大象传媒

24th February 2023

bbc.co.uk/accessall

Access All 鈥� episode 41

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Presented by Nikki Fox and Emma Tracey

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NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 The thing is, right, I do very long hours so I kind of occasionally sneak in a wax after the podcast. It鈥檚 the perfect timing, perfect location. I鈥檓 going for the full body.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 The pain! I do not like pain. Is it painful?

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 I love a bit of pain. It鈥檚 not that I love pain, I鈥檓 used to pain. It doesn鈥檛 bother me, I鈥檓 very good, I just lie there, boom-boom-boom let鈥檚 get it done. But literally I am a beast. For a blonde person, I am hairy. I mean hair-ree. Hair-ree!

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 [Laughs]

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Woo! My toes. My toes.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Stop it! [Laughs]

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 I literally have to get every single individual toe done. I mean I won鈥檛 talk about any other areas, but just trust me. It would be easier just to dip my whole body in that hot wax and just find a way of protecting the hair and the eyebrows and lashes and just go for it and peel it off.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Do you go to a special disability waxing house?

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 There she goes. [Laughs]

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Do you?

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Do you know what, I don鈥檛. But I do have to find somewhere that does have a bed that goes up and down. That is a good point. And when I was younger I was very scared, because I thought to myself I鈥檒l get on the bed because I鈥檒l have someone with me to help me, but then what if I need to move my leg and I can鈥檛 do it that particular time myself and would they mind? I put it off for ages, and then at like 20 I thought no I鈥檓 going to tackle this, I鈥檓 going to go and I鈥檓 going to be brave. And actually some of the friendliest people and the friendliest places are where you get your wax, and every single person has helped me.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Well actually you鈥檙e right.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 But Emma, look, I just realised you鈥檙e asking me those questions and just as a way so I don鈥檛 answer your question.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Yeah, so what else can I ask you about waxing? Er ...

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 So what do you do? Are you a shaver, Emma, or do you use hot wax?

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Er!

MUSIC-听听听听听听听听 Theme music

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 It鈥檚 Access All. We are all about disability, mental health and so much more, all in a tightly packed nifty little weekly podcast. I鈥檓 Nikki Fox, and I鈥檓 in London.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 And I鈥檓 Emma Tracey, and I鈥檓 in Edinburgh.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 This week a big mental health charity is asking government to keep its promise. And later, we have got the hardest working woman in disability showbiz.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 That鈥檚 a thing, is it, disability showbusiness?

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Yeah, well it really is, because it鈥檚 Rosie Jones. It鈥檚 Rosie Jones!

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 This business we call disability showbiz.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 [Sings] 鈥淪howbiz鈥�.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Tell your friends and colleagues about us and get them to subscribe to us on 大象传媒 Sounds, or wherever you get your podcast from.

MUSIC-听听听听听听听听 Music

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 The nation鈥檚 mental health is at an all-time low, and we all know the pandemic made an already bad situation worse. Last April the government promised to create a 10 year mental health plan for England. Emma has more detail.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Yes. Mental health charities like Rethink and others asked their members to get involved and to feed into that plan, and 5,000 people did so. However, this January it was announced that the plan would be scrapped and it would be brought into a whole body strategy which would include medical conditions like dementia, cancer, diabetes and arthritis.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 We鈥檝e got a clip here from the Secretary of State for Health and Social Care, Steve Barclay, making his announcement in the House of Commons.

STEVE-听听听听听听听听 Mr Speaker, I am pleased to announce that we will be developing and publishing a major conditions strategy. Around 60% of disability-adjusted life years in England are accounted for by just six conditions: across cancer; cardiovascular disease; chronic respiratory disease; dementia; muscular skeletal disease; and mental health. An increasing number of us live with one or more of these conditions. Tackling them is a significant opportunity to improve the lives of millions of people and support our goal to improve healthy life expectancy. This work will bring together our existing commitments to develop plans for mental health, cancer, dementia and health disparities, and our new strategy will shift our focus to focus on integrated whole person care.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 The charity Rethink has not taken this lying down and has launched its Keep Your Promise campaign to see if they can get the government to reconsider. To talk more about this, we are joined by Jeremy Bernhaut who is the Head of Policy and Influencing at Rethink. We鈥檙e also joined by Rick Burgess, and Rick is from Recovery in the Bin, which describes itself as an activist collective of mental health survivors and supporters. Hello Jeremy, hello Rick.

RICK-听听听听听听听听听听听 Hiya.

JEREMY-听听听听听 Hello. Thanks for having us.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 I鈥檓 going to start with you, Jeremy. What had been the hope last April when the government announced its 10 year mental health plan?

JEREMY-听听听听听 So, at Rethink Mental Illness, we鈥檝e been calling for a cross-government plan for mental health and wellbeing for several years. At the moment we have soaring demand for NHS services, and there鈥檚 a need to address what鈥檚 causing people to be unwell in the first place, and also to address what can help them get better after they鈥檙e ill aside from just the services that are funded by the NHS. So we鈥檙e talking about the work that government can do with people鈥檚 housing, with the way people interact with the welfare system, the way that schools tackle mental health.

And last April it seemed the government got it. They launched a consultation paper and a discussion document about a 10 year plan for mental health and wellbeing that would seek to tackle the drivers of poor mental health across the whole of society, and would build a plan that would bring in every government department and every arm of the state to try its hardest to prevent people from getting ill, and to help them get better when they do.

We hoped they were going to publish this plan, they told us they were going to before the end of the year, but a few weeks ago it emerged that that plan has now been scrapped in favour of a much more shorter-term plan that blends mental health with a whole range of other conditions and loses that important focus that we need. We鈥檙e urging the government to reconsider and to publish the 10 year plan that鈥檚 needed in order to address the soaring demand that the NHS is facing.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Is it the merging and the shortness, are they the two main issues for you?

JEREMY-听听听听听 At the moment there is so much pressure on NHS services because people are getting ill, and it鈥檚 really hard to address your mental health if you鈥檙e worried about your housing, or if you鈥檙e interacting with the benefits system, and the way the benefits system is treating you is in of itself affecting your mental health. What it seemed like the government got last year, was that the government has at its hands a whole load of government departments filled with smart people who are able to think through how the policies of each of those government departments can contribute to better mental health. That would have been a world leading approach to addressing the mental health crisis in this country.

It鈥檚 that plan that鈥檚 really badly needed, and that鈥檚 why we鈥檙e asking people to write to their MPs, and several hundred have so far, calling for this plan to be reintroduced in order that it can tackle mental health over the long-term, help people get better, and reduce that demand on the NHS.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 5,000 people fed into the consultation. What was their reaction? How did they feel when the plan was scrapped and this strategy was brought in instead?

JEREMY-听听听听听 The government have now come back to us and asked us for help with finding people with mental illness to help shape the major conditions strategy. And it鈥檚 actually really hard to go back to people and say, 鈥淵ou know you helped us shape the plan that they were working on last year? Well now we鈥檝e got a plan which isn鈥檛 just about mental health and is shorter-term and we kind of need your help shaping this plan now鈥�. And that鈥檚 a really difficult ask for people, because people are naturally really disappointed, and they feel like the time and the energy and the effort of telling their own personal stories and giving their views has gone to waste. So, it鈥檚 disappointing all round. I think that if the government were to change their mind and reintroduce the 10 year plan for mental health and wellbeing, I think that would be met with a lot of enthusiasm.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Rick, I want to bring you in here. Thank you so much, Jeremy. I just want to bring you in here now as well. You鈥檝e got personal experience of mental health challenges. Do you mind first off just telling us a little bit about that experience for you?

RICK-听听听听听听听听听听听 Well I鈥檓 part of a growing cohort of which I guess we鈥檙e described as service avoiders. People who have had experience of the system and that experience was not good, and we find ways to avoid it and rely on friends, peer groups and good luck really. 听If you go into crisis, it is debateable whether you would want to ask for help from services or not. So, I鈥檓 a service avoider.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Service avoider. That鈥檚 very interesting, Rick. I would like to speak to you more about that actually. But I just want to go back to the 10 year plan, because you obviously knew it was being created last year, and I wonder what your hopes were for it?

RICK-听听听听听听听听听听听 Our hopes weren鈥檛 high because there was no promise of funding behind the strategy. So when it was abandoned, and what was interesting is they managed to find a way of not only of abandoning not a particularly promising or funded strategy, and then rather than just leave with kind of nothing, they鈥檝e managed to find a new approach which seems worse than doing nothing. From the minister鈥檚 announcement, it does suggest it鈥檚 from the point-of-view of sort of the management of population health in the name of saving money and pushing people into employment. And to be honest, at present none of the political parties appear to be willing to actually grasp the huge job that is needed and to take mental health seriously.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 The announcement that the mental health plan is to be replaced has left some people furious. We heard from a different Nicky, a 39 year old north Londoner who works as a senior autism practitioner in a special needs school.

NICKY-听听听听听听听听 I didn鈥檛 know about the 10 year plan, but when I heard about the plan and that it had been scrapped, I felt angry. There was a whole big thing during COVID about anxiety and taking care of your mental health. But when you鈥檙e like me and so many others who don鈥檛 have the personal support and not bad enough to need support, you鈥檙e on your own. The government is basically saying we can鈥檛 see what鈥檚 wrong with you so we won鈥檛 be taking it into account. That鈥檚 until there is an incident where we will report that the person involved may have had mental health needs.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Well, we鈥檝e got a government statement here actually, because we reached out to the Department of Health and Social Care to ask about all of this, and it said it鈥檚 grateful to everyone who took part in the consultation and it would feed into the development of the policies. It goes on to say, 鈥渁 joined up major conditions strategy will ensure our approach to the treatment and prevention of the conditions covered, is joined up with care centred around the patient鈥�. We鈥檒l keep you updated on this story, and thank you both so much for coming in today.

RICK-听听听听听听听听听听听 Thanks very much.

JEREMY-听听听听听 Lovely to meet you all.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Bye.

MUSIC-听听听听听听听听 Access All

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Well it鈥檚 a story as old as time, 鈥榠nnit, for disabled people. We are talking obstacles in the street. It doesn鈥檛 sound particularly sexy but it鈥檚 very painful. Wales is making plans to fine drivers 拢70 if they park on a pavement, which would then get in the way of someone that needed a bit more space. In Scotland, they want to make it easier to put chairs and tables outside restaurants by withdrawing the need for a permit. So one鈥檚 trying to get rid of the obstacle, the other is trying to create one. To help us understand what it feels like to come up against obstacles when really you just want to go and get a pint with some mates, we have got Holly Garrow from campaigning organisation Transport for All. Hello, Holly.

HOLLY-听听听听听听听听 Hi. Thanks for having me.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Let鈥檚 start with this street furniture issue. This all came about, didn鈥檛 it, around the pandemic, because I know I got quite a few emails about this in my role as disability correspondent, and people were saying it looks great, I love the whole kind of Mediterranean vibe, but I literally can鈥檛 get anywhere. This was mainly London. Scotland hopes to change the law next month, as I was saying. What will more chairs and tables outside mean for you?

HOLLY-听听听听听听听听 I鈥檓 a part-time wheelchair user, and when I鈥檓 not in my wheelchair I鈥檓 using a walking stick, so it鈥檚 actually different for me depending on the day. As a wheelchair user, if I鈥檓 going down the street and my path is blocked by street furniture, it鈥檚 not just massively inconvenient, it can be hazardous because it might mean that I need to try and get onto a road to get past. It could mean that I need to rethink my whole journey. If I鈥檓 running for an appointment then I鈥檒l be late for that. I have to rethink a lot of things going on there. As someone with a walking stick and an energy limiting condition, it鈥檚 actually quite helpful to come across street furniture where I could take a seat if needed.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 If it鈥檚 seen to be obstruction, the council can ask restaurants to take the furniture inside. Is that a good compromise? Is that a reasonable thing to be asked to do, to complain about something before it鈥檚 changed?

HOLLY-听听听听听听听听 It鈥檚 essential that there is somewhere where you can complain if you need to. But it鈥檚 been that burden on disabled people for a long time that we have to make these complaints and we have to campaign for ourselves, and often the way that we鈥檙e asked to make complaints isn鈥檛 necessarily accessible. Really at the end of the day, the responsibility should be on councils and local authorities to make these areas safe and accessible in the first place.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 I鈥檓 hearing a lot of disabled people at the moment saying we just really don鈥檛 want to have to fight all the time and get on with life. But on the other story, Holly, Wales wants to bring in fines for pavement parking, which for many would be very welcome. But Holly, if a pavement is blocked by a car, how do wheelchair users deal with that?

HOLLY-听听听听听听听听 It can be very difficult. If there鈥檚 not a lot of room to go past the car on a pavement, which a lot of the time there isn鈥檛 when you鈥檙e in a wheelchair, you鈥檙e left with the very dangerous option of I have to go onto the road and manoeuvre around it. You don鈥檛 know how busy that road鈥檚 going to be. As a wheelchair user, I can鈥檛 see over the car so I鈥檓 not really sure what the incoming traffic looks like. There鈥檚 not necessarily even going to be a dropped kerb to help me get onto the road, so it might be that I just have to turn around and rethink my entire route.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Different laws apply, don鈥檛 they, depending on where you are in the UK. Scotland already has a law against it, but they haven鈥檛 been enforced yet. Pavement parking is illegal in London. Holly, do you think these laws should just be UK wide?

HOLLY-听听听听听听听听 Oh absolutely, yeah. We did a research recently with Sustrans, the Disabled Citizens鈥� Inquiry on Walking and Wheeling, and from that we gathered about 70% of disabled people said that they would be able to walk or wheel more if the pavement parking and other obstructions were reduced. I think that鈥檚 just as clear as day that this is an issue that needs to be addressed.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 I just want to briefly mention that Transport for All did have a campaign called Trim Your Bush, Nikki, just because I know you鈥檙e really into waxing etc today, and it was about overhanging foliage and blind people, and asking people to get their secateurs out and lob off any branches or whatever that blind people might hit. When you鈥檙e walking along, you鈥檙e only getting information from your white cane on the floor, and you鈥檙e not getting it from head height. Trim your bush guys, trim your bush.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 On that note, I will be removing my foliage. It鈥檚 been so lovely to speak to you, Holly. I know a lot of disabled people are getting very tired of having to fight for basic rights like this, but I do appreciate you coming on and having a chat. And keep up all the work that you鈥檙e doing.

HOLLY-听听听听听听听听 Thank you so much for having me on to chat.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 We actually didn鈥檛 even get to mention the petitions that were brought to Downing Street this week by people who are worried about changes in staff levels in trains and on stations. I love that 鈥榦n stations鈥� business. But yeah, it鈥檚 a really serious thing and we didn鈥檛 get to mention that either.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 And also, Sophie Morgan鈥檚 campaign that she鈥檚 working on to improve the aviation industry for disabled people. I mean she鈥檚 been everywhere. She was on 大象传媒 Breakfast this morning. She鈥檚 got this letter that she鈥檚 urging everyone to go onto Disability Rights UK, download and sign and send to your local MP. Accessible bathrooms, wheelchair spaces on planes, amongst many other issues.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Stuff we鈥檝e been banging on about since we started last April, and will continue to go on about until changes are made, I reckon.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 If you want to get in touch with us, you can do that in all manner of ways. Tell us what you want us to look into. Do you want us to talk about waxing more?

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 No.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 You can get in touch via WhatsApp, 0330 1239480. Or you could email us like apparently Skippy, Ian Cook and others have. Our address is accessall@bbc.co.uk We can鈥檛 answer everyone, but I promise you we will read every message we get.

MUSIC-听听听听听听听听 Access All

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Hello. Come on in. It鈥檚 my favourite bird off the telly. How are you? She鈥檚 looking dead cool again, Ems, that Rosie Jones.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Of course she is. What else would she be looking?

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Wet your cans on, girl. Thank you for coming in again.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 I feel like we can talk for hours.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 I know. I know.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Yeah.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 My mission in life is to at some point catch you for a bevvie.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Exactly. Oh my goodness, how are we here again and not in the pub?

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 She has a got a very good booty, Emma.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Who? Rosie?

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Me!

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Yeah, she鈥檚 got a great bum.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Fun fact, only one bum cheek has she got, because of how I walk I really turn out one bum cheek. So I could get half a 鈥楻ear of the Year鈥�.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Just half?

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Yeah.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 You know honestly Ems, there鈥檚 an actual thing in this, because I鈥檝e got quite a good bum and it鈥檚 very big and it鈥檚 very high, right, and people see me and they鈥檙e like, 鈥淥h my goodness, your bum is like amazing鈥�. It鈥檚 because of how I used to walk always on my toes.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Yeah.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 It was like I was in high heels from a baby.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Yeah. Yeah.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 I have no bum. Maybe that鈥檚 because I鈥檝e never had trouble walking.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Yeah. You need to have problems walking.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Acquire a physical disability, love!

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Then you would have a cracking arse.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Okay. Okay.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Right, shall we do it? We are now with comedian, writer, author, actor, legend. She鈥檚 telling me to keep going, keep going.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Keep going.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 It鈥檚 only Rosie Jones. Rosie Jones is back with us.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Hello.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Hello, Rosie. Let鈥檚 start with the tour, because the tour is coming. How are you feeling about it?

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 I鈥檓 feeling good. It鈥檚 interesting because this will be my first ever tour, which people are surprised about. But I鈥檝e really only been doing comedy for six years, and two of those were wiped out by a pandemic. So, yeah I鈥檓 excited. I鈥檓 a little bit scared.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Do you think a lot of comedians feel that way though? People paying to see you, there is a lot of pressure on that.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 I鈥檓 constantly frightened that internalised ableism and going out thinking of a comedian stereotype that I grew up with, which was male, non-disabled, straight, loud, talking really quick. And when you come to see me, sure you don鈥檛 get fast paced jokes, but I guarantee you will laugh a lot. So yeah, I mean I guess being a woman you do have imposter syndrome, but then you go, 鈥楴o way. 听I work hard and I鈥檓 worthy of my own tour鈥�.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Yes. And you鈥檝e worked so hard. If you think about it, you鈥檝e probably been on more shows that Romesh Ranganathan. That鈥檚 the right pronunciation, isn鈥檛 it?

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Yeah.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Lovely Romesh, I love him. I was the Weakest Link and he was very nice to me. I was first off.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Oh no.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Yeah. But you鈥檝e been on so many shows. Do you think there鈥檚 a flipside to that, that other comedians might be looking thinking, 鈥楾hat Rosie, she鈥檚 on everything. She鈥檚 nicking all the jobs鈥�.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 All the disabled comedian jobs.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 That鈥檚 it. And actually selfishly I like that, because it鈥檚 bought me a lovely house. I鈥檓 very rich. I feel like there鈥檚 several different answers I could give. Yes I鈥檓 on TV, I鈥檓 on the radio a lot, but by me going on those shows and using my platform, it鈥檚 my hope and my dream that I can encourage more disabled people to come into the industry. I don鈥檛 think I鈥檓 taking jobs from other disabled people. We鈥檙e still unfortunately at a stage where they鈥檙e getting either me or another white, straight, non-disabled person. So it is my ultimate dream that I can go on a panel show and be amongst two/three/four other disabled people. But right now we need more people to join comedy.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Yeah. So you鈥檙e in the door, you have a platform, and you鈥檝e also used that for political reasons and gone on Question Time. Is that a good thing for a comedian to do? What was your experience of Question Time?

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 I鈥檝e done it twice now, and both times I started trending on Twitter from all the abuse I was getting.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Oh, Rosie.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 What were they saying to you?

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Literally every ableist abuse under the sun. They told me that I should be in a cage.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 What?!

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 I shouldn鈥檛 be on TV. I should die. And it was because I was exposing myself to a different kind of audience. I think Question Time is brilliant, but it attracts a lot of angry people, and not only being female, disabled, gay. So, would I do it again? Yes. But I would go in there more prepared. I鈥檇 probably shut my Twitter down for a few weeks. But yeah, it is hard because I will always be political, I will always speak for what I believe, I will always champion diversity. But it鈥檚 hard, and it鈥檚 exhausting.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 When we were talking about it before, I find that really upsetting actually that level that you got. When we were talking about it as a team I was like, 鈥淥h yeah, when I first went on Watchdog I got told that I had eyebrows like McDonald鈥檚 golden arches鈥�. Do you know what I mean? It was the visual kind of stuff. And Nikki Fox looked strange. But that level, that must have been hard.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Yeah. And I think being a woman and being gay means that every time I鈥檓 on TV I鈥檒l get a comment about what I sound like, my disability, my weight, and then what I look like, my teeth, my hair, and then the gay stuff. And what is awful, is every single one of those negative thoughts, I can go on social media right now and a stranger will be saying them back to me. So you鈥檙e right, yeah, whatever thoughts you鈥檝e ever had, I鈥檓 here to say you鈥檙e right. It鈥檚 so hard.

I鈥檓 trying to bring this back to my normal positive self, but it鈥檚 on my mind quite a lot, because I鈥檓 currently filming a documentary about online abuse and ableism, and that has been quite hard for me because a lot of the things that I鈥檝e shut away, mashed over, I鈥檝e had to confront. And because of that, I鈥檓 in therapy. I would recommend therapy for literally everyone out there, because I鈥檓 really dealing with a lot of internalised ableism and things that I probably painted over with a joke. But what I will say is, by talking about this I feel a lot of release, and it鈥檚 actually going. I am [inaudible], I am not that over-optimistic, eternally happy human being who goes, 鈥淚 love being disabled every day鈥�, because I don鈥檛 because society wears me down. I now think in order to eradicate that, in order to face the abuses, I鈥檝e got to come here and go, 鈥淵ou know what, it鈥檚 not okay鈥�.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Oh Rosie.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Oh my god, you鈥檙e fabulous.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 I know. Even as a child I鈥檇 be like, 鈥淵eah, I love being disabled鈥�. When鈥檚 the tour? When does it start?

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 It鈥檚 starting next week, 3rd March.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 That鈥檚 my birthday!

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Oh, good!

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 You must have felt under some pressure to make all the rooms accessible this time after people jumping on your head.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 My production company had to ring up every venue and say, 鈥淩ight, what can you do?鈥�, and any venue that said, 鈥淣o we can鈥檛 do that鈥�, we were like, 鈥淩ight, Rosie won鈥檛 go there鈥�.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 See you later, Alligator.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Yeah.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 You see, that鈥檚 good. These things that you鈥檙e doing, just literally touring will hopefully change certain things, because it might make venues think twice.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Yeah. Just chip, chip, chipping away.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Chip, chipping away. And do you have rider, Rosie Jones, is what I want to know? What鈥檚 in your rider?

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Oh my god, it says the most embarrassing thing.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Go on.

ROSIE-听听听听听听听听听 Cup of tea.

MUSIC-听听听听听听听听 Music

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 That鈥檚 another show over. I鈥檓 off to sneak in a full body wax.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 And I鈥檓 off to make some belated disability friendly pancakes.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Oh lush. You can subscribe to us on 大象传媒 Sounds, look for Access All, and if you like us just tell everyone you know.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 And top tip, if you鈥檝e got the 大象传媒 Sounds skill on your smart speaker say, 鈥淎sk the 大象传媒 for Access All鈥� and it鈥檒l play you the latest episode.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 How smart is that?! Until next week everyone.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 Goodbye.

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 Bye.

MUSIC-听听听听听听听听 Music

NIKKI-听听听听听听听听听听 What is a disability friendly pancake, Em?

EMMA-听听听听听听听听 I think it鈥檚 one you don鈥檛 have to toss, maybe?

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