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20 or 21 did you say?

More like 18 I'm afraid who turned out in Carmarthen to listen to six candidates in the European election strutting their stuff.

Most depressing of all was that the hustings took place in a Students Union that was devoid of students. They may have been swotting, may have been in the bar upstairs. Where they weren't was listening to the panel debating how the European Parliament has influenced Wales and whether it has cost Wales and Welsh businesses dearly or poured money into the economy. They weren't there to hear the panel trading green manifesto policies, disagreeing over what the current crop of MEPs has delivered, defending groupings within the EU, talking about co-operation, dividing lines and delivering what the chairman called a final "elevator speech" to convince the audience of their case. I doubt whether many in the room would rush to be stuck in a lift with them.

The mood was of disconnection, disenchantment despite every effort to engage. Had anyone changed their minds over the course of the evening asked the chairman? Silence, followed by more silence. Had anyone had their views confirmed perhaps? Lots of nodding.

The Conservatives will publish their manifesto on Thursday but this morning launched their European election campaign, calling on you to "'Vote for Change" on June 4th. The ad van is on its way up north as I write on its three day tour before the manifesto is published on Thursday. If you see the van parked in a lay-by on the A470, spare a thought for the driver.

I asked the candidates whether they feared that anger over expense claims in Westminster and the fact that the finger had been pointed at three of them for not having Welsh addresses - for living in England in other words - would deprive them of the huge gain they must make to win a second seat.

Boy, did they go for it.

It was ridiculous, said Kay Swinburne, to suggest she couldn't do the job because she lives "on the wrong side of the border by a few miles". Number two candidate Evan Price joined in. "I've had a home and base in Wales all my life and I'm taking this opportunity to try and serve the interest and people of Wales. It is important to me and I really find it irritating on occasions that because I don't speak Welsh, for example, that I can't be a Welshman. Well, I am Welsh, I've always been Welsh".

Cheryl Gillan came next. People have suggested that because her constituency is in England that she's English. She's not, she's Welsh. Nick Bourne took up arms. It was wrong to raise the issue of where people were born.

"Cor, you've touched a nerve" said the man seated next to me.

Perhaps they hadn't heard me in the front, or thought they'd heard a different question.
If elected, I asked, would the successful candidates move to the constituency they represented - Wales?

Yes, said Kay Swinburne, she would though "at this point in time I have no idea where in Wales I would be able to do my job from. Given the fact that there are no flights from Cardiff I'm trying to work out geographically where I can set myself". She wants to represent the whole of Wales, not just Cardiff and be able to fly to work. Mid Wales estate agents - take note and jot down journey times to Birmingham airport.

"I will continue to have a home and base in Wales" said Evan Price who was brought up both in Crickhowell and in London. "This decision is not purely mine. I have a wife and children to consider as well. But I will always have a home and base in Wales".

The lengthy and passionate responses, I was told afterwards, had been "more vociferous than intended". The questions had indeed, conceded some of those who'd answered them, "touched a nerve".

And that nerve is the knowledge that their party is still seen by too many voters as an anti-Welsh party.

On the third floor in the National Assembly - home to the Conservative group - there are AMs who are lobbying hard to ensure that the Conservative manifesto, come the General Election, includes a pledge that a Tory Welsh Secretary would not veto a request from the Assembly for a referendum on full law-making powers. Remember that for the request to be made, two third of Assembly Members must vote for it. The most likely scenario for that to happen? A Conservative Prime Minister leading a Conservative UK government.

It appears that Lord Roberts of Conwy, , came to the conclusion that there was no scenario where such a veto would ever be used. However that conclusion, along with another few hundred thousand words, never saw the light of day.

Nick Bourne would like to see a promise not to use the veto included in the manifesto. He wants it there in black and white but gave a grey answer when asked about it. "There'll be something on it in the manifesto". Not good enough, comes the response from one of his colleagues who is adamant that not to include the pledge, that leaving the door open to a veto would be a serious mistake for the party in Wales. It would let other parties point a finger and label them anti-Welsh.

"I think you've just proved the Welsh Conservatives are still very much an Anglo-Welsh party" said one anti-veto voice this morning, "and there's not much doubt on which half the emphasis lies".

You can argue that on which side of the border any candidate lives is a parochial concern, is unimportant.

You can argue too that constitutional issues are of no concern to people on the doorsteps.

But I defy you to argue that the stance the Conservative party takes on issues like a veto, a referendum, on future plans for devolving power to Wales, is either a parochial concern, or unimportant.

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