.

Ah, I see it is now time to 'move on'.

At least, in some quarters.

I'll have to remember that 'context' clause if ever I am looking down the barrel of a plod collar or tricky media interview.

Works for some. Apparently.

Another newsynightie regular we don't hear from enough, especially with his truly awesome points of argument.

@billybragg Billy Bragg
Daily Mail angry over Diane Abbott remarks - trust they will now demand an apology from anyone who generalises about race

Not sure, but it's just possible Ms. Abbott's remarks, and especially her later ones in excuse, and apology, might have tweaked a few others out there.

Note the most recommended comments at this other right wing rag:

Last night's programme was pretty good I thought?

Stop & search is a matter for the police - they are the experts - if they are allowed to get on with the job instead of receiving too much PC interference - then more crims will be dealt with.

Thankfully there were no serious 'white bashers' on last night's programme and which makes a nice change as some of us British white mixed race human ape descendents of ancient empire colonialists are sensitive to the usual round of racist attack by cliche, innuendo, inference and inappropriate constant apologies on behalf of UK silent majority.

Actually I'm proud of the Wilberforce type Brits & what they did in the height of global slavery as took a lot of guts & commitment on issues like emancipation. Different to some of the very poor quality band-wagon MP's we now have in Parliament who are not worth their fat salaries & pensions (don't mention their expenses)?

Some countries have laws preventing certain issues being discussed or used in a racist manner - I would propose a new law making it illegal for anyone to use or mention Britian's colonial past as a reference point for incitement of racial hatred. That would mean some sections of British society acting responsibly; particularly by their examining their own 'contribution' to Britain, Europe & ROW.

On behalf of myself, as one of those who is of 'White British mixed race' - stop bashing us for our colonial past as, I for one am sick of hearing it (particularly also for those in positions of responsbility) - large sections of my colonial period ancestors were forcibly sent to the colonies & some for just being gypsies & being in the wrong place at the wrong time - others died in far flung places of British empire wearing millitary uniforms - life for ordinary British people in colonial Britain was awful for many with workhouses & factories.

My Gypsy, Norman, Anglo-Saxon, Irish, Italian & Jewish ancestry means, I suppose, I'm 'mixed race white Brit' - hopefully, let's see new laws re: discussions on British colonial past so that those with more recently acquired British heritage/residency know how to behave towards 'white mixed race Brits' and those in this category within UK police forces - & ignorantly use British history to incite racial hatred as constantly 'white police bashing' also.

Much of this stems from ignorance of more recent British colonial history and as perhaps would now be worth including in UK school curriculum as including understanding new law & guidance for those who would continually bash Britain, particularly bashing 'White English people' for colonial era (conveniently leaving out the Welsh, Scots & Irish?).

Get a life 'white bashers' - Grow up & act responsibly & try 'contributing'! We are a distinct racial group & have legal & other rights on this also.

Also, means time for a Race Equality Impact be carried out on this group as not receiving same level of public money investment as other sections of the population?

IF ABBOT, OR ANYONE ELSE, TURNS OUT TO BE DIFFERENCISM-FREE, I SHALL LEAVE THE HUMAN RACE.

I shall even demand assisted death, as my Human Right, throwing poor old Falkoner into a right tizz.

You never seem to invite disaffected white youths or their grant-supported mentors (if there are any) on to your programme. I can only conclude from that Newsnight must be racist.

I'M A HYPOCRISY BASHER - ME (#34)

We can all grasp - if we so choose - that prejudice is as vital as CO2 to continued life. The second word in 'Natural Selection' implies PREJUDICE. Differencism is endemic.

Personally, as a fan of Dr Phil Hammond, I am for

GINGER RIGHTS ABOVE ALL.

Nuff said

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

'36. At 13:52 5th Jan 2012, MaggieL
You never seem to invite disaffected white youths or their grant-supported mentors (if there are any) on to your programme.'

Not quite sure that is true. It was a while ago, and rare, but there was that chap from some acronym who was there on his tod to be savaged by Mr. Paxman. Trouble is, Mr. Paxman rather lost it on the balance front and the young man came across pretty sympathetically. Didn't get invited back mind.

I'm guessing... Galloway... tonight? Solid regular.

On matters pressing, here's another:



Now I reckon Ms. Abbott can say pretty much what she likes, so long as she, her supporters and her media PR departments accord the same courtesy to others.

However, I do note that on that thread the top-rated comments were modded out, and the thread itself closed.

Not, perhaps, the smartest play if the intention is to show just how equal we all are.

So far, the majority of the establishment, political and media, have taken what wasn't great and made it a whole lot worse.

In some cases for just 拢145.50 pa, especially if gorgeous George is the best we get served for 'comment' on the 大象传媒.

And the excuse that no other pol (sensibly) was available for a loaded double standard 'interview' will not wash.

37.
At 13:54 5th Jan 2012, barriesingleton wrote:

++
Depends what is meant by 'prejudice' as Merriam Webster dictionary defines as:-

"1
injury or damage resulting from some judgment or action of another in disregard of one's rights; especially: detriment to one's legal rights or claims

2
a (1): preconceived judgment or opinion (2): an adverse opinion or leaning formed without just grounds or before sufficient knowledge b: an instance of such judgment or opinion c: an irrational attitude of hostility directed against an individual, a group, a race, or their supposed characteristics"

Next to nothing is ever simple or straightforward?

What some call a career in 'fighting for equality' can be said to no more than 'bashing' a particular institution or associated racial grouping?

What has always puzzled me is the endless list of apologist, self-deprecative 'whites' who engage or have engaged with 'white bashing' as being 'prejudiced' against other white people in terms of their being apologist for the silent majority?

Prejudice is/can be a very complex issue? For the the operative phrase here is 'pre-conception judgement or opinion' - sometimes better for someone to say that 'I hold a pre-conceived opinion about x, y or z' rather than to say something as an assertion.

Personally, I'm prejudiced about the authenticity of the official 1968 supposed moon landing photographs & camera evidence - that does not mean that I am prejudiced in my belief about the entire moon landing mission?

Prejudice is very real to all of us but is not necessarily anything wrong with it - it is or can be just our own personal opinion or knowledge however ignorant or inaccurate.

If we could all be more open about our prejudices we would all understand everyone else better and be better understood.

'Prejudice' has become a dirty word but is a an important & everyday aspect of being a human ape?

QED.

@georgegalloway George Galloway
I am appearing on Richard Bacon show just after 2pm this afternoon 大象传媒 Radio Five Live on the Diane Abbott brouhaha

Some things you can simply trust will happen....



I wonder who paid for.. excuse me, commissioned such research using various funds secured? It doesn't say.

41.
At 14:41 5th Jan 2012, JunkkMale wrote:

Just proves the research to be bunkum when 2% 'trust' the Gurdian & 59% trust the '大象传媒 Guardian'?

Doesn't say much for 大象传媒 does it - When only 2% 'trust' the Guardian?

So MP puts her foot in her mouth & makes controversial racial comment?

Comment is very much in context & could not have been made more succinct if written by poet laureate?

Definite water-shed here - the '* moment'. Decision time ... clock is ticking ...

1) Either we should all be more relaxed about 'prejudice' in regard to what people write or say?

or

2) Law equally applies to all and should be applied properly & fairly?

Another 'Liam Fox moment' - this one has legs, I'm afraid

This should be the day that 'white bashing' also became illegal!

Tick! Tock!

'43. At 15:15 5th Jan 2012, nautonier -
Comment is very much in context & could not have been made more succinct if written by poet laureate?'

The original comment itself can live or die on its merits, or otherwise.

However, the subsequent dissembling, by our doughty heroine, her bosses.. and loyal glee clubs (private, public and 'uniquely-funded'), has been a treasure to behold.

As someone has already noticed, if she was seeing 140 characters as a constraint to what she thought she meant to convey, she didn't actually try to utilise them all.

Hoist by her own petard, really.

Now, why are some so keen to move on when so tenacious on matters of detail on other occasions? With such a hole dug, helping refill it so soon seems very... generous.

44. At 15:51 5th Jan 2012, JunkkMale wrote:

Indeed - Saying that it smacks of 'sweep it under the carpet' double standards & hypocrisy is wasted on those who are immune from that kind of personal responsibility?