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You have to wonder whether any manifesto Nick and co might dream up would save them from a serious reverse in May. And the same must go for Kirsty's crew. Is there any chance that voters will do anything but apply the Westminster take to the Wales situation? Surely Labour will prosper, but well enough to go it alone? IWJ's plans to extract another step on his road to independence would come unstuck then. I'll be keeping my Cardiganshire coin away from the bookies - unless I see good odds on Elin J being unseated by the badger loving students of Aber....

Wales, like any devolved nation in Britain should have complete freedom to raise their own taxes and demand EU funding as a devolved country.

Unfortunately, until England becomes a devolved nation too, there will be no real progress for any devolved government in Britain.

There will be no progress or real future until England becomes devolved too. So, does any expert out there who knows why England should not be devolved to increase equality for everyone citizen living in Britain and members of the European Union - then please explain?

Surely this is the issue we were deliberating 12 years ago - what happens when we have different parties in power in Westminster and Cardiff Bay but also how do those parties in power in London but in opposition in Cardiff get their square pegs in round holes.

Increasinly the Lib Dems have looked the more uncomfortable of the two parties. Peter Black often blogs support for national Lib Dem policies or his leader's comments but he seems very half-hearted in doing so. Equally Kirsty seems to avoid the subject and merely goes on the attach against Plaid and Labour.

This is of course a huge boost for Labour as traditionally whenever we have a Cons government Welsh voters will not so much run for the hills but the voting booths putting a firm X next to whoever Labour put forward as condidate.

Plaid's dilemma is that with the polls predicting a potentially poor result they might want to promise the earth but of course now know they can't because they could actually be bed-fellows in government once again.

Welsh politics at the moment is similar to watching a car crash in slow motion. You feel helpless while cloaked in a sense of despair and inevitability.

2. "demanding EU funding as a devolved nation" , well the begging bowl worked for Eire for a few years..... oh dear.

I expect this is why the 'rainbow' turned into a puddle last time. So who's left to put the brakes on Labour? Tricky one this. The thought of unrestrained Labour in charge brings to mind the ill-fated first Assembly.

The tail is still stuck to the Tory dog.

The election could prove interesting.

#2 wrote:

'...why England should not be devolved...'

(Wales has had EU funding twice (Objective One) because much of it is impoverished)

I’m not an expert on devolution, but here’s my take on it.

Imo England has the best of both worlds under the current system, even though it’s a real muddle – a dog’s dinner. It effectively has its own parliament with the full range of powers, monetary and fiscal, in which it has a majority of 533/116 over the other nations and NI.

Labour avoided the West Lothian question whilst in government, and I’m pretty sure that the Tories won’t deal with it head on, either. It’s a poison chalice.

The creation of an English Parliament could take one of two forms. It could sit at Westminster, using the 533 MPs it has now. That would imply different tiers of member, since the levels of devolution in Scotland, Wales and NI differ. It would be complicated to work out who would be entitled to vote on each bill, particularly in the case of Wales’ MPs. It would be difficult if not impossible to operate in practice.

A simpler solution would be the creation of an English parliament from scratch, as in Scotland. In that case the four devolved institutions would require the same powers. England would probably end up with a less powerful parliament than it has now or cede much more power to Scotland and Wales. That would necessarily be a federal system, requiring a written constitution and probably the end of parliamentary sovereignty. Highly unpalatable to Unionist politicians of the three main parties.

It would also require a federal parliament which would be dominated by England’s members, therefore Scotland, Wales and NI would be stuck with England’s defence and foreign affairs policies in perpetuity. A veto system obviously wouldn’t work as that would paralyse the institution.

Renewal of Trident, or English Eurosceptic MPs voting out of the EU, for example, could result in Scotland and/or Wales leaving the federation, and the break-up of the UK.

An ‘independent’ England would find itself with a lower status on the world stage. It is likely, if not certain, that it would lose its permanent seat on the UN Security Council, for instance. That scenario will never be swallowed by any Tory government and probably not by Labour either. Politicians thrive on power and status, and will fight tooth and nail not to relinquish any of it. They are on the horns of a dilemma if pressure mounts for English devolution. I suspect they’ll have another try at regional devolution instead.

The whole "West Lothian Question" is further muddied by the way funding is allocated to the devolved administrations.

Many "England only" measures currently aren't really that, because the priorities which England apply in England-only areas have a direct consequence for the ammount of funding received by the devolved administrations.

So creating an English parliament without a fundemental rethink of how each of the devolved assembies are funded would be totally unfair.

Agreed Arihfach, and clearly the Tory party in Wales acts like a branch of the English Tory party, until it can break that link and stand on its own feet without having to report to the headmaster then we can't really take it seriously as a Welsh party.

Likewise the Welsh Labour party. Interestingly the Lib Dems have far more freedom than the other unionist parties as its a federal structure. Where it comes unstuck is that it depends on money from the UK party to keep it going....

Which leaves us with Plaid Cymur, the only Welsh party, run from Wales by Welsh people and not beholden to any other party or London based organisation.

#8, Lyn when you write ....

"... Plaid Cymru, the only Welsh party, run from Wales by Welsh people and not beholden to any other party or London based organisation."

... you might have added, "... unfortunately it hasn't an effective policy in any subject area".

... much like the others.

When Betsan writes "Nick Bourne will be able to pull a rabbit out of the hat on something major to attract Plaid Cymru if and when he sits down to talk rainbows after May 5th." ...

... I hope the rainbow is the rainbow that included zippy, bungel the bear and george the hippo, if he thinks he can impose the likes of Ieuan Wyn Jones he will have major grass root problems .......

Re 9

"the likes of Ieuan Wyn Jones" eh?!

Rather telling language from someone who becomes all indignant when others are critical of the role and status of the present British Head of State.

You are wrong Mr Dafydd, not the role and status, it was just the insulting terminology. In the company I work with there is a policy that covers "Harassment and Bullying",it includes "unwanted verbal conduct", the patronising titles and innuendos falls within this particular area which is classed as gross misconduct, and that is as much as I intend to contribute to that line of discussion.

Whether an elected head of state would be preferable to hereditary is quite different.

The expression "the likes of Ieuan Wyn Jones" is used to represent the leadership of Plaid, no-matter who, such an alliance will cause major grass root problems, a fact of Liberal Conservative life.

What we appear to have here is the prospect of Welsh Conservatives bridling at the constraints placed upon them by their brethren east of Offa's Dyke. It would be quite amusing if the Welsh Conservatives become the spur towards the next part of this decade long (and counting) 'process'.

11

John.

I will always remember a certain person in school when ever he couldn't or wouldn't accept someone elses argument or knew he had no coherent argument to put forward.

In other words he knew the other person was right and he was wrong he would always say 'I am not going to contribute to this disscussion any more' and storm of in his petulant way.

Response to post 06 @ 15:00 on 31 March 2011 - 'Bryn_Teillo'.

Indeed, why aren't a member of any elected parliament? Or perhaps you are? Yes, rhetorical questions. Sometimes being outside the political system has more effect on those crustions that cling to the underside of a political ship?

8. At 16:32pm on 31st Mar 2011, Lyn David Thomas wrote:

.....Which leaves us with Plaid Cymur, the only Welsh party, run from Wales by Welsh people and not beholden to any other party or London based organisation.

........................................................................

You mean Plaid Cymur (sic) a party run from a small power base for the benefit of its cronies.

As for the comment "not beholden to any other party or London based organisation". Why then does Plaid always have its begging bowl held out in the direction of London?

Fact on any measure and as a result I W J' economic policies Wales has fallen further behind all other Regions of the UK.

Wales has been badly served by Labour, Plaid, Lib/Dems all of whom have shared power. I am sure that we would be equally badly served by a coalition that included the Tories

What Wales needs is a new political party that serves the needs of the whole of the Welsh electorate.

Sorry for the mistype.... now you suggest a new party, perhaps you would like to start one and tell us what you would do. As the economic powers of the Welsh Government are fairly weak and the structural problems of Wales deep, and the decline has been ongoing for a century perhaps you could tell us what we should do?

Can you justify your cronies jibe?

It seems that election fever is warming up nicely.

So being someone who has never taken any election seriously, I'd just like to say that...."Next May 5th. I shall mostly be voting for someone with the initials JM, who could strangely enough be a man or a woman"
(Apologies to Mark Williams)

Though as the Plaid Cymru candidate in 'my' Cardiff North constituency only occasionally manages to get a few votes more than the Raving Loony party(or indeed UKIP) my usual intention to vote tactically against Plaid may yet again prove difficult.

16. At 10:53am on 2nd Apr 2011, Lyn David Thomas wrote:
Sorry for the mistype.... now you suggest a new party, perhaps you would like to start one and tell us what you would do. As the economic powers of the Welsh Government are fairly weak and the structural problems of Wales deep, and the decline has been ongoing for a century perhaps you could tell us what we should do?

Can you justify your cronies jibe?

---------------------------------------------------------

Yes there has been a decline in the fortunes of Wales for many years. However the decline in the last 11 years is counter to the rest of the UK which until 2008 enjoyed a booming economy. Economic development is a fully devovled area and the record of the WAG in this area is quite simply appalling on any measure you choose to use.

In common with many Regions of England we in Wales have so called Business Ambassadors working in the US and Germany. However the Welsh ambassadors are the worst performing in the UK.

It would be wrong to name names but some simple research will show that one is an ex banker with no international business development experience and a personal friend of several Ministers in the WAG. I hope that this helps.

As for forming a new political party - even the slightest of research will inform you that politics is no longer a matter of priciples and policies (look only at the LIb/Dems - they have neither) it is about money. Look again at the £2m given to the One Wales Commission or the £10m invested in the WRU to ensure their support for the WAG

Perhaps however if you are interested in real politics we could exchange ideas

#18 wrote:

'...there has been a decline in the fortunes of Wales for many years...'

Nay, centuries, if you read the history books.

It's true that if you list the policy areas devolved to Wales that 'economic development' is one of them. It's a misnomer - laughable really. If your local garage only had a screwdriver to dismantle and rebuild your car's engine, you'd think it a joke, but that's all Wales has, a bit of money to spend here and there, trying to paper over yawning chasms in the economy due to centuries of neglect.

Regrettably, 'economic development' does not equate to the 'economy of Wales'. The development of a country's economy requires the full range of fiscal and monetary powers, and even then, there is no guarantee of success. The UK government has those powers, yet the UK economy, particularly the manufacturing sector, has been declining ever since 1914. Government expenditure alone is never sufficient to stimulate any economy.

The Welsh Assembly Government has no fiscal or monetary levers at its disposal. Those remain at Westminster. Until 2007 it didn't have any legislative powers, and even then had to ask Westminster's permission to legislate regarding Wales' native language. Unbelievable, but true. What other nation or country would tolerate that?

Successive Labour and Tory governments have failed to stimulate Wales' economy and have allowed its infrastructure to decay through lack of investment - for generations. It's only fair to say that other parts of the UK have similarly suffered. The decision not to electrify the main railway line to Swansea is an excellent contemporary example of the UK government's cavalier attitude to Wales.

'.. the UK which until 2008 enjoyed a booming economy..'

We now know that it was a false boom, a bit like a bubble which burst. It was built on ever greater and unsustainable levels of debt, mainly created by the banking sector which either bought large amounts of bad debt from the US or lent money to people who couldn't afford to repay. Remember the 110% mortgages, up to seven times annual salary? Huge bonuses were paid to staff who sold them. Crazy.

Now, we are all including the people of Wales, paying heavily for the City of London's folly, and the UK government's failure to regulate the banking sector. Btw, there is absolutely nothing to stop it happening again. The UK is basically reliant on gambling in the money markets for its recovery.

And you have the audacity to place the blame on the WAG for the state Wales is in, whilst providing no evidence to substantiate it?

I'm not an apologist for the Assembly and the WAG. They both - weak institutions - were the creation of New Labour, and have been dominated by Labour since 1999. It's a party which has failed Wales badly for over a century, despite tremendous loyalty from the people of Wales in the ballot box. It has not done a good job of running the devolved areas, particularly health and education.

Wales has no prospect of developing it's economy until it breaks free of the dead hand of Westminster and Whitehall. Prosperity and wealth flow into London and the south east of England. That's all that really matters to the establishment which holds perpetual power, regardless of the party label over 10 Downing Street.

*19 wrote

And you have the audacity to place the blame on the WAG for the state Wales is in, whilst providing no evidence to substantiate it?.

---------------------------------------------------

Yes I am happy to tell the truth (or have the audacity to place the blame on the WAG).

Fact in every area of devolved power Wales is underperforming English Regions.
Look at the tables
Longer hospital waiting time in Wales
We wait longer for an ambulance
We are five time more likely to die following a stroke than our fellow Uk citezen who live in England
Wales has the worst performing education system
Wales has the worst record of business development.

I could go on and on

You might not like the proof but it is there for eveyone to see - you just have to open your eyes. And yes the WAG has had the time to address the issues but in particular under Labour/Plaid the Welsh nation has gone backwards.

No one expects long term manufacturing decline to be resolved in 11 years but we can expect critical reports (dating back over 6 years) about the response to stroke victims to be acted on quickly and decisively

Playing the victim (a favourite role of Plaid) does nothing to explain why English regions perform better than Wales - particularly as you say prosperity and wealth flow into London and the south east of England

19

Bryn

The UK economy is booming for some.



and the Government will use any means to make the most vulnerable be blamed.

#20

Your comment (#18) was about economic development and I responded to that. I'm not here to defend the WAG's failings or shortcomings in the areas of responsibility it has. Read my comment carefully and you will see that. You wish to lay the blame for all Wales' ills on devolution, and that is simply untrue and unfair.

English regions are the responsibility of Westminster, which has all the tools required to address economic decline, yet it has failed in the north and south west. The WAG had/has none of those powers.

And yes, Wales has been the victim of generations of under-investment and neglect, and it continues, and will continue. The people of Wales, regardless of political affiliation or preference have to take responsibility for their own country if any progres is to be made. We've left it to others and the result has been the mess we are in today.

In reality, Wales has been run by Labour both in London and in Cardiff for the past eleven years. The Tories are another story, their core support lies not in Wales or Scotland so we can expect the minimum from them. Rail electrification stopping at Cardiff is an example of that, togther with the appointment of the MP for Amersham as Wales' Secretary of State. That really says it all. Utter contempt.

The Labour-created and dominated WAG still, even with legislative competence clarified, remains pitifully weak. Only a strong Wales-based government can begin to rebuild Wales' economy and bring prosperity to its people.

In the final analysis I blame us as a people for being in the state we're in. We have to get off our backsides and take responsibility.