大象传媒

No doctors, no charities, no family members - just a frank conversation between two women with chronic illness, about navigating life when energy is at a premium.

Faced with a box of random questions such as 鈥渄o people think you鈥檙e lazy?鈥� researcher Catherine Hale and blogger Natasha Lipman praise left-overs for dinner, extreme flexible working and the online chronic illness community. Ironing, and suggestions like 鈥渉ave you ever tried telling it to just go away?鈥� get short shrift.

This podcast is one in a series of monthly Ouch take-overs, produced by Damon Rose and Emma Tracey. If you have an idea for a future take-over, email ouch@bbc.co.uk.

Subscribe to Ouch as a weekly podcast and, if you wouldn't mind, we'd be delighted if you could review us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts from - it helps other people find us.