´óÏó´«Ã½

As a West Ham fan it infuriates me to see our club continually selling it's best players - but the order of ascendancy is already well established.

I can only imagine how South American fans must feel to see their brightest stars constantly crossing to Europe. Perhaps they already know they'll get to see them again after 10 years or so, once the peak of the player's career is long gone.

On the plus side at least those fans get a wonderfully unpredictable competition like the Copa Libertadores. I don't have to think too long or hard about which teams will be competing for the Champions League or even the top European domestic leagues every season.

Being an Arsenal fan, what do you think the prospects of Arsenal's Denilson getting a place in Brazil's World Cup squad? He has come forward leaps and bounds and Wenger's belief in him should be giving Dunga a headache surely?
Ibrar, Bristol

Tim,

I'm off to Sao Paulo in April and am very keen on watching a game there. I know the Serie A season is over but I see a fixture list for the Paulista. Could you (or anyone else here) tell me what this competition is all about and the format? I'm guessing it consists of all the teams in the Sao Paulo region?

What do you make of this whole Robinho saga in Britain at the moment. He doesn't seem to be enjoying his football, or playing well when he does start or come off the bench. The City fans do not seem to like him anymore and now he has said he would like to go back and play in Brazil for the rest of the season. No disrespect to City's other players but he clearly is someone who could be a star for you. Do you think it's possibly the coaches and being played a lot as a left midfielder in a 4-4-2 or possibly that English fans always like a hardworker that runs around and tackles back over some great footwork and passes that unlock defences; or just that he simply doesn't fit into City's style?

Interesting read as always and you have wetted my appetite for the Copa Libertadores.

I was wondering if you think that a player leaving the continent to pursue European football is cyclical as this is the last 'season' before the World Cup. Do you think a good showing by the South Americans in South Africa would redress the balance and keep more players in the continent for longer?

Or whether I am being naïve and it is purely down to the financial rewards Europe offers.

I personally think the problem with Robinho at Man City is not neccessarily the coach or the formation, but the player's attitude. I won't use the lazy stereotype of South Americans not liking the cold British weather, but seriously, whenever you see him in a City shirt Robinho always looks like he wants to be somewhere else.

It has got me thinking though about South Americans playing football in Britain. I've been trying to think about any Brits who have gone the other way and played football in South America. I can't think of any. Can anybody else?

In defence of Solano, and as a Newcastle fan I am pre-disposed to love the man, he left Newcastle in order to be nearer his estranged wife and child who had moved to London at the time. I dare say there is a likelihood that there is similar motive in his most recent move. Can not wait to see him in action again soon, even if he will be wearing the wrong strip he will get a fantastic reception. He was/is a great player and will remain a legend on Tyneside, indeed we have a history of South American cult heroes up here.

There must be a lot of players who are aware of the time constraints on their careers and look to milk it for all it's worth though. The rewards in Europe can be vast, particularly if the player is young and promising. I look at the young English players coming through and see a dearth of creative talent in general. Sure all the players are neat and tidy, great athletes and professional - yet none seem to have the kind of inventiveness or creativity that makes football exciting.

Also, as per the other week, I watched Palermo again this weekend and was thoroughly impressed with Pastore. He's such a good player to watch, you never quite know what to expect next, he has a great improvisational touch to him. I remember seeing Montano play for Parma a couple of times, he always looked dangerous but seemed isolated in games. I think he may have been better suited to playing in Spain, tis a shame.

#6

Off the top of my head I can think of one Englishman, high-profile at the time who went to South America.

Neil Franklin was reputed to be Englands finest centre-half in 1950 when he went to play in Colombia, which at that time was a pirate league outside of FIFA and able to pay wages way above the maximum wage in England.

England could have used him at the 1950 World Cup!

Thats about all I know about him though, I'd be interested if Tim or anyone else can fill in more details.

#6,

I assume you are talking about it in recent years because british footballers did play in South America. Some even played in Colombia back in the 1950s.

#8,

You are correct. Even though the majority of the players that went to Colombia were not of the highest standards, there were some that played for big clubs.

Charlie Mitten was another one and he did write a book about his time in Colombia.

I wouldn't know about as far back as the 1950's to be honest. I think off the top of my head some players were lured by the promise of a big money league at some point in the past, which went bust, but I don't know when? I certainly can't think of any good players in the last few decades.

In the last few decades I can only think of europeans going to the USA and Mexico but not to South America.

#3

The Paulista is a 20-team championship that displays the teams of São Paulo state (the well-known are Palmeiras, which happens to be my team, São Paulo, Santos and Corinthians). It is the oldest championship in Brazil, dating back to 1902.

From January to April 7th all teams play against each other only once. The top 4 qualify for the semis (1st x 4th, 2nd x 3rd), which are played in home-and-away matches, just like the finals. Semis and finals are only played on weekends (semis usually have one game on Saturday and one on Sunday; finals are always on Sundays. So matches should take place on April 13, 14, 20, 21, 28 and May 5).

A lot of people will be asking if the 'first option' on Neymar and Henrique is worth the loan of Robinho from Man City... Do you think this is good business ? If it means that someone like Neymar (now 17) can stay at their club until they are 20, is this a good thing for their development ? Or is this still too young to move to a big club in Europe ? (I'm thinking Rooney was ready at 17 to play for United !)

I think there are a number of levels this challenge of player turnover can be looked at. Even without starting the leaving-too-early debate, there is almost nothing anyone can do about it nowadays.

Is the issue merely money? Suppose local clubs like Sao Paolo could match the wages of Barcelona would it mean players would automatically opt to stay home rather than play abroad? Is money the only incentive to stay or leave?

South American players, just like their African counterparts benefit more from playing abroad. They acquire skills and remuneration they otherwise would only dream of. Does it improve their skills? Of course. The likes of Drogba, Kalou, the Toure brothers, etc. have no doubt grown in physical prowess and tactics courtesy of time spent abroad.

There is a case for leaving at a slightly late age but Messi is an example of a player who left Argentina early and ended up in a club whose system has aided the player's development. It's debatable if Argentina would provide just such an environment.

Age can be considered and players allowed to leave say at around 16, with guardians accompanying them. In the case of clubs, they must be vetted for ability to look after minors, much the same way governments vet prospective adopters of children or animals.

Another way to look at the issue of children leaving for soccer abroad is the relative retardation of British children soccer-wise. They rarely venture outside their local areas, and in a sense retard in terms of personal growth. Whereas a child from the so-called third world will be exposed early to other cultures, a child from the Isles is relatively shielded - from other cultures different to one's own, from other playing traditions, from other foods and weather, etc. I feel that this might end up retarding more than building.

Playing outside one's comfort zone is a super way of building mental muscle. While saying all these, the issue of optimum age when a child should leave the home environment for challenges abroad should be set out. The issue of the child's education, earnings and career development should be part of any team seeking to sign up any such prospective.

Governments must actively vet any interested in their wards, and soccer federations must be doubly vigilant. I cannot see any involvement by the government and local soccer federation without FIFA. The soccer body must create guidelines to guide any recruitment policy.

In all these, the child must come first, with strict adherence to the fundamental human right principles. After all it's only a game, albeit the beautiful game, but the child will remain a person long after the final whistle of their career's blown.

1. At 09:13am on 25 Jan 2010, CharlieDontSurf wrote:

As a West Ham fan it infuriates me to see our club continually selling it's best players - but the order of ascendancy is already well established.

I can only imagine how South American fans must feel to see their brightest stars constantly crossing to Europe. Perhaps they already know they'll get to see them again after 10 years or so, once the peak of the player's career is long gone.

On the plus side at least those fans get a wonderfully unpredictable competition like the Copa Libertadores. I don't have to think too long or hard about which teams will be competing for the Champions League or even the top European domestic leagues every season.

-----------------------------------------------------------

And I would just like to say thank you for being such a great feeder club...

Julian,Neil Franklin used to play for Stoke City and after his career ran a pub in Sandon,Staffordshire. It was called the Dog and (?). By all accounts he was a fantastic player but a bit of a grumpy landlord i recall.

#15 wrote,

"Is the issue merely money? Suppose local clubs like Sao Paolo could match the wages of Barcelona would it mean players would automatically opt to stay home rather than play abroad? Is money the only incentive to stay or leave?"

Well, I for sure would prefer to stay at home if I could earn the same here as in the US, for example. Most migratory movements have economic causes. The same for footballers.

Of course, times have change and players now want to prove themselves and compete with the best. Pele stayed at home with Santos because he got paid well and in those days you didn´t need to prove yourself in Europe to be a world super star like him. Now you have to play in Europe to be the #1.

Another good blog, Tim. This year's Libertadores is one I'm really looking forward to.

One unrelated question I have is this: what is going on at Boca!?

#14,

IMHO if Man City will really have the priority in catching Neymar and Paulo Henrique, then it is a good deal, provided Robinho won´t stay anyway.

Neymar is skilled, but still too imature. It´s too early for him to move. Paulo Henrique is older and, althoulgh also unexperienced, more prepared to adapt himself to playing in another country. I reckon he is a step ahead of Neymar at the moment.

as an added bonus to lodeiro coming to us, suarez signed a longer contract and we beat az tho we were lucky lol, it was a good sunday:)

Tim,

Completely off topic but I just read in the news that Salvador Cabañas was shot in the head in Mexico City.

HI, I ask you all to pray for Salvador Cabañas today, apparently he was shot in the head this morning.

Thanks.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I have just read that Salvador Cabanas was shot in the head in a bar in Mexico last night..tragedy

13

Thanks Claudio, much appreciated.

Hi Tim,

Could you give us an update on Salvador Cabanas' condition? There seems to be a lot of unsubstantiated reports out there about a bar fight or a bungled robbery and that his chances of survival are "grave"

#6 (Malt Loaf), well, City bought Robinho, not Pato, Kaka, L. Fabiano, or Felipe Mello. When they decided to acquire him I am sure they did not expect a vibrant committed player who would not only fight for the football but win most physical challenges cause that would have been crazy! :)

Robinho at City is the same player who played for Santos and vanished in the libertadores final against Boca. The same player who dominates when Brazil plays easy games and vanishes every time things get rough. Same player who hasn't been able to become a regular starter in Europe for the reasons I stated. He will do better at Santos though. Refs in Brazil will call foul for every little bump on him.

On the Paulista championship, a little better than the others (Gaucho, Carioca, etc) but my view of state championships in Brazil is that they are equivalent to preseason friendlies elsewhere.

On the article itself, well, Douglas Costa has left Gremio (for Shakhtar) and I haven't really seen much of him (as a supporter). However, some interesting players do come back to Brazil because only so many can play in Europe! That's the reason Rochamback is there at Gremio (they will get him in shape this season). R. Carioca is now at Vasco (loan), Fred is still at Fluminense... anyway some good players to watch in Brazil.

A player to watch at Gremio is certainly 19 yo Mario Fernandes! He's a tall and pacy defender who can play center defense or right back. He's a starter for Gremio and one of the better players of the team.

Lots of mixed reports about cabañas but apparently he was conscious until he went in for surgery about 20 minutes ago...

The Cabañas case is quite tragic. We all hope the best for him.

Regarding the Robinho discussion, I have to agree with some of the comments here. You can't fault him for lack of grit or endeavour in the challenge, he is never going to do that. However, it is fair to say he has failed to provide what was expected from him: constant display of skill and class. It has been sporadic at best. The way he is apparently leaves the club harms his bad reputation, because he is walking away from Man City just like he did to Santos or Madrid. He has skills, yet he has proven to have average technique (surely not up to the standards of the best players in the world) and poor physical conditions (I don't mean bulk, I mean speed. He hasn't got the pace to burn past defenders). He probably won't be the player he and we thought he'd be.
Plus, the assumptions people are making here of a trade-off for Santos'new gems, Neymar and Ganso, are ludicrous! They are 17 and 19 years of age. They belong to Brazilian football and must acquire maturity there

Brain drain - in this case dribble drain - has been around since time immemorial. People with skills are attracted to places with money.

I am curious about the numbers - just how much is the wage differential between Europe and South America? Some histograms, each showing footballing wages in a country, would be nice.

If a player makes more sitting on a bench at some European club (i.e. if his move doesnt work out so well) for a year than he can playing at his old South American club for five years, I'd hardly blame him for moving.

If you can't build a nest egg at home, why stay at home?

Saying 'Solano would rather wind down his career in lower division English football than in his continent's premier club competition.' is a little unfair.

I imagine the Championship is a stronger and more competitive division than any of the top divisions in South American let alone the Peruvian one.

If Solano would rather test himself in a competitive league than wind down back home in an easier league then good luck to him. I certainly have more time for him than a certain Brazillian who's currently crying himself a move back to Brazil.

Mexican clubs have been part of the Copa for years. There are something like 8 involved in various international competitions at the present time.

We will know U.S. soccer has matured when MLS is invited and fields a compelling side that takes it seriously. So far we've done nothing with the opportunity of the CONCACAF Champions League, which is always won by a mediocre Mexican side (the big boys get the big money in the Copa) which then proceeds to fall on its collective face in the world club championships each December.

Oh, and U.S. soccer has the same problem described here. Only worse, because MLS is about to take a strike in an effort to break its union, and U.S. players are opting to go elsewhere in droves. Good for Everton. Bad for us.

Tim

How can you write a blog like this and not mention Jackson Martinez? He has just left Deportivo Independiente Medellin (qualified in Copa Libertadores) for a Mexican club, Jaguares de Chiapas. I am an Englishman living in Medellin and, although Arsenal is my true football love, I have become a fan of D.I.M. They won the last league competition (Copa Mustang II) largely thanks to Martinez. He scored 18 goals in the campaign, breaking the record for Colombian league goals in one season. The only reason he did not score more in the whole of 2010 than Gutierrez is that he was injured for the first half of the year. Yet ask anyone in Colombia (Junior fans aside) and they will tell you there was only one striker in Colombian football in 2009, and it was Jackson Martinez, not Gutierrez. Indeed, as I have watched him a lot recently, I was wondering why he chose to go to Mexican football as opposed to Europe or Argentina (or stay with D.I.M. for the Libertadores). For me, he clearly has the talent, and after the success of the likes of Rodallega, I would think he could do well in the Prem. What do you think? Have you followed his career?

Apparently they have been aunable to remove the bullet from Cabaás' brain... It was a bigger calibre than expected.

I was just wondering, eventhough not related to this article, do players only work hard when big competitions comes around the corner (like World Cup or Euro Championship) etc? I've just been reading articles about players wanting to move to another club for first team action so that they can secure a place for world cup. If no major tournament is around, then they are happy to warm the bench and wait for the contract to run out. Take an example of Robinho, Van Nisterlooy etc, to name a few. In Robinho's case, nothing personal with Brazilian league, but if you can't prove yourself in premier league, especially for the amount of money that he is being paid, how does moving back to brazil for 6 month loan, scoring a few goals merit a place in Brazil.

Van Nisterlooy, OK he's 33, now to get a place in Dutch side for world cup, he's decided to shun offers from Engish sides and couple of other european teams to move to Hamburg? hmmmmmmmm. German league??? Aren't West Ham or Tottenham good enough or German League poses more of a challenge than premier league. I'm not saying that all players should prove themselves by playing in premier league but point is if you cant repay the faith the club shows in you by paying some stupid amount of wages to play good football, what does it says about the player? Clearly football nowadays is not what it used to be. Players back in the days were more passionate representing their clubs and countries, even playing through injuries than players are nowadays. Money has in fact spoilt the game!!!!

Tim,

Thanks very much for replying to my blog and apologies for not knowing about your writings on Jackson Martinez - I have just been trying to search for your comments on him and nothing suitable comes up when I type "tim vickery" "jackson martinez" into a ´óÏó´«Ã½ search - any clues on where I could find it?

Also, to Jagjit Singh, I think it is obvious that Robinho will have more chance of getting into the Brazil team if he is playing a central role at Santos as opposed to warming the bench at Man City. The exposure to the Brazilian people and media would be far greater - just think of the UK's reaction to Hargreaves when he was playing in Germany - nobody knew anything about him. Also, with Van Nistelrooy, he is choosing a good team in a great league - how is this possibly worse than being a sub at Spurs or playing relegation football with the likes of West Ham - at Hamburg he will receive service from good players and continue playing at a high level. I do not think you have seen too much of the German league as it is far superior than you think.

Ok, Tim, I have another question! While trying to find your comments on Jackson Martinez I read your comments that you had expected Colombian football to take off about five years ago but it never happened. Without wanting to go over old ground, why do you think this is? Having lived in Colombia for 2 years, I notice that the culture of how to play, from the schools and streets to the stadiums of professional teams, is to try individual skills and to shoot from long distance, often ludicrously so. This leads to a lack of passing, intelligence and speed; qualities that, seemingly, are not admired as they should be. Yet everyone raves about European, and in particular English, football. So my question is why, in your opinion, do you think that there has not been a manager/team that has tried to adopt a more European style with quick passing and playing at speed? It seems almost obvious to me that a team with these characteristics would walk through the Colombian league, and subsequently benefit the Colombian game as a whole. I just cannot understand how a country with a larger population than Argentina, typical South American passion for the game, and few or no other sports to rival it, can do so badly and produce so little - any ideas?!

I have to say from an Argentina point of view this blog is mierda
Solano is hardly a World superstar at this stage but the likes of Robinho,Roberto Carlos,Adriano certainly are and they are back playing the Libertadores and possibly also Gago
Brasilian domination is a topic Tim has gone with for a while without the slightest grounds for it.Facts are Argentinas clubs have dominated the Copa Libertadores 22 wins against 16 including 2 of the last 3 years if we have to get recent.
As for Brasilian clubs bringing back players from Europe so far this window Maidana(Banfield)Sosa(Estudiantes)Fernandez(Newells)Estigarribia(Newells)Gracian(Independiente)Fredes(Independiente)Licht(Racing)Moreno y Fabianesi(Colon)Benitez(San Lorenzo)Figueroa(Central)Fontanello(Tigre)Casas(Gimnasia)Gimenez(Chacarita)and Obolo(Arsenal)have all returned to Argentina from Europe to play Primera whilst only Salvio(Atletico Madrid)Suarez(Dynamo Zagreb)Valencia(Rubin Kazan)Civelli(Niza) have moved the other way suggesting Argentina is also with its new tv deal becoming more attractive for players to come home to

Re the state of Colombian football I definitely agree with the comments regarding playmakers. As a Millos supporter I'm looking forward to seeing how we do without Ricardo Ciciliano this season (Cizou may be his nickname, but Zidane he ain't). Ciciliano played some great matches for Millos, especially during the Suramericana run of 2007, but so many times the momentum of a break was lost when Ciciliano put his foot on the ball looking for the killer pass. There were times when you could see players with the ball going out of their way just to give him the ball to try and conjure something up.

Colombian football's going through a very tricky time at the moment. The country's two biggest clubs (in terms of championship wins) Millonarios and America are both in a terrible financial position. America have seen a mass exudous of players as a result of thier situation and will be lucky to finish above the bottom few positions this season. Meanwhile the saga continues at Millos with Lopez and Co staying put and dragging the club further and further into debt. Add to that the usual corruption issues including the questionable decision to allow Postobon the rights to the Colombian league whilst also owning Atletico Nacional (a club with a history of "alledged" corruption - 1989 Libertadores anyone?). And that's without even mentioning the national side's 3rd consecutive failure to qualify for the World Cup.

The fact that Colombia has large urban centres is potentially an advantage. However, by far the largest of those urban centres, Bogota,(9 million inhabitants) barely produces any players of note: Andres Perez, Andres Chitiva don't exactly stand out compared to the talented paisas, calenos and costenos that have emerged over the past decade. The only quality "rolo" I can think of over the past decade or so is Fabian Vargas who had a couple of successful spells at Boca. This has to be at least part of the reason a team from the CAPITAL of Colombia has not won a championship since 1988! I cannot think of another South American country in which the capital (or biggest) city has produced so few top players and whose clubs have won so few championships in the last couple of decades (maybe Tim can correct me if I'm mistaken). This has to have an adverse effect on the national team in that the pool of players to select from is almost entirely limited to the provincial part of the country (which admittedly, is still a reasonable number of people in Colombia relative to other South American countries.) Even going back to the highly talented national team of the early 90s before the "big bulky player" mentality emerged, a huge chuck of the national team was made up of paisas, with costenos forming the remainder.

Tim, any theories as to why there exists this dearth of players from the colombian capital? Assuming Junior make it through, which of the colombian teams do you expect to go furthest in the Libertadores?

Cheers.

Hello Tim, I am interested in getting an english translation of Zizinho's autobiography. I think its called Mestre Ziza - Verdades E Mentiras No Futebol – Zizinho in portuguese. Is there an English version? Do you know where I can get that from? Any information would be great. I am interested in football tactics and this book seems to have quite a lot of information on the subject. Keep up the good work. Thanks.

Hello everybody.

Nicolas Lodeiro is an excelent player. In Club Nacional de Football was 2 times Champion of the National Championship (Campeonato Uruguayo), being one of the most important players. He plays a friendship match or a final, at the same way. He's really profesional. I think that he's don't have "roof", he can play in any big team of Europe.

That is in a way, because Nacional is a big team of the entire World

Viva Nacional !!!! Viva Lodeiro

www.decano.com

Best regards for everybody

Sam

ps: Just for reminder. Nacional 3 times World Champion, 3 times Copa Libertadores Champion, 42 times uruguayan championship Champion (Number One in hte list). Is the most winning team in Uruguay and some of the most winning teams in the entire world. His history is unique.

#44 Tim wrote, "The people coming back from Europe
1 - veterans
2 - people with problems/going through a bad spell
3 - people who haven't made the grade"

1) true and some if not most are well past their prime.
2) That's the only chance for a truly special player play in SA, Adriano for example.
3) True, but I question how much worse are those who havn't made the grade. Could it be they are just about the same level of the locals where they played in Europe? Which means there was no reason to keep them there? I think sometimes some players in European sides are greatly overrared. Only a handful of players playing for the best clubs are the ones who can truly make a difference in a football match.

I dont insult your blog Tim I usually praise it to the moon but when it deserves constructive criticism you should know.I contend that after all your years in Rio you are seeing things with a Brasilian tint.The facts are there for us all to see Brasil does not dominate the Libertadores punto.I am often Argentine futbol biggest critic.
Argentinas primera is a dog eat dog league that is hyper competitive.Whilst the Argentines are killing each other during the early rounds of the Copa Brasils top clubs are playing mickey mouse state leagues of as much consequence as the Torneos de Verano in MDP,Salta and Mendoza.This allows them a big advantage until the later rounds but when you get that far the Argentines are more than a match for the Brasucas.This year the Brasilian teams will be more star filled than for 20 years whilst all 5 of Argentinas big 5 havent even classified.I am willing to bet if Velez or Estudiantes survive the early rounds they will be more than a match for Sao Paolo/Flamengo /Cruzeiro/Corinthians etc
As for the returning Argentines being veterans
Jose Sosa 25 scored for the seleccion last night,Jonathan Maidana24,Lucas Licht 28,Luciano Figueroa 28,Pablo Fontanello 25,Nelson Benitez 25,Leandro Gracian 27,Gaston Casas 32,Ivan Moreno 30,Marcelo estegarribia 22 and Santiago Fernandez 21
Not too many veterans there only some european sterotypical thinking.The Worlds changeing folks get used to it

Hmmm a blind Brazilian or a stereotypical European... a tough choice.

If the players were that good someone with more money would buy them. I think it is probably you that needs to adjust to that change.

50- marcelo estigarribia is not argentinean!

52 who said he was he has moved from europe to play in Argentina is what i said as has now Leandro Prediger(Porto-Boca) and it seems Diego Valeri also an international is about to join Central

53 - you did...
"As for the returning Argentines being veterans
Jose Sosa 25 scored for the seleccion last night,Jonathan Maidana24,Lucas Licht 28,Luciano Figueroa 28,Pablo Fontanello 25,Nelson Benitez 25,Leandro Gracian 27,Gaston Casas 32,Ivan Moreno 30,Marcelo estegarribia 22 and Santiago Fernandez 21"
but i get your point.

Apologies Sergio i made the point badly

no problem. Why are so many players going back to argentina? is the financial situation much better there now? Or is it because it's a world cup year, nd they want to be playing more?

#56,

Those players moreno mentioned might not be veterans but otherwise fill in the other two categories Tim highlighted: either not good enough for Europe or going thru a bad spell.

And to think the reason they are moving back to Argentina because it is a WC year is nonsense. All those players have 0 chances to play for the Albiceleste. They are just fringe players, no stars.

I should think jose sosa has a chance, and marcelo estigarribia could go, but i see your point about the others.

Lucas Licht a regular at Getafe returned because Racing pay better
Jose Sosa is determined to make the mundial squad.The notion that full internationals Figueroa and Maidana or Gracian/Benitez arent up to playing for European clubs is laughable.The arrogance of that statement to a South American is mind boggling.
The reasons they are coming back are varied.some such as Maidana found East European culture impossible Licht for money,Sosa to make the World cup as possible with Estegarribia.Casas wanted to return to Argentina after along time in Europe.Fernandez because he was too young to leave his country.
As for the financial situation clubs such as Velez and Estudiantes with more or less a dozen full internationals each in their squads are run in the black.River,Boca and co have been helped by the new tv deal and of course Argentina 2002-2008 grew 8% a year whilst in 09 its economy while bad didnt fall so much as in Europe and in 2010 it will grow 5-7%

Of course Tim I see things from an Argentine perspective just as you do from a Brasuca/English one.You may think i am on a nationalistic trip while I may think Globo tv/Sky Soprts has you brainwashed thats life its full of opinions that vary
In 2 seasons Licht played 70 games for Getafe thats what I would call a regular fisrt teamer.Sosa returned to BA in November hoping to play the Woeld club title and make the Mundial squad its hardly his fault from an Argentine perspective you need to be 2 metres tall and run the 100 m in 11seconds to play the Bundesliga.I am willing to have a bet he makes ouir Mundial squad.
I am being realistic re the Copa I beleive as do most South Americans outside of Brasil that Velez/Estudiantes if they survive till the second round will have as good a chance as any of the Brasilian clubs.
It is surely a legitimate opinion to hold id Argentine clubs have won 22 Libertadores and 2 of the last 3 or is debate not allowed

Hi Tim,

Just wondering what you're thinking on the current 'will he won't he' contract situation of Juan Roman Riquelme at Boca Juniors?

As a big fan of Boca, i'm of course very much hoping that Roman puts pen to paper, he's without doubt one of the elegant footballers i've ever seen, and maybe he'll just return for Argentina in South Africa.

Thanks Tim

I would call a regular fisrt teamer.Sosa returned to BA in November hoping to play the Woeld club title and make the Mundial squad its hardly his fault from an Argentine perspective you need to be 2 metres tall and run the 100 m in 11seconds to play the Bundesliga. | |

Thanks for sharing this information, keep up the good work.
|

I may think Globo tv/Sky Soprts has you brainwashed thats life its full of opinions that vary
In 2 seasons Licht played 70 games for Getafe thats

There must be a lot of players who are aware of the time constraints on their careers and look to milk it for all it's worth though. The rewards in Europe can be vast, particularly if the player is young and promising. I look at the young English players coming through and see a dearth of creative talent in general. Sure all the players are neat and tidy, great athletes and professional - yet none seem to have the kind of inventiveness or creativity that makes football exciting.
Also, as per the other week, I watched Palermo again this weekend and was thoroughly impressed with Pastore. He's such a good player to watch, you never quite know what to expect next, he has a great improvisational touch to him. |

South American players, just like their African counterparts benefit more from playing abroad. They acquire skills and remuneration they otherwise would only dream of. Does it improve their skills? Of course. The likes of Drogba, Kalou, the Toure brothers, etc. have no doubt grown in physical prowess and tactics courtesy of time spent abroad.
There is a case for leaving at a slightly late age but Messi is an example of a player who left Argentina early and ended up in a club whose system has aided the player's development. It's debatable if Argentina would provide just such an environment. |

I may think Globo tv/Sky Soprts has you brainwashed thats life its full of opinions that vary

When the latter are not yet ready for Europe. I guess Mexican clubs benefit too as they get living proof of their future southern prospects.

Great article ,As a West Ham fan it infuriates me to see our club continually selling it's best players - but the order of ascendancy is already well established, thank you so much !

let's hope that the win over Manu was the beginning of something good..

Well the world is getting smaller and smaller, and footballers just like people from any profession such as the business for example will go where the money is. It would be surprising if that was not the case. On the plus side, these footballers can send money to their families, put a on their faces, and thus indirectly benefit their original countries.

Really you have done a great job for all the football lovers. Its a great platform to get information about football events, teams e.t.c. i do hope that you will definitely keep posting in the future too to let us know more. Keep your good work up..

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

All this user's posts have been removed.Why?

great site

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

This is a really nice article.

I really like reading your posts. Thanks!

They acquire skills and remuneration they otherwise would only dream of. Does it improve their skills? Of course. The likes of Drogba, Kalou, the Toure brothers, etc. have no doubt grown in physical prowess and tactics courtesy of time spent abroad.
There is a case for leaving at a slightly late age but Messi is an example of a player who left Argentina early and ended up in a club whose system has aided the player's development. It's debatable if Argentina would provide just such an environment.

Interesting article! This is all part of the Sport, It's all business.. Very few players will reject a good trade offer to leave they're own national team.. | | | | |

Copa libertadores is more local then Champions League, and in Champions League you can see really powerfull players like Ronaldinho, Messi and others.by