大象传媒

Access All 鈥� Episode 99

Presented by Emma Tracey

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EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Hello, Access All listeners. It鈥檚 Emma here. And I just wondered if you have watched The Assembly. It鈥檚 an unusual format for a TV show I think. It鈥檚 Michael Sheen, the Welsh actor, very famous, and he鈥檚 in a room full of neurodivergent people and people with learning disabilities asking him questions. Here鈥檚 a clip:

[Clip]

FEMALE-听听听听听听听听 Welcome to The Assembly. Our collective of autistic, neurodivergent and learning disabled interviewers. We are delighted to have you joining us today. Our rules are: no subject is out of bounds [laughter]; no question is off the table [laughter]; and all might happen. Please tell us who you are.

[End of clip]

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 it really feels like Michael Sheen is all in with this from the start. He walks into a room full of people who are going to just ask him any question they like. I don鈥檛 know how much preparation he was given. I don鈥檛 know if he got any questions in advance. It doesn鈥檛 really feel like he got any questions in advance because he answers really authentically I think, and the questions are asked really authentically in lots of different ways. There鈥檚 a guy who just asks him whether he likes different superheroes, and he ends up doing a Scooby Doo impression, and there鈥檚 questions about bats and Doctor Who. There鈥檚 a guy who doesn鈥檛 ask his question for a good number of seconds and Michael Sheen waits really comfortably I think, and everyone cheers him on. And then there鈥檚 this question:

[Clip]

FEMALE-听听听听听听听听 Okay, this question is a bit intense, so.

MICHAEL-听听听听听听 Okay.

FEMALE-听听听听听听听听 How does it feel to be dating someone who鈥檚 only five years older than your daughter? [Gasps from the crowd]

[End of clip]

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 I mean, I do love that they get right in there into Michael Sheen鈥檚 love life. I quite enjoyed that. But I just wondered whether it鈥檚 something you think could fly, whether there should be a series of this. Who should be in it? Who should ask the questions? Who should answer the questions? Maybe we should have our own Access All assembly. Who should our guests be? Ooh, the possibilities are endless. On with the show!

MUSIC-听听听听听听听听听听听 Theme music.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Hello, and welcome to Access All, the 大象传媒鈥檚 weekly disability and mental health podcast. I鈥檓 Emma Tracey and I鈥檓 in Edinburgh this week, which is really, really nice. I鈥檓 going to be talking to Ashley Storrie who鈥檚 the main character in a new 大象传媒 drama, Dinosaur, where she plays an autistic palaeontologist. How cool is that? I鈥檓 also going to be talking to disability consultant and writer, Sam Renke, about a podcast clip that鈥檚 been all over our social media feed and has upset a lot of disabled people this week.

听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 You can contact us by email accessall@bbc.co.uk. And don鈥檛 forget to subscribe to us on 大象传媒 Sounds or wherever you get your podcasts.

听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Disabled people鈥檚 social media feeds have been full this week of people commenting in disgust at some comments made on a podcast called Low IQ, with Cole Anderson-James and Jack Joseph. The topic they were talking about was whether hypothetically they would stay with a girlfriend who had been badly injured and become a wheelchair user. Here鈥檚 a clip, and it does contain some distressing language:

[Clip]

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 If she was hit by a car and she was, like, completely mangled would you?

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Would I what?

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Stay with her?

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Yeah.

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Same.

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Would you?

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Yeah, yeah.

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 You wouldn鈥檛?

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Why?

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Because you care about looks so much.

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 I don鈥檛 care about looks [laughs].

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Because you鈥檙e saying mangled people aren鈥檛 attractive, if they鈥檝e been hit by a car they鈥檙e not attractive?

MALE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听 No, I鈥檓 saying I would. But I think you would care too much about your鈥�being next to someone and, like, holding hands in public because you鈥檇 be like, oh everyone鈥檚 going to think I鈥檓 grim now.

[End of clip]

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 People have also been writing about this clip on X. Here鈥檚 a flavour of what they鈥檝e been saying:

FEMALE-听听听听听听听听 Let me be clear, I鈥檓 not mangled; neither is it grim to hold my hand. I am strong and independent, just like every other disabled woman you objectify with your sickening words. Every day we face our disabilities, and the stigmas that accompany them head on.

FEMALE-听听听听听听听听 It鈥檚 important to remember that health is in no way guaranteed and you could become disabled at some point, whether it be from an accident, illness or old age, our health can deteriorate. Would you then view yourself as mangled and grim?

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 With me to talk about this social media furore is writer, presenter and disability consultant Sam Renke. Hi Sam.

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Hi, lovely to be here with you.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Sam, what鈥檚 your reaction to this clip that鈥檚 been all over the internet?

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 I wasn鈥檛 shocked because this is something that I can across regularly. But I was angered because I think, although we shouldn鈥檛 play, you know, a game of Top Trumps when we鈥檙e talking about disability, I often think that if that word, and I鈥檓 going to use the word they used mangled, was another derogatory term to talk about another under-represented marginalised group there would have been a lot more outrage. The video would have been absolutely bannered. I actually reported it myself, and it was still up there for a very long time. So, it鈥檚 said, it鈥檚 not surprising.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 The men in the clip did pull back from what they were saying by the end. They said that they would stay with a girlfriend, that they鈥檇 have no problem. They鈥檝e definitely pulled back from what they originally said. But they did use terms like mangled and grim, you know, pretty distressing language. Do you think that that should be illegal to say these sorts of things in a podcast, and considered hate speech?

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 I actually think it is ableist hate speech. And unfortunately when we talk about disability and inclusive practice, when we鈥檙e talking about the law, disability is still very much at the lower end of the pecking order, so to speak.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 So, should what they鈥檝e said be illegal to say?

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Yeah, I think it should have been absolutely taken down immediately. But again, I see a lot of words still used in mainstream media. Some of my favourite programmes still use the 鈥楻鈥� word quite flippantly. So, where is this disconnect? How can we bridge that gap? Where are we failing disabled people? Why are we not taking it as seriously as we would any other hate speech or discrimination?

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 I know you have strong feelings about this needing to be illegal, Samantha. But we did contact the 大象传媒 duty lawyer for the legal stance and this is what they told us: 鈥淭here is no standalone hate speech offence relating to disability, unlike for race, sexual orientation or religion鈥�. How typical is this sort of language on the internet and in the media, and this sort of, I mean, behaviour I want to say? How typical is what they said? How often do you see it?

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 From my own experience, you know, this did come down to lads trying to, you know, get that attention. I went from an experience when I鈥檝e had my own dating, a lot of ableism, a lot of horrible misogyny when it comes to my own disability.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 In what way? What have you experienced?

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 I mean, from the very basic groups of lads when I used to go clubbing and partying when I was much, much younger, egging one another on to go and flirt with me or go and give me a snog, and then laughing about it, talking, pointing, taking sneaky photos. To then making really, kind of, offhand comments on online dating or just any online forums, very, very inquisitive about my ability to perform sexually, that association that wheelchair user means not being able to have a sexual relationship. To before the pandemic experience a sexual assault and having my wheelchair weaponised against me.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Would women talk about men like this, do you think? Would women talk about disabled men like this?

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 I don鈥檛 know. There鈥檚 probably some women that would. But I think there is quite a toxic culture amongst men who want to be the lad, who want to get the joke. A lot of the content that I see online is taking the Mickey, so to speak, out of petite statured women. And all of it comes from men. Now, I鈥檓 not saying all men behave like this, but there seems to be a real laddish culture to kind of get those cheap thrills, to get that reaction from their peer group.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Do you think the level of online hate towards disabled women is actually increasing?

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 I think we鈥檙e probably more aware of it because of social media. I couldn鈥檛 probably say that that鈥檚 increased. I鈥檓 not a sociologist, so I鈥檝e not seen any hard data on that. But I definitely think that there is a negative culture when it comes to men and how they objectify women across the board.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Do you think that the explosion of social media has something to do with this, so TikTok in recent years? And also maybe that this is young men鈥檚 backlash against maybe what they see as too much diversity or, you know, wokeism and it feels like their power is being taken away somewhat?

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 I think every human being can have intrusive thoughts. I鈥檓 a true crime fanatic, or sometimes I鈥檝e had visions of running over someone in my wheelchair that I don鈥檛 particular like [laughs]. But them intrusive thoughts they pop into my mind and they dissipate very, very quickly. And I think what social media has allowed people to do is to share those intrusive thoughts; but they then get validation, and this validation by the likes, by the comments, by that mob mentality I guess, by that peer pressure ultimately sends this message that oh, okay, so to begin with I knew that that wasn鈥檛 the appropriate thing to say, but now x, y and z, I鈥檝e got 10,000 people saying good on you, this is amazing what you鈥檝e just said. And I think that adds to what we鈥檙e seeing right now to be honest.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 And how do you feel about so many disabled people sharing that clip? Because I hated watching it over and over again. I found it really, really uncomfortable and I sort of was like, I wish people would stop sharing this.

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Yeah, I agree with you, and I was quite triggered by it. I think when that actually, the clip got shared quite a lot on social media, it was just a really heavy time for disabled people. There was a lot in the media going on that wasn鈥檛 pleasant towards disabled people. And I felt a bit of fatigue, I felt like wow, is this the world we live in, are disabled people so hated. But I do say we need to set our own boundaries when it comes to social media.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Yeah.

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Try not to read the comments. I went down that rabbit hole and that made me feel ten times worse. Take regular breaks away from social media. And also go and follow some amazing, beautiful, creative, positive content creators. Get that balance!

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Samantha Renke, thank you so much for joining me.

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Thank you.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 And thanks for such a great discussion on this.

SAM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Thank you.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 We did attempt to contact the makers of the Low IQ podcast, but at the time of recording we have not as yet received a reply. 听

听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 My guest this week is a standup comedian, she鈥檚 a radio presenter, she鈥檚 a writer, and now she is an actor in the main role in top 大象传媒 drama Dinosaur. And she鈥檚 a big deal here in Scotland, but I reckon this role is what鈥檚 going to catapult her on to the actual world stage because it鈥檚 on Hulu in the US as well. It鈥檚 Ashley Storrie. You鈥檙e very welcome.

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 Hello, thank you for having me.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Let鈥檚 talk about Dinosaur. What is about? You tell me.

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 Dinosaur is about Nina, who is a palaeontologist, and she lives with her sister, Evie, who is her best friend and they love each other very much. And Evie throws a spanner into the works by telling her that she鈥檚 getting married to a man she鈥檚 only known for, like, a couple of weeks, which isn鈥檛 enough time. And Nina is distraught. It throws her world into a tailspin. And she has to make this decision of whether she鈥檚 going to be a good sister or whether she鈥檚 going to explain the logic of why Evie is wrong for doing this. And all the while Nina is, like me, on the autism spectrum 鈥� I always forget to say that because it鈥檚 not something I say about myself every time I mention this [laughs].

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 I wanted to jump in and say the reason why she has this absolute need to be so logical about it all is partly because she鈥檚 autistic. We have a clip of exactly what you were talking about there, so let鈥檚 hear it:

[Clip]

EVIE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 I鈥檝e never felt this way, Nina. He鈥檚 my person.

NINA-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 But mum and dad are not going to be happy about this.

DAD-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 We鈥檙e so happy about this.

EVIE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Now, we know that it鈥檚 soon but we鈥檙e thinking summer wedding?

DAD-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Lovely.

NINA-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 That鈥檚 it?

DAD-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 What?

NINA-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 She鈥檚 marrying some man that none of us have ever met and that鈥檚 all you鈥檙e going to say? Dad, what if he chokes women at the weekend?

DAD-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Does he choke women on the weekend?

EVIE-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 No. He鈥檚 in a feminist book group.

DAD-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Well, there you are. We鈥檇 only known each other six months when we got married.

NINA-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Yes, but that was in 1986 when everybody was stupid and you thought that the feathered mullet was an all right hairstyle for men.

DAD-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Oh, I loved my feathered mullet.

MUM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Oh, and he鈥檚 never looked so good.

NINA-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 He looked like Princess Diana.

MUM-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 How long did Romeo and Juliet know each other before they got married? 24 hours?

NINA-听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 They were pretend, and then they killed themselves.

[End of clip]

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 [Laughing] yes, so Nina is being logical there and everyone else is just going on with it. So, you're autistic Ashley, and so is Nina in the drama. Are there similarities between the two of you?

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 I think there are certainly similarities to how we react to things. There鈥檚 a lot of differences; Nina鈥檚 an academic, I am not. I think we鈥檙e similar in that we both kind of see the world the same way and react to the world the same way, and we鈥檙e both sensitive to the same things.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Which isn鈥檛 surprising because you were involved in writing Dinosaur, weren鈥檛 you? What was that process like?

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 I was one of the co-creators on Dinosaur, and I wrote episode three, and I had a lot of overview on the rest of the episodes. It鈥檚 what I studied in university, filmmaking and screenwriting, so it was a dream come true literally.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Tell me a bit about the filming of Dinosaur. It鈥檚 about an autistic person, you鈥檙e autistic. What was the set like, was it really autism friendly? What way did it all pan out?

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 When we first started I was really, really anxious about filming because I thought, I鈥檓 good at masking but then lockdown happened, and my masking skills kind of fell a little to the wayside because I wasn鈥檛 interacting with people and I didn鈥檛 really have any use for it.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 So, you're masking in that you鈥檙e pretending and trying to be whatever people want you to be or whatever?

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 To use a negative word, trying to pretend to be normal [laughter], but that wasn鈥檛 really in my wheelhouse anymore. And I was really, really scared when we went to film this series because filming is a really long day, it鈥檚 like 12-hour days, five days a week, you鈥檙e surrounded by a lot of people, a lot of noise, and I got really anxious what if I can鈥檛 maintain, what if I can鈥檛 hide it, what if I can鈥檛 mask. And I talked to Sarah Hammond, who鈥檚 our executive producer, and I said all this, and she was like, 鈥淲ell don鈥檛. Just be yourself. We didn鈥檛 hire a person who鈥檚 autistic and then think that they wouldn鈥檛 be autistic anymore. That would be strange鈥�. So, it was really nice that she said everybody would accommodate me rather than me trying to accommodate everybody else. And everybody else was given that same level of care. So, there were, like, questionnaires that we filled out before we started filming about our triggers and stuff like that, even the neurotypical people. And we all had access to talk to people if we wanted, and there were safe spaces wherever we went, and everything was just really cool. And I know that sounds like it鈥檚 a lot of work and maybe would slow things down, but we had an incredibly efficient crew and we worked really well with that sort of open dialogue and with everybody kind of being in the same boat, rather than it just being special treatment for me.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Did you feel like you were listened to throughout and the character was developed based on stuff that you were saying? Because I follow you on social media, on Facebook and Instagram and stuff, and you鈥檙e quite open. And there are things that you鈥檝e mentioned about your life over the last couple of years that I actually saw in Dinosaur, so it feels like you were listened to.

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 Yeah, very much so. When it came to specifically things about meltdowns or autism or not even the negative stuff, the positive stuff as well, I was always deferred to. Because I think that when you鈥檙e writing about specifically autism which is such a big spectrum and it affects everybody differently, and people feel differently about their autism, I think that you can only write from a place of honesty and truth, and that鈥檚 the way to make it work. And if you don鈥檛 write from that position it can come off as artificial or like you鈥檙e writing for the neurotypical people rather than the neurodiverse people.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Yeah.

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 And I wanted it to feel real and be authentic, and not be there to just educate other people on what autism is.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Teaching moments.

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 Yeah. I didn鈥檛 want that. And we never really fell into that trap and that was really good.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 But you also have a wider knowledge of autism. How many times am I going to say autism and autistic in this interview? My god. I will talk about other stuff in a minute, I promise. But you kind of have a wider knowledge because your dad鈥檚 autistic as well?

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 Yeah. My dad was diagnosed when I was in school. And I was the first person to say, 鈥淥h, I think this is what鈥檚 going on, papa鈥�. He had been really, really, really, really depressed. Autism wasn鈥檛 even part of conversation at that point. It was very much the idea of autism was a specific thing, and my dad didn鈥檛 fit that sort of 鈥� I hate to use this as an example but it鈥檚 the only thing I can think of 鈥� autism was just seen as this, like, Rain Man thing and that was it, and there was no nuance or spectrum. 听And in school I was studying higher psychology and I got given the Baron-Cohen test, which has its problems, but as I read it I was like, oh my goodness, that鈥檚 my dad, my dad fits all of these categories for the diagnosis of what was then called Asperger鈥檚. And I told him, and then he, he鈥檇 been in his bed for maybe, like, six years at this point, he hadn鈥檛 really got up, he was so sad, and he went to his GP and his GP was like, 鈥淵eah, that鈥檚 what that is鈥�. And it changed his life. He got help, he got support and he just knew, just knowing himself helped him. It was mainly just being able in our household for him to verbalise and understand that what he was feeling wasn鈥檛鈥� Because he would get so angry about tiny things and he didn鈥檛 know why, and he thought he was just a bad person. That was in his head, that鈥檚 the only way he could quantify this irrational irritation at tiny, tiny things. And then when he knew oh, this is autism, I can verbalise, this is just my autism, I鈥檓 fine and I can go away and I can contextualise these feelings I have now, that did more than anything.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 You talked about your household there, there are two autistic people in it 鈥� I鈥檝e said it again, I鈥檝e said autistic again! 鈥� there are two autistic people in your house. I鈥檓 obviously interested because obviously loads of houses have more than one autistic person because often autistic adults have autistic kids. But I always wonder whether the traits and the things that how autism shows up for you and for your dad whether they drive you both up the wall with each other or whether it actually helps having another autistic person in the house?

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 I think it鈥檚 a bit of both. It helps because we can understand each other. But at the same time his needs are more, and more varied. I think that that kind of helped with the writing of Dinosaur because we鈥檙e dealing with the relationship between two sisters where one is neurodiverse and one is neurotypical. And it鈥檚 sort of, like, I鈥檝e had to be the neurotypical person for him to, you know, look after him, and I can kind of see it from both sides: I can see this weird, wonderful brain thing from both angles because I鈥檝e been in both sets of shoes.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 So, how did you get diagnosed then if you were being his neurotypical person for such a long time?

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 It was blatantly obvious to everybody around me. I asked my doctor a long, long time ago. After my dad got diagnosed I went to my GP and he was a very elderly man, and I said, 鈥淚 think I might have the same thing鈥� and he was like, 鈥淢aybe, but don鈥檛 get diagnosed because it鈥檒l affect your ability to get employed in the future鈥�. And I said, 鈥淥h okay鈥�. And he also said, 鈥淧eople like you are just like this鈥� and I thought, okay, people like me are just like this. And then as time went on I was finding more and more stuff difficult, and I remember I verbalised to my friend once, I was like, 鈥淵ou know when you have to get ready to leave the house and you鈥檙e thinking of all the things you鈥檙e going to say and you have to put on a face and you have to prepare yourself and get in character?鈥� and she was like, 鈥淣o, I just leave the house鈥�. And I thought, oh, is nobody else doing this, because the prep it takes for me to walk out the door and interact with people is like the prep for an acting job, is nobody else going into this level of character work for their own personality before they exit the door? And when I realised no I thought I should probably go and speak to somebody about that because I鈥檝e spent my whole life thinking everybody else was doing this.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 And you鈥檝e got a famous mum obviously, Janey Godley, absolutely legend. And she鈥檚 a comedian and has been for a long time. Why did you choose to follow in her footsteps?

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 I didn鈥檛 want to at all. I鈥檇 been working in and around standup comedy since I was 11, touring and looking after her, because my dad couldn鈥檛 do that. And you鈥檒l find with a lot of the festival comedians, not your telly comedians and the people who are making a lot of money, but your lower rung festival comedians who are just doing, like, Edinburgh, New Zealand, Australia over and over and over again, they usually have like a person that they take with them, usually a spouse. And my dad couldn鈥檛 be that for my mum so I had to be that for my mum. And so I would do all of the festivals and help her work. And I just didn鈥檛 want to be a standup comedian; I saw it and I was like, nope, not for me. But it was always something that I knew I could probably be good at if I just tried it. And then eventually I did try it, but it was a big rebellion against it, I didn鈥檛 want to.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 I would say it鈥檚 fair to say you鈥檙e a bit of a cult figure, Ashley, with all of your internet sketches and your standup comedy. How does it feel to be just about to go really mainstream?

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 Scary. Being an underdog is a very comfortable place. You get away with a lot of things, you get to be more inventive and expressive and try things because you know nobody鈥檚 probably going to see it, and that鈥檚 a really nice position to be in because you get to experiment without scrutiny. And I鈥檓 terrified that I won鈥檛 have that luxury anymore. But that鈥檚 the payoff I guess, that鈥檚 the exchange rate of getting any modicum of success. I鈥檇 be really happy if this came out and for a week everybody was like, yeah well done, and then I just went back to my normal life [laughs].

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Oh, Ashley Storrie, it鈥檚 been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for speaking to me.

ASHLEY-听听听听听听听听 Thank you for having me.

EMMA-听听听听听听听听听听听听 Dinosaur will be on 大象传媒 iPlayer from next week. And Ashley also has a radio show on 大象传媒 Scotland, and it鈥檚 on 大象传媒 Sounds as well, every Friday night into Saturday morning, 10pm to 1am.

听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 That is your lot for this week, yes it is. But before I go can I remind you that next week is our 100 episode, and we are asking you to tell us the best advice that another disabled person has given you. And I can tell you we鈥檝e brought together quite a few from you listeners and from our disabled celebs, but we do want some more. So, if you could send them to us on WhatsApp, our number is 0330 123 9480. You could do a voice message or a text message. Please put the word Access before though because that helps us find it. You can email it to accessall@bbc.co.uk. So, that鈥檚 the best advice that another disabled person has ever given you.

听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听听 Thank you to my guests, Ashley Storrie and Sam Renke, and thanks to you for listening. Bye bye.

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