大象传媒

I suppose we have to accept that the cuts to the military capability are necessary though it does seem sad and perhaps even dangerous, considering what happened just before World War II. The previous government and some of its cronies have a lot to answer for in this respect.

mim

in 1789 amid the turmoil of the French Revolution we in this sceptered isle thought it would all be repeated here but we are made of sterner stock and we always brutally supress civil revolution with an 'ernest vigour' as a scribe described. The miners, in their tea shirts and trainers felt the same 'justice' by police on horseback, the strikers at Grunwick and the Poll tax rioters all felt the heavy hand of establishment action, and so the motley goes on. The French can close down the country in a matter of hours but they had a revolution and even then way back in 1789 they knew that a Royal household held no relevence to society, they were seen as leeches and had to be eradicated, yet we persist with the same old routine when an out of date Germanic stock can still hold authority over we as people. We cannot vote them out yet they are from another age and they do not contribute and in these austere times we are all supposed to 'contribute' aren't we? Why should bigwig army duffers try to save long out of date regiments from the axe? Why should a field admiral get more in a pension than a nurse in her entire career? Why are we still trying to punch above our weight when it is the Americans, the Chinese and the Russians who are the 'real' gameplayers. We are an ofshore island of whom the world knows very little...and we should deal with it.

As you watch images of tanks, planes and ships today, bear in mind how much each soldier, pilot and sailor gets in their wages/salary, and how much goes on the tanks (4 million Euros each), planes (about 45 million pounds each and ships (well, look it up). Remember when Leyland (makers of Challenger tanks) was British Leyland? In the old days, taxes went into the Public Sector and the government managed the economy as they were elected to oversee the Civil Servants who in turn managed the state aka Public Sector which is where the people worked. One of the great sleights of hand post 70s has been to get you, the public, to focus upon the brave people in the tanks, planes, ships, hospitals. schools etc., and not on where most of the money which goes into them (excluding the labour intensive public services like schools, prisons etc) is actually going, namely straight through the Public Sector into Private Sector shareholders and business owners pockets.

Just think how much has been privatised over recent decades. Also give a thought or two to the amazing fluid complementing between the media profession and modern politics/civil service.

Something for Rev Jackson to think about?



A famous Civil Rights pioneer, and one whom Lenin regarded as subject to a type of politics known as Infantile Disorder



See Left communists (anarchists) and libertarians - you may be surprised.

...the UK will have aircraft carriers with no jet fighters until 2020

...

if we can do without them for 10 years then they are not strategic. which means we don't need them. ie we don't need the new ones.

#5 Jauntycyclist

"if we can do without them for 10 years then they are not strategic. which means we don't need them. ie we don't need the new ones."

Very possibly. Even most probably. But what we shall apparently need is
a) to make good the initial investment
b) to ensure SOME of the jobs in the construction/fitting thereof.

There is always a BUT to every good idea.
I am wondering if at this stage it might be possible to convert the new AC's into floating prisons/schools/palaces?

#5

Do you mean, jaunty, that the ones which started to get cooked up around 25 years ago will do?

"is there a capability gap"

Not sure, but there certainly is a culpability gap!

There was a poster here 'gnu' who knew
That a formation new which seems to have more of a clue
Was up in the air, and still is with quite a bit of fizz
Making people think, as well as feel,
Transporting them to a few pastures and areas new
And taking them somewhat aback.
P.S. The FORMAtTION is White and Black.

mim

We're all spending! We're all trying to get it back on track! When does it stop?!?

I've written about in a positive light - here's hoping the drops in the ocean are raising the water level. Oh wait! No - the ice caps!

I'm not sure of anything any more!

#10.

In some ways that's the way to be, as long as one's sure of one's heart, that is not wanting to deliberately inflict harm on anybody.

The famous till this day the phrase of Socrates who lived, thought and discussed things so many centuries ago, 'I know that I know nothing' still seems to ring true.

6

..to ensure SOME of the jobs in the construction/fitting thereof...

make a dogs breakfast of defence for a few stupid jobs? it would pay the state to have them do nothing but make models than to fracture the intellectual integrity of defence with pointless big ships that admirals agree would be sunk in 5 minutes if used against a state.

Peston wrote

...When I ask senior military, as I did last night and last week, to construct plausible scenarios in which Britain's giant new supercarriers would be essential for the defence of the realm, these admirals and generals looks slightly embarrassed



When pushed, they mention the possibility of two great powers (not Iran) turning into serious enemies of the UK.

I won't mention the names of those countries (though you'll guess which they are), because those same military leaders hastily add: "of course we'd be insane to even think about going to war against them; we should be building permanent enduring alliances with them; and if we did find ourselves at war with them, the carriers would probably be sunk in five minutes"....

/blogs/thereporters/robertpeston/2010/10/what_a_carrier_on.html

this is a breakfast a dog wouldn't eat. Fiasco if not sabotage. Although that would imply some intelligence behind the actions.

this isn't reasoned cuts its a self indulgent hayekist orgy.

Spending Review

Here's a suggestion to cut money spent in the NHS. I was recently sent a letter inviting me to join a screening programme to prevent a life threatening illness.

On the back of the letter were the following languages

Albanian
Arabic
Bengali
Chinese
Farsi
Gujariti
Hindi
Polish
Portugese
Punjabi
Somali
Turkish
Urdu

My letter stated that as I was registered with a GP and a certain age I was entitled to the test.

Now why a] where all these languages used, and interpreted? and b] why do we treat the world for free?

If this letter is translated in to so many languages there must be many many people living here who have never contributed to the taxes in this country. How can they work if they can't speak the language?

How about people live here 5 years before getting anything FREE!

Why don't we just write MUG on the map for GB? : (

THINKING 15 YEARS AHEAD

Best part of a decade ago, America ATTACKED ITSELF for some 'higher purpose' (9/11). In another decade or so - given the strange forces at work in that unquiet nation, I suggest it is entirely possible THEY COULD ATTACK US. Has that been factored in?

Now that's what I CALL a Special Relationship!

The cat is well and truly out of the bag!

GOOD GRIEF - CAROLINE WYATT SAYS 'NOBODY FORESAW 9/11'

Is there an award for stand-up comedy? Choreography of plane-strikes, demolition strategy and defence neutralization, involved a lot of people. And if reports are true, the 'markets' certainly knew.

Some beneficial acts that ought to come from the ....

Comprehensive Spending Review.

Eighty five per cent taxation on Footballer transfer fees. 90 per cent PAYE tax on each Footballer, including Goalkeepers, whom fails to score at least three goals - own goals included - in each and every football match. 100 per cent tax on transfer fees on players incoming from overseas Football Clubs for more than eighty five minutes.

Withdrawal of all funding from 鈥淔aith鈥� Schools unless the 鈥榝aith鈥� followed is secular.

Withdrawal of any and all state funding from any Agency, Charity, Lobby Organisation or other group that isolates itself in it鈥檚 title, religious affiliations, activities, structures, recruitment or policies from full cultural and community integration and cohesion.

All social support State Benefits to be paid at the same rate as would be paid in the claimant鈥檚 country of origin for the first ten years of residence in the UK. Thereafter one fifth of said prescribed rate to be paid. Alternatively benefits should be paid at the rate of one fiftieth of the weekly UK benefit rate for each year of residency, minus one fifty-second of the rate for each week where any unmarried non-consenting female member - under the age of 21 - of the claimant鈥檚 family spends more than seven days overseas for the purpose of 鈥榬egaining cultural identity鈥�..

Automatic deportation of offenders - including indigenous offenders - for any criminal act that incurs a sentence of more than 10 seconds.

Automatic deportation for any offender - including aforementioned UK born criminals - and his her family for any criminal act involving gang activity where guns, knives or any other offensive weapons, including fashion accessories, are used.

Social Housing only to be made available to couples that have less than 2 point 4 children.

National and International employing Companies to be taxed equivalent to one years wage or salary for each employee made redundant in any one tax year.

Religions to be taxed in direct proportion to the level of any costs that may be attributed to any and all of their negative actions throughout the entirety - plus ten years - of their existence.

State funding to made available for the production of Male Chastity belts. Additionally nine inch bolts, with double locking nuts at each end, should be made available to avoid any claim of sexual inequality.

All language translation services to be withdrawn. Sole exemption being the necessary translation of english regional dialects requiring conversion to 鈥楾he Queen鈥檚 English鈥�. Where this exemption does not apply then male family members to be barred from translating on behalf of any claimant younger than one hundred and twenty three years of age.

All second, third or more residences acquired in the last fifty years by current and ex MP鈥檚 whom have claimed any state funding for said purchases to be sold and all funds in excess of the price of a pint of milk to be donated to the state.

All Restaurants and bars in the Palace of Westminster, and the surrounding W-illage, to be replaced by burger bar previously trading on a Car Boot sale. Additionally, both Houses to immediately introduce a Prohibition Act to operate solely within the Upper and Lower houses.

Permanent withdrawal - from all Public Funded organisations, institutions venues etc - of all supplies of Bottled Water.

Value Added Tax to be applied to lies.

Higher rate Value Added Tax to be applied to vocalized claims of institutional racism.

Administrative savings to be gained from the revocation of all Non Domicile British National鈥檚 passports immediately upon entry to the UK.

Higher Rate Taxation on all incomes and earnings accrued immediately prior to transfer to - for tax purposes - a non UK resident spouse residing overseas.

鈥淒aily Allowances鈥� payments for Members of the Upper House should immediately be changed to a taxable bonus scheme. Any remuneration is to be held in trust for a period of three years beyond the demise of said members and be subject to one hundred per cent inheritance tax. Payments to be disbursed solely on recognisable and positive results.

All MP鈥檚 to forego their salary - and any other unearned and earned incomes including consultancies, media appearances and memoir royalties - and work for an Employer whose pay scale 鈥渕eets the requirement of the National Minimum Wage鈥� for a minimum period of one hundred and sixty eight hours per week. Additionally - in the national interest - Ministers of State and any grade above should work an extra ten hours per week.

Is it just my imagination?

There seems to be a correlation between the level of defence cuts in certain areas and the number of non-coalition HMP鈥檚

Could be wrong of course!

Reduce the foreign aid budget to a big fat zero.

to JA Person

#17
Just picked myself up off he floor from that one. And my sides ache too much to consume my dinner. I see a cave, a fire a bow and arrow and a beast in the woods..........

#18
Not entirely sure that long standing air bases for example were placed strategically enough for that. I'll need a map, lots of nice coloured pins.......

Jauntycyclist quoting the well-connected Robert Peston

"..if we did find ourselves at war with them, the carriers would probably be sunk in five minutes"....

DF-21s no doubt?

Plus 莽a change (plus c'est la m锚me chose).Jauntycyclist?

/blogs/newsnight/2007/10/tuesday_30_october_2007.html

Hayek you say Jauntycyclist? Was he a Greek? Once upon a time, the Newsnight Web Team invited comments. Did they ever read any of them? If they did, did they ever learn anything? Would they ever acknowledge so if they did, or is it just self-centred theatrics within the media, like almost everywhere else these days? A million a year you say? How much for Newsnight?

A silly question perhaps?

"13. At 4:59pm on 19 Oct 2010, ecolizzy wrote:

"How about people live here 5 years before getting anything FREE!

Why don't we just write MUG on the map for GB?""

Because this way the electorate's cry for the NHS to be privatised will be democratically voiced. That way the incumbents can say that they are only doing what their electorate has asked them to do.


14. At 6:08pm on 19 Oct 2010, barriesingleton wrote:

"Best part of a decade ago, America ATTACKED ITSELF"

As suggested before, be careful with those recursive functions.

To add a little humour to a serious point about classes, note the reference here to 'girls' in , but be sure to look up the in the video, observing the location, and the way of thinking in response to the Toronto 2009 incident.

Might the following be any evidence at all of even a slight problem of entitlement? Or is it just our nasty imagination?

Um Jeremy Paxman - the smartphone [how very coy - we all know it was an iPhone] was not the device which recorded the video, as all updated reports have made clear. The phone was used for it's GPS ability, the video was recorded by a HD video camera of a quite standard production.
See:

FUNNY YOU SHOULD MENTION (#22)

Rabbi Whatsisname was on telly this evening saying that they are not the Chosen People. I gather it's just that some are more chosen than others.

Being confused, I had a poke round and found this:

24.html

Still confused

/news/business-11580095

Very interesting debate by Jeremy with Nedzinsky & Barber on strikes by trade unions in France and the UK. As pointed out, people in the UK settle when it comes to salaries.....

It's true, the vast majority of joe public does not care about defence, they do care about health care/education/pensions etc......I agree with Simon Jenkins - the world can police itself :p

THE MIXTURE AS BEFORE

The trail for a week of reporting on 'The Cuts' was overlaid with trendy graphics and backed by musack. An extremely clever (edgy) way to highlight waste. Impressive 大象传媒 - impressive!

#26

While I was rather disappointed by what Simon was saying, Mistress76uk. It seems absolutely vital for any country to keep strong defences as one can never be sure where the next threatening conflict might come from. It's a bit like keeping one's body and mind strong to keep diseases, like infection for example, at arm's length. What was also annoying that he seemed ever so pleased with himself to be spouting what seemed like nonsense to me.

mim

#23

wishful thinking, johnny
it seems to me you're deeding yourself into an ever deeper hole

#27

singie

It really is a very sad state of affairs when the word 'graphics' gets associated with a name, 'the boy's' name, and the word 'musac' with a moustache or a muslim. It seems to me it's not only absurd and idiotic but also insane to the extreme.

#58 from previous page - addendum

It seems to me that the Pentagon is spot on by saying that the media, including the 大象传媒 are giving in far too much into the WikiLeaks type conspiracy 'games'. Although I appreciate that there's more to it than meets the eye, I think it should be stopped. If it is not, I am considering of completely switching off from politics and the 大象传媒.

13 Ecolizzy

#33 Hi Mademoiselle, did your friends father live in the EU, he wouldn't have to pay then.

Of course as a visitor he wouldn't be registered with a GP, so would only get emergency care. I'm surprised he had to pay so much, did he not have insurance. I hope he made a good recovery, and our care was good, what did he think of the NHS?

Once registered here with a GP it opens the door to the entire NHS free, when I use the NHS there are many foreign people, with their interpreters by their side, getting treatment for free.

Aaahhhh those poor little bankers, only getting 8 billion in bonuses

An Alternative?

#29 - i dont understand what you are trying to say.

34. At 09:32am on 20 Oct 2010, ecolizzy wrote:

"when I use the NHS there are many foreign people, with their interpreters by their side, getting treatment for free."

Outrageous! Report yourself to Commissar Phillips immediately!. They're very probably British citizens who just made a lifestyle not to learn to speak English or adopt the decadent British way of life and its culture.

It's probably because you're an fascist ecolizzy! Go with the flow, yet that old miniskirt out and jump on a scooter! Vote anarchist.

#32

Do you, miss, think you desrve one yourself?

#37

'interesting' that, johnny, there is a car parked to right from the chair I'm sitting on, and to the left from Queen's Ice Rink on going out, with the number plate DEE 2.. It 'must' be a coincidence. Or is it?

Sarkozy: Russia to join the EU 2025? It will be Iran next I suspect (if not before).



Let's face facts - the common security threat in the future will be rogue African states with psychopathic/child-like dictators as a consequence of their unreliability under the NPT and the ease of access to nuclear technology brought about by a shrinking world and rapidly spreading libertarianism.


(mods - 38 was tongue in cheek!)

THE EU IS ALREADY A FAILED EXPERIMENT IN MULTICULTURALISM (41 link)

Sarko should have a chat with Mrs Merkel.

Accept and enjoy cultural difference - seek mature leaders and peaceful coexistence (going forward). To achieve mature leadership:

SPOILPARTYGAMES

42. At 1:40pm on 20 Oct 2010, barriesingleton wrote:

Sarko should have a chat with Mrs Merkel."

As they are both heads of EU states I'm sure he will have.

Russia self-deconstructed first, and then it was the turn of the USA/EU.

The Lisbon Treaty required major deconstruction for federalism to work so economically speaking, we bombed ourselves in our own long term best interests. You were always preaching to the converted with you mantra.

I repeat, our security threat lies elsewhere - it's the Dark Continent - 700 million volatile children with access to WMDs. See crime figures in the US. EU and UK for a sample. It's all about arrested cognitive development and behaviour (), which is obvious and genetic, if one can just think about it.

Simon Jenkins had me in stitches of laughter. He was angry alright, "so the Japanese are wasting their money too" or words to that effect. But yes Germany, Japan, Italy, France, Spain, India, China, US, Thailand, etc all have carriers, except Germany, but Germany does have a not inconsiderable navy along with it's other powerful armed forces. Jenkins was completely unreasonable, but hilarious. One thing he did get my time for was saying about world class cancer centre's, (but it does not have to be at the expense of our overall security). But then he said, or arts centre's. Oh dear, from then on, he merely re-confirmed his status as just a silly man. I challenge anyone that a ship is not a fantastic piece of art, even a warship, and the process of making one is something most people could not comprehend. Though, that is not it's job.

Make a dogs breakfast for a few stupid jobs. A flippant remark. But have we not just created over a million pretend jobs over the years, that produce nothing. A shipbuilder would likely say being in the public sector and being un-employed is pretty much the same. Nothing is produced, but one of them has to find their way into an office, and probably earns more.

The thing is, if anyone has been on board the Invincible class, they see they look well used, and worn. The navy certainly gets is value from them. I do not know how the RN will cope, especially if a situation did arise. They will have to rely on other Countries. If you want the armed forces to be able to take on the roles the government has outlined, you need amphibious ships, surface ships, seaborne airborne early warning, with air superiority, strike, cover etc any significant number of vessels needs a carrier. A carrier is a force multiplier which can deter. You need Carriers, as you have done so, along with air power, since WW2.

Why are we still trying punching above our weight. Punching above our weight is a load of rubbish. We do not look at per capita for some reason. Russia will only be around the same size overall economy around 2050, don't be fooled by geographic size. America is in decline, with carriers alone, they have gone from 15-16 in the 80s, down to 13, now 11, in the future probably 10, and China is a communist dictatorship. Say no more.

I do not think what happened just before WW2, was that we had cuts. We embarked on the biggest naval building program starting from 34 and really kicking in at the end of 36. But we did not expect war as soon as 39, which caused chaos to these shipbuilding programs, which is right.

44. At 9:52pm on 20 Oct 2010, Simplemovingaverage wrote:

"China is a communist dictatorship"

Please explain to us how China is a and please show us that you really do understand what you watch and on 大象传媒 Newsnight.

That behaviour is te sort of behaviour which explains why the Chinese get so angry with the arrogance/stupidity of the West. For some context, was the a communist ?

Or might you just be a willing victim of libertarian propaganda which seeks unimpeded (unregulated) access to consumers?

I did not realise anyone had replied to my post, sorry. I feel I better answer this strange reply though.

First, I would not say I am arrogant or stupid, although you were implying that to the western world in general, or assuming that is the case, that the western world thinks like this about China, which in itself could be implied as arrogant and stupid, but I am not judging. I am not really bothered about what they (China) think, because the fact is, they are a single party communist dictatorship that has benifitted from opening up to the west with their very low wages and importing western manufacturing technology, or not really having to develope it themselves, have been able to export to you consumers, which you have lapped up, so they are not stupid either.

It's just an observation, and we do not know what their future motives are, and judging by their actions in Africa, I would say an eye is needed on them. With this, do not go on about our past in Africa which I expect you would, but I am not condoning or judging any actions of the past, including the Government of 1945. What you are referring with your remark about the British Government after 1945 exactly, I do not know, but in national terms, I think the Labour Government of 1945 was probably the direction we should not of taken.

Judging by your unhinged rants in these posts (I do not necessarily disagree with you on some of them), I do not think whatever I say, you will agree with or see that angle. As for the patronising remark about understanding Newsnight. I understand Newsnight fine, and what this program is about, but I do not understand you, and I also think that you, do not understand youself in some cases.