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Adam is putting on his walking boots and heading out into the Cambrian Mountains near Cwmystwyth in search of a bronze age copper mine. The location is the suggestion of Adam’s special guest on today's programme:  John Grattan, Professor of Geo-archaeology at Aberystwyth University.

One of John’s major interests is the emergence of industry in the ancient world. He’s studied copper factory sites in the deserts of southern Jordan and he’s exploring the way technologies, materials and expertise gradually spread from there to sites like the mid-Wales copper mine he and Adam are climbing towards. They also discuss the idea of the ‘factory’ predating the industrial revolution by many thousands of years and the environmental effects of these early factories, leaving a legacy of pollution which is evident even today.

And talking of pollution, we also hear about John’s other major research interest: the atmospheric effects - and health impacts - of volcanic eruptions. John has studied in detail the Laki Fissure eruption in Iceland in 1783 which was probably the biggest single pollution event in human history. It produced a sulphurous fog which killed a quarter of Iceland’s human population and three quarters of its livestock. It’s estimated that more than 20000 people died in England alone as a direct result of the eruption.

As they walk, Adam explores with John the role of universities in the 21st century. John was a late entrant to university and academia and they also discuss his remarkable career path from motorcycle courier to University Pro-Vice Chancellor.