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Goodbye Gardeners World?
This discussion has been closed.
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Message 1.听
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Monday, 11th April 2011
I have read with interest the discussions on the latest incarnation of Gardeners World and perhaps this programme has run its course.I have watched it from the Percy Thrower days through Geoff Hamilton and Alan Titchmarsh and is it now time to put it out of its misery? At least with Toby and team there was a move to fresh ideas for which, he seems to have been hammered and it has now reverted to a tired old formula with a former presenter.
Many wiser people than me say you should never go back-but this is what the bbc has done. I still listen to Gardeners Question Time so why does this seem fresh?-because it is different topics every time-where as Gardeners World goes down the same old road time after time-seed sowing, lawn maintenance, pruning( not limes and figs- who grows limes and figs??).
I for one cannot wait for the itv Alan Titmarsh programme to start(does anybody know when?) -competion can only be a good thing and if GW does not get better then finish it now and let us look back with find memories. -
Message 2
Posted by kfgray (U14470933) on Monday, 11th April 2011
I have read with interest the discussions on the latest incarnation of Gardeners World and perhaps this programme has run its course.I have watched it from the Percy Thrower days through Geoff Hamilton and Alan Titchmarsh and is it now time to put it out of its misery? At least with Toby and team there was a move to fresh ideas for which, he seems to have been hammered and it has now reverted to a tired old formula with a former presenter.
Many wiser people than me say you should never go back-but this is what the bbc has done. I still listen to Gardeners Question Time so why does this seem fresh?-because it is different topics every time-where as Gardeners World goes down the same old road time after time-seed sowing, lawn maintenance, pruning( not limes and figs- who grows limes and figs??).
I for one cannot wait for the itv Alan Titmarsh programme to start(does anybody know when?) -competion can only be a good thing and if GW does not get better then finish it now and let us look back with find memories.听 Not sure it has run it's course, more gone off course . There are things which need to be said each year sowing pruning etc, Because each year new people take up gardening in some way which is fantastic even if it's pots on a balcony.
But I agree that the program is dull, the man is dull, and his garden is really dull. And for one belonging to a "Top" gardener a neglected one, even taking into account MD recent medical problems..
Change is needed, if I see one more Bl++dy Box ball, pleached Lime walk Sculpture garden Stately home beloging to lady Chunlybumly. Or J and R sent to a yellow book gardener, who clearly needs no real help. I may stick my foot though the telly. I have been a faithful GW watcher since Jeff Hamilton. Not always loved everybody but always related to them in some way.
But not the Don I am sure he is lovely fellow etc. But in Quo Vardis Nero is sent a note by one of the senators after he commits suicideI in which it say's "Murder your family. Brutalise the people But for the love of god Nero sing no more".
And to MD I say Pleach your Limes ,patch your lawn badly. Prune you Box (but not in October like last time) Coppice your nuts . But telly garden no more.
Quo Vardis Gardeners World Quo Vardis -
Message 3
Posted by PhilandPaula (U14818208) on Monday, 11th April 2011
well said - the 大象传媒 has got it wrong .......
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Message 4
Posted by pjgolf (U2469936) on Monday, 11th April 2011
"well said - the 大象传媒 has got it wrong "
In your opinion, yes !
But the viewing figures suggest otherwise. The programme is pulling in another 700,000 viewers per week on average. If more people are watching then that is a thumbs up for the new format whether you believe the 大象传媒 has got it wrong or not !
PJ -
Message 5
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Monday, 11th April 2011
I think we are in some agreement and the point I am trying to make is that the problem is the programme is so hackneyed and repetetive it is beyond recovery.
I don't feel it is a guide for beginners I want ,surely a "gardener"knows the basics-this week for example laying turf -treading soil, laying so joins don't meet-how many times have us seasoned viewers seen that-I am looking for different plants, new ideas which I think Toby etc were trying to do and if Monty is going to refresh his garden why in the back of my mind am I thinking ok at the licence-payers expense?? I do recall that in the past we had new gardens made albeit on a small scale- shady gardens,dry gardens etc -but I guess that that is not possible in this garden so when this project is finished where do we go from here?Where is the long-term thinking-on recent form there probably isn!t any!!! -
Message 6
Posted by cazsudz (U7061972) on Monday, 11th April 2011
Although the seasoned gardener will know the basics there will be viewers who are looking for just that from GW. Monty is criticized for being both too basic and too specialist ( see general moans about the fig pruning bit). In truth he is trying to do a bit of everything and its difficult in half an hour to please everyone.
As gardeners we do do the same things at the same times of year each year - sowing in spring and harvesting in Autumn etc - those things are what gardening is about. It would be more helpful if people could give constructive and specific suggestions of what they do want the programme to contain instead of generally moaning.
I think that generally only people who want to find fault frequent these boards as there was much negaitive comment about the last series on here, even though its being praised now.
Personally I enjoy GW - its not meant to be an evening class in advanced gardening techniques - for me its something to relax with after work on a Friday. And sometimes you learn something or get inspired to do something new in the garden on Saturday.
Caz -
Message 7
Posted by pjgolf (U2469936) on Monday, 11th April 2011
Caz,
It`s really nice to hear a constructive post for a change. As you say, there are people on these boards who criticize in every post they make. Usually including petty name calling
If they are not happy, it would be good if they put their views forward in an adult and structured manner.
Maybe I`m asking too much
PJ -
Message 8
Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Monday, 11th April 2011
Caz and PJ
Thank you for posting. After reading some of the dreary, miserable criticisms on here, I felt like slashing my wrists. Where were these posters during the last couple of years, happily enjoying the last lot? And whilst I'm on a roll, it's not Jeff but Geoff (Hamilton) and it's not Titmarsh but Titchmarsh.
I enjoy GW, I always did until two years ago and now I do again. -
Message 9
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Monday, 11th April 2011
So what was so wrong with the past two years and what is so wonderful now?
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Message 10
Posted by cazsudz (U7061972) on Monday, 11th April 2011
Tell us what you liked about the previous show and that could become a suggestion for something to be included in this one. Personally, my problem with the last season was that I didn't like the gimmicky bits and felt there was a lot of artificial bonhomie going on. I had no problem with the horticultural advice, except to comment that some projects weren't followed up.
Caz -
Message 11
Posted by Lowena (U14575314) on Monday, 11th April 2011
I can't understand why it's all gone wrong?!
We wanted the format more like that of AT and GH................got it
We wanted the garden to belong to the main presenter..........got it
We wanted variety from the co presenters...........got it
So WHY have the programmes so far, been deadly dull and boring???? Because they have!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! -
Message 12
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Monday, 11th April 2011
Absolutely -so can we put the programme in the rest home now????
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Message 13
Posted by pjgolf (U2469936) on Monday, 11th April 2011
Another moan Lowena. Thats not like you !!!!!!!
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Message 14
Posted by floraltips (U14757778) on Monday, 11th April 2011
Agree with Lowena..
"Artifical bonhomie"..come to think of it that could be whats lacking in GW. There's absolutely no bonhomie whatsoever in there...artifical or otherwise.
"Constructive"...Some say too basic, some say too elitist, I say find some middle ground.
I think Carol does "elitist" with all the swanky gardens.
Joe and Rachel could be pulled in from lecturing experienced gardeners to do the basic bit. If they zipped and zapped quickly between the two they could fit a lot of basics into that slot.
Monty can do the middle ground...fitting in a bit of fruit and veg now and again so keeping everyone contented.
Having a garden that is miles behind alot of the country (acc to various posts) and personnel that are dotted all over the place has not helped.
But mainly I think that the "camaraderie" is missing !!
This is a public forum and people are free to express negative views if they wish. Those who call it "moaning" are usually the same half dozen who religiously defend Monty's every word.
PS please do not critisize my spelling, grammar, punctuation,etc.. On other message boards I occasionally visit it is considered extremely bad form to do so. -
Message 15
Posted by Lelliegoggs (U14833611) on Monday, 11th April 2011
I agree. The main problem I have with GW in its present format is that there's not enough gardening and too much visiting other people's huge gardens. I only have a small suburban garden and an allotment and there is nothing in the present series that relates to me. I've watched GW since Arthur Billett and Clacks Farm, I haven't always liked all of it but I've watched each week in the expectation that I will see something interesting, innovative and/or useful. It was a great shame that Toby's first series was so gimmicky, quite toe-curling at times, but I kept watching because they still managed to get in some interesting items. I thought the second series with Toby and Alys was spot on, Greenacres was maturing at bit and looked better than at the beginning of the first series. Toby and Alys were starting some innovative long-term projects and Carol was doing good work at her Devon garden. I still can't see the pont of Joe.
I would have liked to see Toby and Alys doing their stuff at Greenaces, Monty maintaining his garden and perhaps Carol in Devon or doing just a bit of garden visiting but I suppose it's too late now. -
Message 16
Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Monday, 11th April 2011
Good grief, I think the 大象传媒 TV Gardening Message Board is about to experience it's first online suicide.
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Message 17
Posted by Lowena (U14575314) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
I know PJG, completely out of character for me.It just shows how strongly I feel about the way the programme has deteriorated into the borefest it has become.I just hope we get some middle ground soon, if I want grand gardens every week I can visit National Trust properties. Not to mention the new tranch of programmes with Moga floating on a cloud around the grand gardens of Italy ( cue more formal greenery and fountains). Please let the programme revert to relevant jobs for the current time, lose the grandeur and lighten the whole thing up a bit.
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Message 18
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
Spot on -the main problem is that I too do not relate to his garden and there seems to be little of interest to the "ordinary gardener" ( so far).The only item that has really interested me to date was the dahlia chap a few weeks ago- I know other people's interests are different -but this is just my opinon.
I do remember that AT referred to the presenter of GW as the nation head gardener-that is ok if I lived in a stately home with box, limes, and figs but the majority of us dont- I am sorry but i would not want Monty as my gardener but somehow all previous presenters I would -and that includes Toby (but not Alys!!) who I quite liked.
Obviously all these discussions are nice but futile as nothing will change-and I still maintain that perhaps it is time to put this animal to sleep!!
Incidentally according to something i read yesterday the AT programme on itv will go out at 8pm on a friday starting in June (strange time of year to start a gardening programme) -chances are there will be an hour special of GW on that date unless it clashes with Wimbledon!! -
Message 19
Posted by Pumpkin_Patch_Paul (U14565900) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
I remember the last series at Berryfields when Monty started growing a small garden where everything in it had to be green.......Oh dear we where warned,at least then we had Carol,Joe,and Aly's to dilute his ideas.
Seems we have got a garden dictatorship going on, 大象传媒 reclaim greenacres and install three presenters there with no gimicks....Job done. -
Message 20
Posted by X7BRO (U14359634) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
I couldn't agree more Caz, if people aren't happy with the format or the presenter used on GW its simple, SWITCH IT OFF!!!! nobody is forcing you to watch it.
I have been gardening for a number of years and still enjoy the various processes described on GW throughout the series.
On Fridays episode Monty laid some turf, i have never laid turf before and was interested in picking up some tips.
A lot of people as you rightly say are far too negative and are too quick to criticize. Its time we backed the bbc and GW, remember the bbc have had to make difficult decisions in terms of cuts to programmes and various departments. Maybe its cost effective to have Monty in his own garden?
I repeat my earlier sentiment, if your not happy switch off, but no more negative childish comments please. -
Message 21
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
I have just watched Beechgrove on i-player-this is only the second time I have ever seen this-and on this showing this is everything GW is not and they cram it in 30 mins -practical gardening by gardeners for gardeners-and I think the reason is the presenters are not bigger than the programme and you get the feeling they are real growers.
Now why can't Friday nights be like this?? -
Message 22
Posted by cazsudz (U7061972) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
Hi XR7BRO
I guess its OK to put in constructive suggestions but I do wonder what some of these people want. I didn't like the last series, but didn't spend time on here moaning about it, I just didn't watch it - there's lots of other programmes on TV I don't watch because I don't like them - I would never dream of going on a message board and meking personal remarks about the presenters.
Caz -
Message 23
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
Switch off-is this your answer?-what you obviously don,t get, that in a strange way people love this programme and watched its various forms over many years and want it to get back to some of the ways it used to be.
What cost effectiveness has to do with it is beyond me as the bbc has already spent money on and then abandoned two recent tv gardens- or is Monty doing this for free?
Finally I have to take exception with you comment " negative childish comments" as being quite rude to posters on this forum-these are only people's opinions after all. -
Message 24
Posted by the cycling gardener (U2350416) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
I鈥檝e just waded my way through a few threads and ended up on here which seems as good a place as any to post.
It strikes me this negativity is another example of dissenters making the most noise. I read an item on Yahoo today about Simon Cowell quitting the X Factor (curiosity got the better of me I'm afraid). Readers were invited to comment on whether his absence would make them turn off. The overwhelming response was that the whole programme should be turned off 鈥 yet it is the most successful ITV programme in years pulling in record viewers. I think the only real measure of how GW being received is the viewing figures and they are up on the last series.
There have been complaints at the lack of relevant jobs for the current time of year yet we鈥檝e had sowing, thinning, hardening off, lifting and dividing, turfing, pruning, planting plants and veg and mending a path. Have some people not been paying attention? Am I watching a different programme?
Some are complaining about lack of pace. We had pace for the last two years, including high velocity garden tools launched from Toby鈥檚 hands and look where it got us? I fear some GW viewers are so used to sound bite television and whizzing camera work that they have become desensitised to sincere calm production and Monty's heartfelt presentation style (sadly now termed 鈥渄ull鈥).
Carol鈥檚 garden visits have been sublime. How some of you don鈥檛 find them relevant is beyond me. Garden visits are about ideas, good plant associations, use of space, coping with different conditions and admiring statuary. Have some vision, use your imagination or just enjoy them for what they are and as for the poster who dismissed them as irrelevant because they can go and visit National Trust/RHS gardens themselves I find quite selfish. There are many viewers who are not is such a happy position.
I stuck with GW despite the Play School shed, the What鈥檚 Hot What鈥檚 Not debacle, the 30 second challenge, the mobile ice cream van, the tool throwing, too many presenters over-crowding the garden, false bonhomie, Alyss's dog and bike, Joe and Toby鈥檚 banter and one-upmanship, the bitty garden, the lack of follow through and the bizarre construction projects. I know which programme format I prefer and plead with the production team to hold their nerve. -
Message 25
Posted by cazsudz (U7061972) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
CG - you've said it all - well argued - and now I am resolving to spend less time on here and more in the garden.
Cheers
caz -
Message 26
Posted by kfgray (U14470933) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
To X7BRO and Caz If you did not watch it over the last two years then indeed you can not comment on what the progam was like, But had you watched and made comment on here. Then you could have contributed to the debate about that program. Which could have lead to changes to the program to reflect your taste in gardening . Instead we got a whole sale dumping and a jump back in style.
My view on Mr Don is a personal one, as are the opinions of others. I am not saying the programe is a right off. But the garden he works in and the gardens visited so far are not how most people garden today.
I would not use the lesson in laying turf, as the way to lay a lawn. First he failed to tell you about aerating the compacted soil or if the soil was in need of enrichment ,what tilth the soil should, be or how to properly butt the ends, in need the last left hand square was laid the wrong way round which gave that area a chequred look.
And the way to level dips is over weeks when the grass is in growth, sprinkel compost as the grass grows more compost. Or lift back and put in compost to fill dip and put back.
There is a place for clipped Box balls and pleached Limes, But what I find the strangest thing is and this is not just my opinion is that his garden seems so far behind and he is guiding people who's gardens are a least 3 weeks ahead of his. . I am glad you find GW relaxing on friday night But it is a "How to do it " garden show. others wise we could just send Carol around and around looking at gardens..
As for coming on here and having the termerity to air opinions you do not agree with The whole point of this forum, is to debate a wide range of opinions of the 大象传媒's use of it time and our money. And I am happy that I do not have to"SWITCH IT OFF" as you write. But have the freedom to express my views freely on a subject and a program I love and like you pay to watch -
Message 27
Posted by honestGreengrass (U11104227) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
There's always the option to tune in to Sky 166 or Freesat 402 on Friday at 9pm to watch the Horticulture Channel gardening programme. I gather their viewing figures are shooting up quicker than my Kohl Rabi seeds so if you're not happy with GW then there's a popular alternative
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Message 28
Posted by -oldguy- (U14839160) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
I wonder if the reason that GW viewing figures have increased now MD has taken over, is that after a long week, people are now falling asleep and not turning off. This is a waste of energy - therefore against the goverments drive for savings and cutting costs.
Those that ask why are people so negative about the program forget. The program is paid for by THE people whether they watch it or not. It is not just for the elitest with gardens the size of Buckenhamshire and egos to match. The 大象传媒 has a requirement to match the program to the need, which according to the goverment at the moment is to bring NEW people into gardening and veg. growing. MD's program style does not encourage this. -
Message 29
Posted by Lowena (U14575314) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
NOT if you don't have Sky or Freesat
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Message 30
Posted by kfgray (U14470933) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
NOT if you don't have Sky or Freesat
听
hello Lowena I do not now if it is on the the sky player, but you can watch some things on it for free, or pay as you go,you do not need a dish Kfgray -
Message 31
Posted by Lowena (U14575314) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
Thanks KFG, I'll look into it
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Message 32
Posted by honestGreengrass (U11104227) on Tuesday, 12th April 2011
It's also posted on Youtube and the programme can also be watched on their website
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Message 33
Posted by Lowena (U14575314) on Wednesday, 13th April 2011
Thanks
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Message 34
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Sunday, 15th May 2011
I have read with interest the discussions on the latest incarnation of Gardeners World and perhaps this programme has run its course.I have watched it from the Percy Thrower days through Geoff Hamilton and Alan Titchmarsh and is it now time to put it out of its misery? At least with Toby and team there was a move to fresh ideas for which, he seems to have been hammered and it has now reverted to a tired old formula with a former presenter.
Many wiser people than me say you should never go back-but this is what the bbc has done. I still listen to Gardeners Question Time so why does this seem fresh?-because it is different topics every time-where as Gardeners World goes down the same old road time after time-seed sowing, lawn maintenance, pruning( not limes and figs- who grows limes and figs??).
I for one cannot wait for the itv Alan Titmarsh programme to start(does anybody know when?) -competion can only be a good thing and if GW does not get better then finish it now and let us look back with find memories.听 I started this discussion many weeks ago and having read all the posts and related discussions it is clear that though some people like GW, everybody loves Beechgrove- so my question is this- what do we have to do to get this programme broadcast nationwide- but without having it spoilt??? -
Message 35
Posted by darren p (U8518743) on Sunday, 15th May 2011
ahem, clears throat...... SARA COX.
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Message 36
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Sunday, 15th May 2011
???-oh yes i forgot about that.
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Message 37
Posted by Ken Smart (U1158196) on Sunday, 15th May 2011
what do we have to do to get this programme broadcast nationwide- but without having it spoilt???听
Best to just leave it where it is. When GW was going through it's period of hell, The Beechgrove Garden was my consolation prize, and now I can look forward to two slightly different gardening programmes - and that suites me just fine. It's worth noting that the presenters of Beechgrove are gardeners first and foremost, and the fact that they are all now fairly popular is a reward for just being fairly 'normal'. Look at Alys Fowler. She started off as a fairly genuine gardener, but within a year or so, she had her own books being published, and her own TV series - and HER GW went down the pan. The Beechgrove presenters seem happy with their lot, and the last thing we need is some national 'celebrity' being parachuted in to help the ratings. However, no reason why the rest of the UK couldn't also have a second gardening programme - and then we Scots could have yet another option to consider. -
Message 38
Posted by Obelixx (U2157162) on Sunday, 15th May 2011
I like GW this time around and, as Cycling Gardener has said so well, was very uncomfortable and unimpressed by the shenanigans of Toby and Co. It's just a pity so many people lack the imagination and lateral thinking skills to translate the information presented into advice and inspiration for their own smaller plots.
I also love Beechgrove and there's clearly room for both formats of gardening programme. Maybe the Beeb would consider repeating it later on national 大象传媒2 for everyone to see.
And why not expand it so the beechgrove production team can find good local presenters for England, including regional variations, Wales and Northern Ireland? Far better to have a specialised production company than a team assigned from a 大象传媒 pool and which gives the impression they would prefer to be doing something different. -
Message 39
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Sunday, 15th May 2011
There used to be regional gardening programmes on itv a few years ago - we had Grass Roots in the south and I know there was one in the West Country - do any of these still exist?
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Message 40
Posted by Pumpkin_Patch_Paul (U14565900) on Sunday, 15th May 2011
They should leave Beechgrove alone, if the mainstream out of touch 大象传媒 got control of it they would infect it like a dose of blight....
PPP. -
Message 41
Posted by Alexis (U14870608) on Sunday, 15th May 2011
I have read with interest the discussions on the latest incarnation of Gardeners World and perhaps this programme has run its course.I have watched it from the Percy Thrower days through Geoff Hamilton and Alan Titchmarsh and is it now time to put it out of its misery? At least with Toby and team there was a move to fresh ideas for which, he seems to have been hammered and it has now reverted to a tired old formula with a former presenter.
Many wiser people than me say you should never go back-but this is what the bbc has done. I still listen to Gardeners Question Time so why does this seem fresh?-because it is different topics every time-where as Gardeners World goes down the same old road time after time-seed sowing, lawn maintenance, pruning( not limes and figs- who grows limes and figs??).
I for one cannot wait for the itv Alan Titmarsh programme to start(does anybody know when?) -competion can only be a good thing and if GW does not get better then finish it now and let us look back with find memories.听 I could not agree more with thedogcody. When will I ever need to pleach limes was my thought after the first episode.Toby and the team tried hard to include items for new gardeners, coupled with sound gardening advice on propogation,plant families and consistent seasonal advice. The new/old Gardeners World is so dumbed down (digging up a Rosemary bush & replacing it ?) Is the series actually planned or do you just wander about Monty's garden at random? Even the coverage from Malvern was mediocre. Are the 大象传媒 cuts to blame or is it jobs for the old boys and girls. For the first time ever I shall be switching off on a Friday evening. -
Message 42
Posted by darren p (U8518743) on Sunday, 15th May 2011
cycling gardener has, for me, summed up the whole kaboodle. i too resolve to spend less time here- and more time in the garden. 4 hours well spent this afternoon, moving things putting up wigwams from hazel that i coppiced. bliss.
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Message 43
Posted by Bluedoyenne (U2341157) on Tuesday, 17th May 2011
"Good grief, I think the 大象传媒 TV Gardening Message Board is about to experience it's first online suicide."
Wrong Paul-N - make that two online suicides!
No more of this endless whineing and whingeing for me .... I'm off to boards about GARDENING ......
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